What are good "house rules" to make play vs. AI more like PvP play?

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Strategic Command Series >> Strategic Command WWII War in Europe >> What are good "house rules" to make play vs. AI more like PvP play?

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What are good "house rules" to make play vs. ... - 2/2/2022 1:19:31 PM

OxfordGuy3

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From: Oxford, United Kingdom
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Hi - I'm coming back to SC WWII: WiE after a long hiatus (4 years!), after life got too busy to play the game for a while and have a) forgotten most of the systems and strategies and b) realise the game has had numerous updates since then. Before I dip my toe back into PBEM (which obviously is better), I would like to play a few games against the AI, first as the axis, then as the allies, the re-familiarise myself and also to learn about what's new - but because my ultimate goal is to "skill-up" for PBEM PvP games I would like to play in a way which more closely mirrors how one would play versus a human, even if that means artificially limiting myself, rather than playing in a style which exploits the limits of the AI. Given that, I was thinking of playing with a set of "house rules", to which I must adhere. Does anyone have any recommendations for such house rules? e.g. always ensuring garrisons in likely landing zone hexes.

Also, I'm unsure what would be the best difficulty level and bonuses to give the AI with my ultimate objective of training for PvP play in mind? Whilst I can appreciate the AI would be more challenging with all the bonuses set the maximum, this won't necessarily help with working out what strategies would be work best against a human e.g. attacking Poland or France when all their units have +2 experience would require different strategies than when they have regular amounts of experience, as with PvP games. I can also appreciate that giving the AI some bonuses, though, is probably essential to ensure that they don't collapse too quickly. Thanks!

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/2/2022 1:56:59 PM

crispy131313

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I haven't played a vanilla match against AI since the game was in BETA, I think the best route to prepare for PBEM would be to play PBEM even if you lose.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/2/2022 3:37:19 PM

Taxman66

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From: Columbia, MD. USA
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Sadly, there really are none.

The AI is pretty good for an AI.
The problem is that to balance it the developers give the AI lots of extra units. This helps offset the AI and balance a game versus humans, but it no way does it prepare you for play against a live opponent.
Find someone to play against who is willing to coach you on the mistakes you make while playing.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/2/2022 3:45:50 PM

OxfordGuy3

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From: Oxford, United Kingdom
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One of the things that I remember really catching me out when trying to play PBEM games was the use of diplomacy really throwing me off, does anyone play PBEM with no chit diplomacy or at least no chit usage versus majors, or have things been toned down considerably to make this less destabilising?

That and surprise invasions that I could seemingly do nothing about, especially in the early game where counter numbers are low.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/2/2022 4:20:54 PM

Taxman66

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Diplomacy versus majors has been toned down, but playing no Diplomacy vs. Majors is a common house rule.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/2/2022 4:49:25 PM

The Land

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Taxman66

The AI is pretty good for an AI.
The problem is that to balance it the developers give the AI lots of extra units. This helps offset the AI and balance a game versus humans, but it no way does it prepare you for play against a live opponent.
Find someone to play against who is willing to coach you on the mistakes you make while playing.

Exactly this. Good humans are good at the micro-level - optimising the readiness of their units and planning their strikes for best effect - and at the macro-level - pulling of diplomacy / invasions most people wouldn't think to attempt.

the only way to develop these skills against the AI is by challenging yourself to make sure that you are always optimising everything (even though you don't need to to beat the AI, as the AI is sucky at this); and thinking up cunning stunts to seize the initiative.

If you are playing against the AI to rehearse a cunning stunt, make sure not to give the AI units any bonus experience. As conquering Belgium in October 1939 is perfectly plausible against a human player (as the human has very few possible counter-moves), but much more difficult against an AI with bonus experience points.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/3/2022 4:01:23 PM

bfcj

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From: Tampa, FL, USA
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I've always been impressed by the AI given the complexity of the game, and think it makes for a good exercise for refreshing yourself on basic strategy and game flow. That being said it's far from perfect, so I try to make it a rule not to exploit the times in which the AI makes really poor choices, eg, leaving HQs exposed, parking aircraft too near the front, etc.

