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Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia?

 
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Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 8:58:52 AM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		For the Axis, there are no requirements to have few corps in Yugoslavia to prevent partisans. This is easy to go all-in in the East with this.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.
Post #: 1
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 9:00:26 AM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		Is there no option in the editor to activate a checkbox per country to know if partisans can spawn or not?

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 2
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 12:37:10 PM   
Nirosi

 

Posts: 1776
Joined: 9/17/2017
Status: offline 		Will partisans not spawn at all if Yugoslavia is empty? I seem to recall they actually can? Or is it maybe it is my wishful imagination?

Could it be they do not appear because people do leave troops and often 1 unit is enough because of the 5 range?

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 3
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 12:44:07 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		I am leaving Yugoslavia empty and there are no partisans at all. Nothing.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to Nirosi)
Post #: 4
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 12:51:05 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		To clarify, by partisans, I mean real counter units not a broken rail here or there.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 5
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 1:31:37 PM   
Nirosi

 

Posts: 1776
Joined: 9/17/2017
Status: offline 		Yes, but I could swear I saw some before. But I could be wrong, getting old.

Maybe the chance is ridiculously low? Or maybe only after a certain year?

< Message edited by Nirosi -- 12/30/2021 1:32:21 PM >

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 6
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 5:09:58 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		I think they were there before but partisans for minors were removed in one patch. I don't remember when or why. Maybe too much?
But, in Yugoslavia, a minor, this is something pretty normal to find out.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to Nirosi)
Post #: 7
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 5:12:52 PM   
AlvaroSousa


Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline 		At 1st there were none so I put them in.
Then players complained, so I took them out.
Round and round we go

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(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 8
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 5:26:19 PM   
michaelCLARADY

 

Posts: 158
Joined: 12/2/2019
Status: offline 		In the real world the Yugo's spawned so many partisans that they are the one Country which self-liberated in WW2.

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)
Post #: 9
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 5:31:38 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		Is there a way to put partisans only per country i.e. only in Yugoslavia?

Partisans activity if I remember correctly (source When Titans Clashed):
Number one: Yugoslavia
Number two: USSR

I am ok if there are partisans for all majors AND Yugoslavia. But, you are right, some people have complained about partisans in the past. The thing is when I am playing Germans, I am taking all my corps, divisions, ... on the Eastern front because I have no need to do some guerilla warfare in the rear especially in the Balkans. I just find this quite unrealistic.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)
Post #: 10
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 6:10:27 PM   
sveint


Posts: 3556
Joined: 1/19/2001
From: Glorious Europe
Status: offline 		Who complained about partisans in Yugoslavia of all places?

Whomever it was, they have no business commenting on anything WW2 related.

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 11
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 6:35:24 PM   
Nirosi

 

Posts: 1776
Joined: 9/17/2017
Status: offline 		I am glad to know I am not crazy after all and I did see them at one point!

< Message edited by Nirosi -- 12/30/2021 8:02:18 PM >

(in reply to sveint)
Post #: 12
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 7:33:24 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sveint

Who complained about partisans in Yugoslavia of all places?

Whomever it was, they have no business commenting on anything WW2 related.


If I remember well, I think this is partisan everywhere in all minors versus no partisans at all.
That is why I am asking if there is not an option per country.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to sveint)
Post #: 13
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 9:07:54 PM   
boldairade

 

Posts: 722
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Off the top of my head, I think I remember Germany suffering in excess of 100k casualties in Yugoslavia and Italy over 30k. For the Germans I believe the bulk of those occurred after the occupation. Not sure about Italian losses. I know deaths within Yugoslavia have been estimated as high as 1 million. Though many of those were likely non combat.

There were several open battles between occupation forces and partisans in Yugoslavia. So unlike a lot of resistance me movements the rebels in Yugoslavia weren’t operating ‘underground’. I mention this because handled properly I think WP’s partisan system could do a fantastic job of replicating what happened in a kind of random manner.

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 14
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 9:12:36 PM   
Lascar


Posts: 489
Joined: 10/7/2000
Status: offline 		Ironically, of all the countries that had partisan activity during WWII none matched the scale and effectiveness of the massive partisan armies that emerged in Yugoslavia. By late 1944 they had several Soviet sized field armies and tied down 25 German divisions. Yet in WarPlan the Axis can leave Yugoslavia totally unoccupied.

