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RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/3/2021 6:32:57 AM   
Mock726

 

Posts: 20
Joined: 12/29/2020
Status: offline 		For what little my opinion matters I would not be in favor of anyone trying to make a WitP2. If you like this game and its scale and format a brand new game should be made from scratch. I have seen too many arguments on other game forums about making updated/new editions of old games and it never works out. Too many fans of old mechanisms who insist they must be retained as is, or changes that must be made in specific ways. A blank slate is the best way to make an enjoyable game that is not tied down in endless comparisons to the earlier versions.

As an example, the Torpedo rule. In what battle did Halsey have to sail his task force around Cape Horn because the only torpedoes in the Allied inventory where at the Norfolk Navy Yard? That is a perfect example of something in the game that does not belong in a game of this scale. Like that old sub simulator game where a common method of losing your sub was the crew starving to death because you as the Captain were not checking the spam supply. Like the cook never mentioned that the sub is running low? Every Allied base above some specific size has infinite torpedoes, easy.

(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 121
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/3/2021 8:58:47 PM   
fcooke

 

Posts: 1156
Joined: 6/18/2002
From: Boston, London, Hoboken, now Warwick, NY
Status: offline 		Which sub game was that? I have all the classic sub games (or at least I think I did). In any case, shortage of torps was a real problem early in the war, and losing the ones in the PI really put a crimp in things. A lot of subs went on patrol with partial loads or mines instead, or mixed loads. Hey - can't do the the mixed load thing in AE - the game is borked!

(in reply to Mock726)
Post #: 122
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/3/2021 9:11:27 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fcooke

Which sub game was that? I have all the classic sub games (or at least I think I did). In any case, shortage of torps was a real problem early in the war, and losing the ones in the PI really put a crimp in things. A lot of subs went on patrol with partial loads or mines instead, or mixed loads. Hey - can't do the the mixed load thing in AE - the game is borked!


You are mistaken my friend. When you send a regular sub out with mines, there is still a torpedo for every tube. There are just no torpedoes for reloading.

_____________________________

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Post #: 123
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/3/2021 9:47:57 PM   
fcooke

 

Posts: 1156
Joined: 6/18/2002
From: Boston, London, Hoboken, now Warwick, NY
Status: offline 		The game is borked! How can you lay mines if there are torps in the tubes? I haven't played in a while but defensive torps would make sense. I have been meaning to start a game again, but even being retired now it seems like there is always work to do. Perhaps I had better time management skills when I was working......

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Post #: 124
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/4/2021 2:00:59 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fcooke

The game is borked! How can you lay mines if there are torps in the tubes? I haven't played in a while but defensive torps would make sense. I have been meaning to start a game again, but even being retired now it seems like there is always work to do. Perhaps I had better time management skills when I was working......


The crew can unload the torpedoes from the tubes and did so to work on them. Sometimes the alcohol would disappear. But just keep one tube loaded and ready to fire while laying the mines.

_____________________________

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― Julia Child


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Post #: 125
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/4/2021 4:59:27 AM   
Mock726

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: fcooke

Which sub game was that? I have all the classic sub games (or at least I think I did). In any case, shortage of torps was a real problem early in the war, and losing the ones in the PI really put a crimp in things. A lot of subs went on patrol with partial loads or mines instead, or mixed loads. Hey - can't do the the mixed load thing in AE - the game is borked!


I believe it was "Gato" on the Atari ST. Mid 1980's.

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Post #: 126
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/4/2021 11:14:25 AM   
fcooke

 

Posts: 1156
Joined: 6/18/2002
From: Boston, London, Hoboken, now Warwick, NY
Status: offline 		That one I do not have. In the mid 80s I was running a C64. The game that got the most use was 'Fleet Strike'. Fun game, and surprisingly good graphics for the day.

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Post #: 127
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/6/2021 4:57:31 AM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
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Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

quote:

ORIGINAL: elxaime

I only asked because they had made a WITE 2 and I was curious. I didn't expect this level of hostility. I won't be posting here again, don't worry.


