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What's wrong with my leader?

 
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What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 6:22:20 PM   
madeye

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/2/2022
Status: offline 		I recently promoted this leader from the reserve pool as an OHQ as the previous incumbent had 90+ ambition and 80+ ego - looked a really good fit but in the 2nd turn she was leader there was a -35 hit on relation for reasons I couldn't ascertain (she dropped from 71 to 36 relation then I lost a few more through events)

Now even though her natural relation is 70 she won't budge from 32 (I've now done 3 turns with no improvement).

I tried to post a link to a screenshot but it wouldn't let me

I'm on a first play through so I am unfamiliar with many of the game mechanics - what have I missed? What am I doing wrong? Any advice much appreciated

Post #: 1
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 6:50:50 PM   
eddieballgame

 

Posts: 676
Joined: 6/29/2011
Status: offline 		You mentioned that the promoted leader looked like a good fit...was she?
Off the top of my head, how did she match up with your ideological views...any '+'s or were there mostly '-' symbols.
Your decisions will have an impact combined with her political views.
I will add, a 70 for a 'natural relation' is not that great, but there have been many times I would have been very satisfied with that number.
Throwing money & gifts at them can be a temporary fix, but even that can get expensive.
A high 'Ambition' & 'Ego' are 2 traits that can give you huge problems...check the 'tool tips' in game to see why.
Per uploading any helpful screenshots, just shrink the image to the size required per Matrix's forums....using the right (jpg) format.

< Message edited by eddieballgame -- 1/2/2022 6:53:07 PM >

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 2
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 7:12:14 PM   
madeye

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/2/2022
Status: offline 		Thanks for the speedy response!

I can't post images for seven days after the date of my tenth post (or so I'm told when I try to post an image tag). I'll transpose the info here by hand

Natural relation point: 66
1 Part: Loyalty 32
1 Part: Job prestige 26
1 Part: Average morale of Troops 68
2 Parts: Leader Profile match with Regime Profile 100
Average of all parts: 65
Salary effect (2Cr) on Leader: +4
Modified for word score (38): 66

The loyalty was originally 70+ but it's dropped off considerably in the 5 turns I've played since she was appointed leader. I thought leaders were supposed to tend towards their natural relation (though I've only observed them going down)? What could cause a 30+ point drop in relation in one turn? When I went to investigate this drop, there was no reason shown in the brown box I took the numbers above from. I thought it was probably a display glitch but the number has stayed low



< Message edited by madeye -- 1/2/2022 7:16:16 PM >

(in reply to eddieballgame)
Post #: 3
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 7:42:09 PM   
madeye

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/2/2022
Status: offline 		Ok, I went back through my autosaves and found the turn before. When I replay it I get the same result (a red down arrow with -39 and Relation Change Logs showing '-1 due to relation was higher than natural points (75)' and no explanation for the massive loss)

eddieballgame - I tried many different ways to post the image or a link and every time it told me I couldn't so I've tried to PM it to you

< Message edited by madeye -- 1/2/2022 7:43:04 PM >

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 4
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 7:43:14 PM   
Maerchen

 

Posts: 348
Joined: 6/16/2020
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Is that leader in line with your government decisions or actively opposing it? Aa democracy -- leader when playing democracy e.g. is just a pain the behind. What are his profile preferences, and how is his faction dealing with you, happiness matters a lot.

_____________________________

The logistics hell this game is IS the fun part! - Maerchen, 2020

The good thing is, we have all the information in the reports. The bad thing is, we have all the information. Maerchen, 2020

Came for SE. Will stay for SE.

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 5
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 8:00:52 PM   
eddieballgame

 

Posts: 676
Joined: 6/29/2011
Status: offline 		As mentioned in my response to your 'pm', that salary could be higher (a lot!) & your word score needs[/should be higher, as well.
You could always dump her, but that high 'INT' looks pretty damn good in the pic you sent me...what is her 'CAP LVL'?

< Message edited by eddieballgame -- 1/15/2022 3:47:11 AM >

(in reply to Maerchen)
Post #: 6
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 8:11:28 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: madeye

Ok, I went back through my autosaves and found the turn before. When I replay it I get the same result (a red down arrow with -39 and Relation Change Logs showing '-1 due to relation was higher than natural points (75)' and no explanation for the massive loss)

eddieballgame - I tried many different ways to post the image or a link and every time it told me I couldn't so I've tried to PM it to you

The only things that can usually get a person of their "Natural Relations Point" is decisions. Parrticulary the ones that involve Profile parts they like or Dislike.
Keep in mind that the game uses a Inversion. Negative Impacts are bigger and positive smaler, if you already have very high Realtions.

Loyalty (both leaders and for cities) is a bit of a "longterm trend". Relations move towards loyalty, reducing relations in the process. They give relations a sort of "innertia".

With all this data, I can think of no reason why Relations Dropped. Or in fact why Loyalty dropped from 70 to 32 in only a few turns.
Something sounds like it broke.

< Message edited by zgrssd -- 1/2/2022 8:12:39 PM >

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 7
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/2/2022 8:12:30 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Maerchen

Is that leader in line with your government decisions or actively opposing it? Aa democracy -- leader when playing democracy e.g. is just a pain the behind. What are his profile preferences, and how is his faction dealing with you, happiness matters a lot.

