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No more private assets being built? - 12/26/2021 8:46:00 PM

Foolcow

Posts: 5
Joined: 7/20/2021
Status: offline

I'm 90 rounds into my game, and for the past 20 or 30 rounds, no private assets have been built in my starting zone even though there are plenty of private credits.

The population tab on that zone (2nd on the left) has read "Next: None" for all this time.

The rest of the info on the tab is as follows: Private Jobs: 72,700 Private Funds 24322cr Private food 1548 Income 0.005 cr Private Eco. +928cr -594cr Service Tax 47cr Income Tax 441cr Sales Tax 4cr

What reason is there for them to stop building, or is this a bug?

Post #: 1

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/26/2021 9:01:15 PM

Arralen

Posts: 827
Joined: 5/21/2000
Status: offline

Asset levels vs. city level?
No ressources to build on?

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 2

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/26/2021 9:18:02 PM

Foolcow

Posts: 5
Joined: 7/20/2021
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arralen

Asset levels vs. city level?
No ressources to build on?

The city is level 4.

The zone's current private assets are as follows:
Scavenging 1
Dome Farm III
Light Industry II
Commercial Area III
Schools II
Police Station I
Sewers I
Parks I
Library I
Zoo III
Transport Hub III
Waste I
Casino I

And there are free resources in the zone that haven't been built on. A metal, three water, and a radioactive.

(in reply to Arralen)

Post #: 3

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/26/2021 11:40:26 PM

Voker57

Posts: 78
Joined: 9/19/2020
Status: offline

Are there free private citizens to man more assets?

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 4

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/26/2021 11:56:03 PM

Foolcow

Posts: 5
Joined: 7/20/2021
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Voker57

Are there free private citizens to man more assets?

The city tab says "Populace: 115,600"
The population tab says "Population: 79,300" and "Private Jobs: 72,700"

So it looks like there are 6,600 population available to take private jobs.

However, the workers tab says "Workers: 36,300" and "Public Jobs: 46,400." Could the system be seeing that the free public jobs are greater than available population, and therefore not building private assets on the assumption that they won't be utilized?

(in reply to Voker57)

Post #: 5

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/27/2021 6:50:30 PM

Voker57

Posts: 78
Joined: 9/19/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Foolcow

quote:

ORIGINAL: Voker57

Are there free private citizens to man more assets?

The city tab says "Populace: 115,600"
The population tab says "Population: 79,300" and "Private Jobs: 72,700"

So it looks like there are 6,600 population available to take private jobs.

However, the workers tab says "Workers: 36,300" and "Public Jobs: 46,400." Could the system be seeing that the free public jobs are greater than available population, and therefore not building private assets on the assumption that they won't be utilized?

Perhaps, or just keeps a reserve of private population. Also maybe next choice would be some 10k pop farm and failing this nothing else gets built either. Get some more private pops or tax/underpay them to death.

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 6

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/28/2021 2:24:26 PM

willgamer

Posts: 902
Joined: 6/2/2002
From: Huntsville, Alabama
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Foolcow

I'm 90 rounds into my game, and for the past 20 or 30 rounds, no private assets have been built in my starting zone even though there are plenty of private credits.

The population tab on that zone (2nd on the left) has read "Next: None" for all this time.

The rest of the info on the tab is as follows: Private Jobs: 72,700 Private Funds 24322cr Private food 1548 Income 0.005 cr Private Eco. +928cr -594cr Service Tax 47cr Income Tax 441cr Sales Tax 4cr

What reason is there for them to stop building, or is this a bug?

FWIW, I have also seen this behavior in my most recent game.

_____________________________

Rex Lex or Lex Rex?

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 7

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/28/2021 5:46:19 PM

zgrssd

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline

Do you have population to run any private assets they would want to build?
.005 Private Economy Pay indicates there is a serioues shortage of people to work in Private and Public Jobs.
The Private Economy will not build, if it lacks the people to staff buildings!

(in reply to willgamer)

Post #: 8

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 2:23:53 AM

Uemon

Posts: 112
Joined: 12/11/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Foolcow

quote:

ORIGINAL: Voker57

Are there free private citizens to man more assets?