But have you been to the dark place, when your post is dissed by Alfred and Bullwinkle at the same time?

Jokes aside, I marvel how they had pulled off WITP:AE in the first place. THE FORUM WONDERS.




< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/6/2021 4:58:10 AM >

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Post #: 128
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 2:06:28 AM   
tigercub


Posts: 2004
Joined: 2/3/2003
From: brisbane oz
Status: offline 		I want I want I want...


Tigercub

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Post #: 129
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 12:14:48 PM   
Mifune


Posts: 787
Joined: 4/28/2005
From: Florida
Status: offline 		It has been 10 years in our wanting. Plus 5 years since the last update. The silence from Matrix speaks volumes to our Fan base and desires as game owners.

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Post #: 130
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 1:15:38 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mifune

It has been 10 years in our wanting. Plus 5 years since the last update. The silence from Matrix speaks volumes to our Fan base and desires as game owners.


In all of that time, what have you personally done to make it happen? I mean, start writing exactly what you want and then start writing the code to do it? Or funding such a project out of your petty cash!

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


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Post #: 131
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 2:35:04 PM   
jwilkerson


Posts: 10525
Joined: 9/15/2002
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		Yes, AE was WITP 2 ... so will there ever be an AE 3 ? THE WORLD WONDERS !!?? :D



< Message edited by jwilkerson -- 7/18/2021 4:44:56 PM >

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Post #: 132
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 4:10:24 PM   
NiclasCage

 

Posts: 57
Joined: 9/28/2019
Status: offline 		can't delete

< Message edited by NiclasCage -- 7/18/2021 4:13:26 PM >

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Post #: 133
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 4:12:50 PM   
NiclasCage

 

Posts: 57
Joined: 9/28/2019
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Can't DOD finance this game? Can't Congress legislate that WITP:AE 2 is a national heritage or something? Get Nicholas Cage to promote this new national treasure?



What do you need?

(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 134
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/18/2021 8:42:52 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Yes, AE was WITP 2 ... so will there ever be an AE 3 ? THE WORLD WONDERS !!?? :D


I imagine that at some point in time another good game on WWII Pacific will be made, but I doubt like this one. Maybe something that won't take years to play.

But when it comes to this game I make the same admonishment I always do, 'Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it'.


_____________________________

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In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

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Post #: 135
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 12:05:09 AM   
tigercub


Posts: 2004
Joined: 2/3/2003
From: brisbane oz
Status: offline 		Ok what a war in the Pacific needs! and what it don't need.

1.Army units like in WITE2 land war was by far the poorest part of WITP, WITP AE
2.Production for Japan and Allies can have some power to change things but not take it over.
3.All warships and planes Key.
4.Planes no need to set Altitude air leader does that with experience. spent have my life changing Altitude of planes.(and not like WITE2)
5.Victory Point system similar WITE2 as the one in WITPAE not putting pressure on the Allies at all.
6.Better Graphics and sounds.

Tigercub


< Message edited by tigercub -- 7/23/2021 12:15:33 AM >

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Post #: 136
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 1:46:10 AM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

Ok what a war in the Pacific needs! and what it don't need.

1.Army units like in WITE2 land war was by far the poorest part of WITP, WITP AE
2.Production for Japan and Allies can have some power to change things but not take it over.
3.All warships and planes Key.
4.Planes no need to set Altitude air leader does that with experience. spent have my life changing Altitude of planes.(and not like WITE2)
5.Victory Point system similar WITE2 as the one in WITPAE not putting pressure on the Allies at all.
6.Better Graphics and sounds.

Tigercub


Number 3 already exists in the game - three buttons on the top of the map screen.

Graphics are just eye candy. I'd like to see an overhead tactical map showing ship movements with the ability for the player to give directional orders. Clarity of ship positions would be dependent on visibility and radar. Not sure what I would want for air battles - I have no desire to fly an aircraft.