Give this line:
"2 Parts: Leader Profile match with Regime Profile 100 "

I am guessing the leader is very much in line.

(in reply to Maerchen)
Post #: 8
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/3/2022 4:49:34 PM   
madeye

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/2/2022
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: eddieballgame

As mentioned in my response to your 'pm', that salary could be higher (a lot!) & your word score needs[/should to be higher, as well.
You could always dump her, but that high 'INT' looks pretty damn good in the pic you sent me...what is her 'CAP LVL'?


I've PMed you the full screenshot of the leader the turn before the big drop

I've left all the salaries on default - I'll bump it up massively, see if it makes a difference.

Cap level III - so far this game I've only seen one cap level IV (and he's a massive douche)

Re. word score is on account of me:
a) not understanding what it was
b) underestimating how hard the objectives are (sure I can take that village in 5 turns while boosting my government to 55 - failed both)

Still, the word score only had a minor effect on the relation score


quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd
quote:

ORIGINAL: Maerchen

Is that leader in line with your government decisions or actively opposing it?

Give this line:
"2 Parts: Leader Profile match with Regime Profile 100 "

I am guessing the leader is very much in line.


What he said


I think I'm going to take the view that this is a bug (on account of there being no explanation for the drop in the Relation Change Log). Now to decide whether to suck up the challenge or restart with lessons learned.

(in reply to eddieballgame)
Post #: 9
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/3/2022 6:05:02 PM   
madeye

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/2/2022
Status: offline 		Hmmmm maybe not a bug - in so far as it just happened again. I just halved the Supreme Command Council budget (I have more PP and Strategem cards than I know what to do with, literally) and allocated it to research (Economic & Military Research Councils).

My relation with the Director of the Supreme Command Council just dropped by 47 (and no explanation of this in the Relation Change Log). However from the next turn it started moving up again (unlike the original leader I posted about). They both have similar ambition and egoism so why does one revert back to the Natural Relation and one doesn't?



< Message edited by madeye -- 1/3/2022 6:09:17 PM >

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 10
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/3/2022 6:19:42 PM   
eddieballgame

 

Posts: 676
Joined: 6/29/2011
Status: offline 		PMed back, forgot to ask if you are using the latest beta...recommended.

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 11
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/4/2022 9:59:45 AM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: madeye

Hmmmm maybe not a bug - in so far as it just happened again. I just halved the Supreme Command Council budget (I have more PP and Strategem cards than I know what to do with, literally) and allocated it to research (Economic & Military Research Councils).

My relation with the Director of the Supreme Command Council just dropped by 47 (and no explanation of this in the Relation Change Log). However from the next turn it started moving up again (unlike the original leader I posted about). They both have similar ambition and egoism so why does one revert back to the Natural Relation and one doesn't?



Reducing the budget explicit changes Relations with the leader whose Budget you just slashed.
But IIRC this chance is clearly shown in the confirmation Dialog.

As for the other leader: I asume you did other stuff that kept reducing relations every turn, that you asume has no impact.

In either case, please make a Bug Report for the 1st one in Tech Support. Keep the savegames until Vic tells you his Email Adress.

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 12
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/17/2022 8:23:12 PM   
EuchreJack

 

Posts: 47
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: madeye
Natural relation point: 66
1 Part: Loyalty 32
1 Part: Job prestige 26
1 Part: Average morale of Troops 68
2 Parts: Leader Profile match with Regime Profile 100
Average of all parts: 65
Salary effect (2Cr) on Leader: +4
Modified for word score (38): 66


Frankly, it looks more like a leader pouting because they got a lousy job rather than a bug.
OHQ isn't a great job, its one step up from No Job.
Also, perhaps the specific OHQ has some impact? I don't think it does, but it would make sense if it did.
Being the Commander of the 99th Reserve Infantry Brigade is a lot less prestigious than being the Commander of the 1st Armored Corps.

(in reply to madeye)
Post #: 13
RE: What's wrong with my leader? - 1/17/2022 9:41:08 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EuchreJack


quote:

ORIGINAL: madeye
Natural relation point: 66
1 Part: Loyalty 32
1 Part: Job prestige 26
1 Part: Average morale of Troops 68
2 Parts: Leader Profile match with Regime Profile 100
Average of all parts: 65
Salary effect (2Cr) on Leader: +4
Modified for word score (38): 66


Frankly, it looks more like a leader pouting because they got a lousy job rather than a bug.
OHQ isn't a great job, its one step up from No Job.
Also, perhaps the specific OHQ has some impact? I don't think it does, but it would make sense if it did.
Being the Commander of the 99th Reserve Infantry Brigade is a lot less prestigious than being the Commander of the 1st Armored Corps.

A few remarks/questons about that:
OHQ prestige is not seperated even by size or type of the formation.
The above includes "1 Part: Job prestige 26"
According to Grogs guide, the value is 0 for Reserve pool, 40 for Governor and OHQ commander.
So even a bad job, is still be an upgrade over the Reserve pool. And that is before the Salary.

The average Troop moral is the 2nd highest factor, right after realy liking the Regime Profile.

The big part is the unexplainable drop of loyalty, facilitated by the unexplainable drop in happiness over several turns.
And we can not check it, because madeye can not post links or images of the leader.

(in reply to EuchreJack)
Post #: 14
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