How difficult would it be for an end user to create a scenario that features the historical Yugoslavia partisan campaign?
I would attempt it myself if it can be done throug the editor.

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 15
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/30/2021 9:29:28 PM   
boldairade

 

Posts: 722
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		The editor is pretty awesome. But you’re talking about a pretty huge project.

(in reply to Lascar)
Post #: 16
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/31/2021 12:18:20 PM   
michaelCLARADY

 

Posts: 158
Joined: 12/2/2019
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lascar

Ironically, of all the countries that had partisan activity during WWII none matched the scale and effectiveness of the massive partisan armies that emerged in Yugoslavia. By late 1944 they had several Soviet sized field armies and tied down 25 German divisions. Yet in WarPlan the Axis can leave Yugoslavia totally unoccupied.

How difficult would it be for an end user to create a scenario that features the historical Yugoslavia partisan campaign?
I would attempt it myself if it can be done throug the editor.


Some of those partisans, the Croats fought more or less on the Axis side against the Serbs.

(in reply to Lascar)
Post #: 17
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/31/2021 12:42:10 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		If I could have just three infantry corps immobilized to fight in Yugoslavia, I would be happy.

I think the problem came from appearance of partisans in North Africa or area where they were almost nothing like Belgium, Netherlands, ...
If there is an option to activate or not partisans per country plus a percentage of spawning occurrence, I think this is solving the problem easily.

Put plenty of partisans in Yugoslavia, Russia, few in Greece, France, Vichy France when occupied by Germans and honestly nothing in Italy. The Italian have more than welcome the arrival of the Allies in Sicily and after.


_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to michaelCLARADY)
Post #: 18
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/31/2021 9:36:14 PM   
scout1


Posts: 2899
Joined: 8/24/2004
From: South Bend, In
Status: offline 		Interesting discussion ....

Weren't the impact of partisans different in impact and target between the various regions ?
Yugosolvia basically had a standing guerilla organization which tied up alot of german troops though I'm not really sure why the germans cared other than containment... dont think they were significally impacting supply/resources ....

Most of the other regions were basically harassment of transport/supplies were they not ?

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 19
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 12/31/2021 9:37:54 PM   
scout1


Posts: 2899
Joined: 8/24/2004
From: South Bend, In
Status: offline 		the original implementation for partisans was more like wack a mole ... and given a division level being the lowest unit, no good way to defend other than overkill ....

(in reply to scout1)
Post #: 20
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 4:56:12 AM   
generalfdog

 

Posts: 214
Joined: 12/18/2020
Status: offline 		It seems right now it must be an all or nothing choice partisans for all minors or not, all countries have partisan activity but only major powers get partisan units. I do agree if possible an exception should be made for Yugoslavia

(in reply to scout1)
Post #: 21
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 4:27:05 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1508
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Nirosi

I am glad to know I am not crazy after all and I did see them at one point!


An absolute false statement if I ever year.

You are crazy.

(in reply to Nirosi)
Post #: 22
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 4:31:11 PM   
Nirosi

 

Posts: 1776
Joined: 9/17/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: stjeand


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nirosi

I am glad to know I am not crazy after all and I did see them at one point!


An absolute false statement if I ever year.

You are crazy.


Lies! A panel of specialists did declare me sane by a slim majority.

(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 23
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 4:31:22 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1508
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline 		Sadly I do not see a way to enable or disable partisans counters in the editor.
I have poked around.

I can change units all I want...

Also can't change advancements...BOOO....

(in reply to generalfdog)
Post #: 24
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 4:59:52 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		Well no, is it not this parameter? You can even put a chance of 0%.

So Alvaro may set every minor to 0% and put 5%-10% for Yugoslavia.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by ncc1701e -- 1/1/2022 5:00:53 PM >

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 25
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 5:37:57 PM   
generalfdog

 

Posts: 214
Joined: 12/18/2020
Status: offline 		Ncc1701e do you know what that is changing? is it generic partisan attacks or actual partisan unit occurrence?

(in reply to ncc1701e)
Post #: 26
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 6:32:05 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		Double post sorry - Matrix forum error ASP 500.

< Message edited by ncc1701e -- 1/1/2022 6:33:54 PM >

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to generalfdog)
Post #: 27
RE: Why is there no partisan in Yugoslavia? - 1/1/2022 6:32:40 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		It is not written in the editor manual. It is a guess on my side. That is perhaps the third time I am opening the editor.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to generalfdog)
Post #: 28
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