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Post #: 137
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 2:06:18 AM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

land war was by far the poorest part of WITP, WITP AE


Don't forget PacWar. Then again the game is really about the air/sea war, with the land thrown in just because it had to be, in a way.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 138
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 3:28:43 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi

quote:

land war was by far the poorest part of WITP, WITP AE


Don't forget PacWar. Then again the game is really about the air/sea war, with the land thrown in just because it had to be, in a way.


Well, how is the Naval war depicted in WITE2? That was very important to that theatre.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 139
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 8:05:16 AM   
jdsrae


Posts: 2716
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Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Yes, AE was WITP 2 ... so will there ever be an AE 3 ? THE WORLD WONDERS !!?? :D



Surely not AE3.
Field Marshal’s edition?

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Post #: 140
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 8:08:47 AM   
Maallon


Posts: 196
Joined: 12/27/2020
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

Ok what a war in the Pacific needs! and what it don't need.

1.Army units like in WITE2 land war was by far the poorest part of WITP, WITP AE
2.Production for Japan and Allies can have some power to change things but not take it over.
3.All warships and planes Key.
4.Planes no need to set Altitude air leader does that with experience. spent have my life changing Altitude of planes.(and not like WITE2)
5.Victory Point system similar WITE2 as the one in WITPAE not putting pressure on the Allies at all.
6.Better Graphics and sounds.

Tigercub



1. Land war in the pacific theatre was quite different from the eastern front, there were far less numbers involved and they faced different challenges. So using the more in-depth and complicated land combat system from WITE2 would probably be overkill for WITPAE. It could make sense in China but otherwise you simply tend to not have a massive land war on a wide front in the game.
2. Production for Japan has the power to change the outcome of the campaign, but if they can't defeat the allies in the first few years they tend to get overwhelmed anyway. While production for the allies would be nice, it would ultimately make the allies even stronger than they already are. If I could choose which aircraft to produce as an allied player, let me tell you I certainly wouldn't produce buffalos.
3. As BBfanboy wrote, already exists in the game.
4. Setting the altitude is one of the key mechanics for the air combat in the game and would remove a lot of depth if automated.
5. A sufficiently aggressive japan player can put a lot of pressure on an allied player in terms of VP. But sure, if Japan is contend with only conquering the DEI then the Allies aren't particularly pressured.
6. It is just eyecandy, I would rather have a strategy game with minimalist graphic and in-depth mechanics than the other way around.

All in all you are trying to impose features of WITE2 into WITPAE even though they are very different games. The focus of WITE2 is the land war while the focus of WITPAE is the naval and air war. It is the same as trying to introduce the naval combat system from WITPAE into WITE2, it would be complete overkill.

(in reply to tigercub)
Post #: 141
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 11:31:57 AM   
tigercub


Posts: 2004
Joined: 2/3/2003
From: brisbane oz
Status: offline 		Number 3 already exists in the game - three buttons on the top of the map screen.

yes it does i just want to Keep it.

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Post #: 142
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 11:45:58 AM   
tigercub


Posts: 2004
Joined: 2/3/2003
From: brisbane oz
Status: offline 		1. Land war in the pacific theatre was quite different from the eastern front, there were far less numbers involved and they faced different challenges. So using the more in-depth and complicated land combat system from WITE2 would probably be overkill for WITPAE. It could make sense in China but otherwise you simply tend to not have a massive land war on a wide front in the game.

(i am not saying copy it, but use it a idea for WITP AE 2/3 what ever)

2. Production for Japan has the power to change the outcome of the campaign, but if they can't defeat the allies in the first few years they tend to get overwhelmed anyway. While production for the allies would be nice, it would ultimately make the allies even stronger than they already are. If I could choose which aircraft to produce as an allied player, let me tell you I certainly wouldn't produce buffalos

(not saying get full control of production but a guiding hand in it more for japan than the Allies!)

4. Setting the altitude is one of the key mechanics for the air combat in the game and would remove a lot of depth if automated.
(its not needed waste of time!)
(i not Saying copy WITE2 but use it as a idea!)

