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Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc

 
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Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/23/2021 8:04:27 PM   
AlbertN

 

Posts: 3693
Joined: 10/5/2010
From: Italy
Status: offline 		Not anything urgent but I've noticed some units of the Germans are motorized and others not, and there is no way to differ them except by clicking into their details one by one.

There are also some infantries that are motorized but have regular icon of INF. (For instance some regiments that are in North Afrika)

Would it be possible to have the wheels icon on Mot.ENG units and MOT.AA units, and to have them in different listing when SUs are called from superior HQs / Units down the line?

Since if I end up assigning a non motorized ENG SU to a motorized division, it will suck on trucks whilst the Mot.ENG already has them.

To be clear I am not asking changes to units, just an immediate, at glance way to detect if this unit in general is motorized or not.
Post #: 1
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/23/2021 8:23:36 PM   
panzer51

 

Posts: 215
Joined: 9/16/2021
Status: offline 		+1 also for artillery (little wheels at the bottom)

(in reply to AlbertN)
Post #: 2
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/23/2021 8:45:13 PM   
jubjub

 

Posts: 493
Joined: 5/2/2021
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: panzer51

+1 also for artillery (little wheels at the bottom)


isn't all artillery motorized?

(in reply to panzer51)
Post #: 3
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/23/2021 10:19:13 PM   
panzer51

 

Posts: 215
Joined: 9/16/2021
Status: offline 		I'm pretty sure I saw some non-motorized units (like K139 or something like that)

(in reply to jubjub)
Post #: 4
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/24/2021 12:51:38 AM   
GibsonPete


Posts: 308
Joined: 11/5/2014
Status: offline 		There are non-motorized artillery units. You should also examine the axis minors. I believe, the vehicles to move these units will come out of the pool. So, a micromanager may want to be careful when assigning units. IMO a non-motorized assigned to a motorized may impact on total MP's available.

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“Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”

(in reply to panzer51)
Post #: 5
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/28/2021 12:40:38 AM   
onlysane1

 

Posts: 16
Joined: 12/12/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jubjub


quote:

ORIGINAL: panzer51

+1 also for artillery (little wheels at the bottom)


isn't all artillery motorized?


Much of Nazi Germany's artillery was horse-drawn, as it was for many countries in that time period. It was the Cold War period that saw nations developing their artillery to be purely motorized and/or self-propelled.

For more reading on Germany's artillery in this time period, I recommend Soldat: Reflections of a German Soldier, 1936–1949 by Siegried Knapp, who was a German artillery officer who participated in the Sudetenland occupation, invasion of France, Operation Barbarossa, and was even one of the last people to see Hitler alive in the Furherbunker, before his surrender and internment in a gulag. A very enlightening read for anyone interested in the Eastern Front.

< Message edited by onlysane1 -- 11/28/2021 12:45:47 AM >

(in reply to jubjub)
Post #: 6
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/28/2021 1:00:20 AM   
AlbertN

 

Posts: 3693
Joined: 10/5/2010
From: Italy
Status: offline 		Most of the horse drawn artillery pieces were the small calibers though and infantry guns; not exactly the larger calibers that in general populate the SUs and that required particularly heavy trucks / tractors to be moved around.

(in reply to onlysane1)
Post #: 7
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 11/28/2021 2:08:09 AM   
GibsonPete


Posts: 308
Joined: 11/5/2014
Status: offline 		AlbertN is correct. Still the game has a lot of nonmotorized SUs and they may need to be placed with the right units to prevent truck assignment issues.

_____________________________

“Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”

(in reply to AlbertN)
Post #: 8
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/19/2021 4:33:08 PM   
DeletedUser44

 

Posts: 397
Joined: 5/27/2021
Status: offline 		This could have easily been accomplished by adopting historical naming conventions.

For example:

275th Pioneer Battalion(mot)

vs

274th Pioneer Battalion

----

This makes it clear to the player which SUs are motorized and not throughout the UI, to include the CR.

There was a valid reason why these historical naming conventions existed. For them to be arbitrarily truncated in WiTE2 is lunacy.

As it is, you have numerous error and inaccuracies of the motorization of SUs across the German Order of Battle, with nothing but a manual, arduous way to verify.

I am inclined to believe that these names were intentionally truncated by Matrix to obfuscate TOE errors and inaccuracies.

(in reply to GibsonPete)
Post #: 9
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 2:47:34 PM   
Great_Ajax


Posts: 4774
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Alabama, USA
Status: offline 		Seriously? Intentionally truncated to obfuscate?