However, the workers tab says "Workers: 36,300" and "Public Jobs: 46,400." Could the system be seeing that the free public jobs are greater than available population, and therefore not building private assets on the assumption that they won't be utilized?

Yup im pretty sure this is the reason.

Population management is one of the most important aspects of this game; you have to make sure that you dont overbuild industries and resource collection, cause otherwise private sector will suffer and so will your people's happiness in the long run.

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 9

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 12:17:29 PM

zgrssd

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
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quote:

The city tab says "Populace: 115,600"
The population tab says "Population: 79,300" and "Private Jobs: 72,700"

So it looks like there are 6,600 population available to take private jobs.

However, the workers tab says "Workers: 36,300" and "Public Jobs: 46,400." Could the system be seeing that the free public jobs are greater than available population, and therefore not building private assets on the assumption that they won't be utilized?

To figure out those values:
Your total population is 155600. That is what is used for growth calculations and a few other things. But overall this figure is rarely used. The two things it is split into or consists off - public workers and private citizens - mater way more.

36300 of them are Public Workers. The kind you pay. The kind you have to provide food for. The kind that uses the Worker Happiness score. The kind that is kinda like Recruits and Colonists, just that they stay in the City they work in.

79300 are non-Worker citizens. The kind you do not have to pay. The kind that eats Private Food. The kind that can (but does not have to) work in the Private economy. The kind that uses the other Happiness score

46400 the Private Jobs currently availible.
46.4k Private Jobs vs 79.3k non-Worker population is a good figure. It allows the Private economy to pay relatively little, as there are plenty of other people they could hire.

Anciliary Figures:
- A non-public-Worker population of 79.3k, means you need a Private Dome Farm T3 to feed them. 900 private food Produced. 793 used. With the rest availible for stroage and selling to the Traders. That should be about the food situation in the city.
- you have 32900 Private Citizens that could work in Private Jobs. So you still have room for more stuff, even a new Farming Dome community. However be carefull of using them, as the less there are the more the Private Economy has to pay. And thus the more you have to pay workers, to get them to sign up with Public Work.
- of the 46.4k Private Jobs, 39.2k will work in the Private Dome Farm T3. Meaning that about 7.2k work in non-Food jobs. Schools, Police, Factories, Private resource extraction that sort of thing.

< Message edited by zgrssd -- 12/29/2021 12:18:18 PM >

(in reply to Foolcow)

Post #: 10

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 2:56:26 PM

mattpilot

Posts: 65
Joined: 3/8/2018
Status: offline

quote:

However be carefull of using them, as the less there are the more the Private Economy has to pay. And thus the more you have to pay workers, to get them to sign up with Public Work.

Hmm... but on the other hand, wouldn't a high private-economy worker pay be good if your collecting income tax?

(in reply to zgrssd)

Post #: 11

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 3:44:50 PM

zgrssd

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot

quote:

However be carefull of using them, as the less there are the more the Private Economy has to pay. And thus the more you have to pay workers, to get them to sign up with Public Work.

Hmm... but on the other hand, wouldn't a high private-economy worker pay be good if your collecting income tax?

You only get taxes when the Private Economy buys or sells.
You get nothing for the Salary Payments.

(in reply to mattpilot)

Post #: 12

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 3:48:45 PM

mattpilot

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Joined: 3/8/2018
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Really? I thought sales tax was for when they buy or sell, and income tax is for income? So whats the difference between the two?

(in reply to zgrssd)

Post #: 13

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 3:59:55 PM

zgrssd

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot

Really? I thought sales tax was for when they buy or sell, and income tax is for income? So whats the difference between the two?

Sales tax is when they buy something from the traders (the traders are selling them something).
Income tax is when they sell something to the traders (it is income for the Private Economy).

< Message edited by zgrssd -- 12/29/2021 4:00:32 PM >

(in reply to mattpilot)

Post #: 14

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 5:24:18 PM

eddieballgame

Posts: 676
Joined: 6/29/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot

Really? I thought sales tax was for when they buy or sell, and income tax is for income? So whats the difference between the two?