< Message edited by tigercub -- 7/23/2021 11:46:47 AM >

_____________________________


You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life

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Post #: 143
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 5:01:05 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

1. Land war in the pacific theatre was quite different from the eastern front, there were far less numbers involved and they faced different challenges. So using the more in-depth and complicated land combat system from WITE2 would probably be overkill for WITPAE. It could make sense in China but otherwise you simply tend to not have a massive land war on a wide front in the game.

(i am not saying copy it, but use it a idea for WITP AE 2/3 what ever)

2. Production for Japan has the power to change the outcome of the campaign, but if they can't defeat the allies in the first few years they tend to get overwhelmed anyway. While production for the allies would be nice, it would ultimately make the allies even stronger than they already are. If I could choose which aircraft to produce as an allied player, let me tell you I certainly wouldn't produce buffalos

(not saying get full control of production but a guiding hand in it more for japan than the Allies!)

4. Setting the altitude is one of the key mechanics for the air combat in the game and would remove a lot of depth if automated.
(its not needed waste of time!)
(i not Saying copy WITE2 but use it as a idea!)


Well, now you have something to do with your time and money. Design, research, code, play test, and repair of the game that you desire. You can do that in a day or two, right?

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to tigercub)
Post #: 144
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/23/2021 7:16:21 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Yes, AE was WITP 2 ... so will there ever be an AE 3 ? THE WORLD WONDERS !!?? :D



I suspect you already know the answer to that one!

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Post #: 145
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/24/2021 12:50:53 AM   
Rusty1961

 

Posts: 1219
Joined: 2/4/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

1. Land war in the pacific theatre was quite different from the eastern front, there were far less numbers involved and they faced different challenges. So using the more in-depth and complicated land combat system from WITE2 would probably be overkill for WITPAE. It could make sense in China but otherwise you simply tend to not have a massive land war on a wide front in the game.

(i am not saying copy it, but use it a idea for WITP AE 2/3 what ever)

2. Production for Japan has the power to change the outcome of the campaign, but if they can't defeat the allies in the first few years they tend to get overwhelmed anyway. While production for the allies would be nice, it would ultimately make the allies even stronger than they already are. If I could choose which aircraft to produce as an allied player, let me tell you I certainly wouldn't produce buffalos

(not saying get full control of production but a guiding hand in it more for japan than the Allies!)

4. Setting the altitude is one of the key mechanics for the air combat in the game and would remove a lot of depth if automated.
(its not needed waste of time!)
(i not Saying copy WITE2 but use it as a idea!)


Well, now you have something to do with your time and money. Design, research, code, play test, and repair of the game that you desire. You can do that in a day or two, right?


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 146
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/24/2021 2:16:53 AM   
tigercub


Posts: 2004
Joined: 2/3/2003
From: brisbane oz
Status: offline 		They want to make it again or not is the only point if they can make money from WITE 2 they can make money with this done right.

Tigercub

< Message edited by tigercub -- 7/24/2021 3:34:59 AM >

_____________________________


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Post #: 147
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/24/2021 7:56:43 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

They want to make it again or not is the only point if they can make money from WITE 2 they can make money with this done right.

Tigercub


If you don't think that this game is done right, then do not play it.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to tigercub)
Post #: 148
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/26/2021 2:11:53 PM   
Rusty1961

 

Posts: 1219
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

They want to make it again or not is the only point if they can make money from WITE 2 they can make money with this done right.

Tigercub


If you don't think that this game is done right, then do not play it.


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 149
RE: War in the Pacific 2? - 7/26/2021 3:18:42 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rusty1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

They want to make it again or not is the only point if they can make money from WITE 2 they can make money with this done right.

Tigercub


If you don't think that this game is done right, then do not play it.




Then according to someone who replied to me:

If you don't think that this game is done right, then play it. Then complain and complain and complain . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


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Post #: 150
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