I don't disagree with the OP's suggestion and have already started adding "Mot." in the unit names in the expansion scenarios. This is an item that is on my list to complete as I have a massive OB 2.0 planned that addresses the motorization issue with individual OBs that make distinctions between the two. However, there are almost no TO&E (OB) differences from a motorized and a non-motorized unit except for the motorization flag.

There is no conspiracy to confuse people here. The reality is that the data in this game is on a continual path for improvement. Most of the original OBs that are in the system are from WitE 1.0 and back then, the motorization flag didn't even matter to support units. The massive OB update is on my "to do" list. I have the spreadsheets completed but I am bogged down in working on new scenarios and won't be able to focus on the OBs until I get all of the scenario drafts submitted.

I doubt we will see new icons with motorized artillery, pioneers, etc. but Joel could always surprise us.




quote:

ORIGINAL: Sauron_II

This could have easily been accomplished by adopting historical naming conventions.

For example:

275th Pioneer Battalion(mot)

vs

274th Pioneer Battalion

----

This makes it clear to the player which SUs are motorized and not throughout the UI, to include the CR.

There was a valid reason why these historical naming conventions existed. For them to be arbitrarily truncated in WiTE2 is lunacy.

As it is, you have numerous error and inaccuracies of the motorization of SUs across the German Order of Battle, with nothing but a manual, arduous way to verify.

I am inclined to believe that these names were intentionally truncated by Matrix to obfuscate TOE errors and inaccuracies.



_____________________________

"You want mercy!? I'm chaotic neutral!"

WiTE Scenario Designer
WitW Scenario/Data Team Lead
WitE 2.0 Scenario Designer

(in reply to DeletedUser44)
Post #: 10
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 3:08:35 PM   
Stamb

 

Posts: 1030
Joined: 10/26/2021
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Great_Ajax
...
I don't disagree with the OP's suggestion and have already started adding "Mot." in the unit names in the expansion scenarios.
...

Will it be added to a GC?

(in reply to Great_Ajax)
Post #: 11
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 3:35:09 PM   
Great_Ajax


Posts: 4774
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Alabama, USA
Status: offline 		Eventually is the plan. Having the "Mot" in the name helps me in sorting out the units as well.

Trey

quote:

ORIGINAL: Stamb


quote:

ORIGINAL: Great_Ajax
...
I don't disagree with the OP's suggestion and have already started adding "Mot." in the unit names in the expansion scenarios.
...

Will it be added to a GC?



_____________________________

"You want mercy!? I'm chaotic neutral!"

WiTE Scenario Designer
WitW Scenario/Data Team Lead
WitE 2.0 Scenario Designer

(in reply to Stamb)
Post #: 12
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 3:37:18 PM   
Stamb

 

Posts: 1030
Joined: 10/26/2021
Status: offline 		Great!

(in reply to Great_Ajax)
Post #: 13
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 4:44:28 PM   
GibsonPete


Posts: 308
Joined: 11/5/2014
Status: offline 		Great_Ajax thank you for your past and future efforts towards making this game better than expected. There will always be those who seek conspiracies where they do not exist. As far as icons go, the ones we have currently are fine in my opinion.

< Message edited by GibsonPete -- 12/20/2021 4:45:10 PM >

_____________________________

“Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”

(in reply to Stamb)
Post #: 14
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 5:23:51 PM   
Great_Ajax


Posts: 4774
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Alabama, USA
Status: offline 		Snapshot of the spreadsheet for the OB 2.0 upgrades. You can see that I am planning on addressing the Motorized units.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Great_Ajax -- 12/20/2021 5:24:05 PM >

_____________________________

"You want mercy!? I'm chaotic neutral!"

WiTE Scenario Designer
WitW Scenario/Data Team Lead
WitE 2.0 Scenario Designer

(in reply to GibsonPete)
Post #: 15
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/20/2021 8:20:59 PM   
jshan


Posts: 97
Joined: 6/27/2004
Status: offline 		Great idea.

< Message edited by jshan -- 12/20/2021 8:21:49 PM >

(in reply to Great_Ajax)
Post #: 16
RE: Motorized & Non Motorized ENG, AA, etc - 12/24/2021 12:40:42 AM   
AlbertN

 

Posts: 3693
Joined: 10/5/2010
From: Italy
Status: offline 		On that line - while for Soviets if I've well understood the player will just 'optimize' the artillery units ... Germans have lots of numbered units, but one does not know if they have 105 or 150 inside.

Anything that can differentiate them by sight?

(in reply to jshan)
Post #: 17
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