I, highly, recommend reading the manual per taxation;
starting @ 5.3.14. Taxation...very thorough.
Per raising salaries, I would not say you get nothing.
Increasing the morale for the soldiers, for example, is a nice & important benefit.
Keeping your council, somewhat, agreeable is also a good thing.
Though there are some, based on their ideology vs yours, who just can't be appeased for an extended amount of time no matter how many credits you throw at them.

(in reply to mattpilot)

Post #: 15

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 7:42:21 PM

mattpilot

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Joined: 3/8/2018
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Thanks for that - i did look over the manual again, but i guess it got covered here pretty well.

I did not find anything on corporation tax. How does that work?

Thanks

(in reply to eddieballgame)

Post #: 16

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/29/2021 11:16:04 PM

eddieballgame

Posts: 676
Joined: 6/29/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot

Thanks for that - i did look over the manual again, but i guess it got covered here pretty well.

I did not find anything on corporation tax. How does that work?

Thanks

Utilizing corporations to your advantage is multi-faceted.
Here are a couple of links that can offer some insight.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4940895&mpage=1&key=�

https://www.reddit.com/r/ShadowEmpireGame/comments/mzmmfi/help_in_increasing_credits_cashflow/

(in reply to mattpilot)

Post #: 17

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/30/2021 11:14:59 AM

mattpilot

Posts: 65
Joined: 3/8/2018
Status: offline

Thanks for those links, but i didn't get much smarter.

For example, in my current game it says corporate tax rate is 40% and the corporation paid 63 credits.

When i check the treasury cashflow report, i can't find those 63 credits. Who got that money?

(in reply to eddieballgame)

Post #: 18

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/30/2021 11:20:42 AM

Arralen

Posts: 827
Joined: 5/21/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot
Really? I thought sales tax was for when they buy or sell, and income tax is for income? So whats the difference between the two?

...
Income tax is when they sell something to the traders (it is income for the Private Economy).

"5.3.14.2. Income Tax
Paid by Population when they earn Credits by
_Private Asset production,
_the Hidden Economy,
_Selling Food
or by Workers spending their Salary in the Private Economy."

To me this means you'll get income tax when the private assets pay their workers (your pop), too. Am I wrong?

< Message edited by Arralen -- 12/30/2021 11:21:16 AM >

(in reply to zgrssd)

Post #: 19

RE: No more private assets being built? - 12/30/2021 7:00:24 PM

zgrssd

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arralen

quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

quote:

ORIGINAL: mattpilot
Really? I thought sales tax was for when they buy or sell, and income tax is for income? So whats the difference between the two?

...
Income tax is when they sell something to the traders (it is income for the Private Economy).

"5.3.14.2. Income Tax
Paid by Population when they earn Credits by
_Private Asset production,
_the Hidden Economy,
_Selling Food
or by Workers spending their Salary in the Private Economy."

To me this means you'll get income tax when the private assets pay their workers (your pop), too. Am I wrong?

Not correct.
Workers is who you pay. That is why I call them "(public) Workers".

Salaries you pay generally end up in a Zones Private economy.
Salaries the Private Economy pays just do nothing realy. It is a 0-sum mechanic. Money is taken out of hte Private Economy and put back into it. The overall value stays the same.

"Private Worker" is a term only I use.

(in reply to Arralen)

Post #: 20

RE: No more private assets being built? - 1/3/2022 3:09:32 PM

Soar_Slitherine

Posts: 426
Joined: 6/7/2020
Status: offline

Income tax does in fact tax private economy income in general, not just their item sales to traders (although I remember there being an outdated tooltip somewhere in the game that claims the latter). That includes salaries paid to public workers (which end as income for the private economy - after all, the workers have to buy the stuff they spend their salary on from somebody), the hidden economy (credits boost for the first 25k population in a zone) and direct credit production by assets.

Based on checking the values on the private economy income tooltip, the total income tax raised in a zone equals ([Private economy income] - [Service tax]) * [Income tax level].

(in reply to zgrssd)

Post #: 21