(in reply to The Land)

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/3/2022 5:18:01 PM

Bavre

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The problem of an AI is currently just its predictability and inability to learn and there's nothing a developer can really do about that. Once you understand how it ticks you can run circles around it, while humans will adapt to your tricks. So an AI match is really just good for teaching folks the basic mechanics.
As already said above, the best way to get into MP is MP. Just mention your skill level in your post in the MP thread and you should be fine, I've played dozends of MP matches in all 3 games and not once met one of those "lol noob get pwned" guys that are so common elsewhere. Actually the first veteran I ever played (in the WW1 version) basically turned the match in a tutoring session, teching me stuff in looong PMs that would have taken ages to figure out on my own.

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/4/2022 4:13:20 PM

havoc1371

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AI has ruts in the road it follows like sending unescorted transports on the most direct route from the U.S. to England. When I play the Axis against the AI, I use a house rule that I can't spread a "net" of ships/subs across the route. Instead I operate ships and subs in packs on convoy routes and only intercept transports if they are spotted.

(in reply to Bavre)

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/9/2022 11:16:18 PM

ThunderLizard11

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bfcj

I've always been impressed by the AI given the complexity of the game, and think it makes for a good exercise for refreshing yourself on basic strategy and game flow. That being said it's far from perfect, so I try to make it a rule not to exploit the times in which the AI makes really poor choices, eg, leaving HQs exposed, parking aircraft too near the front, etc.

Has this not been fixed yet?

(in reply to bfcj)

Post #: 10

RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/10/2022 5:40:50 PM

dhucul2011

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As Axis to keep it historical:

1. Always choose yes to the Italian attack on Greece.
2. Force yourself to always keep a unit in every Italian NM city.
3. Never move Finnish units outside of pre war Finnish territory.
4. Bulgarian units should be only used in Bulgaria, Greece and Yugoslavia.
5. Don�t attack Yugo before they coup.
6. Don�t upgrade Axis minors past IW 1.

(in reply to ThunderLizard11)

Post #: 11

RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/10/2022 5:53:50 PM

OxfordGuy3

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From: Oxford, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: dhucul2011

As Axis to keep it historical:

1. Always choose yes to the Italian attack on Greece.
2. Force yourself to always keep a unit in every Italian NM city.
3. Never move Finnish units outside of pre war Finnish territory.
4. Bulgarian units should be only used in Bulgaria, Greece and Yugoslavia.
5. Don�t attack Yugo before they coup.
6. Don�t upgrade Axis minors past IW 1.

Thanks, that would certainly make play vs the AI a little more challenging, though wouldn't necessarily be good practice for PBEM play (except probably 2.)

(in reply to dhucul2011)

Post #: 12

RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/10/2022 9:29:23 PM

The Land

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Joined: 2/19/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThunderLizard11

Has this not been fixed yet?

I've only noticed it happen in the last couple of years when the AI is stretched. If it's short of units on the whole and desperate to fill the line, or you pull some stunt that opens up a whole new front where it's got nothing... then the AI will do random stuff. That's when you end up with an AI HQ holding the capital of a country you're about to invade, without a Corps in sight.

I imagine the additional work on the AI to fix this is more significant than can be justified...

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RE: What are good "house rules" to make play ... - 2/11/2022 7:54:40 PM

havoc1371

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Joined: 12/5/2017
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OxfordGuy3

quote:

ORIGINAL: dhucul2011

As Axis to keep it historical:

1. Always choose yes to the Italian attack on Greece.
2. Force yourself to always keep a unit in every Italian NM city.
3. Never move Finnish units outside of pre war Finnish territory.
4. Bulgarian units should be only used in Bulgaria, Greece and Yugoslavia.
5. Don�t attack Yugo before they coup.
6. Don�t upgrade Axis minors past IW 1.

Thanks, that would certainly make play vs the AI a little more challenging, though wouldn't necessarily be good practice for PBEM play (except probably 2.)

Not unless you both agree to house rules and have some for the Allies as well. I prefer to play War in Europe and World at War with a short list of house rules:

1. You can't DoW on a country currently pro your side (+1% or more). Exception is a historical precedent like Germany invading Vichy France in November 42 after operation Torch.
2. Air units and ground units can't "swap" hexes.
3. Both players agree to avoid gamey moves, like sending the British fleet to attack Japanese before Pearl Harbor (WatW), or the Japanese sending troops to Italian East Africa to block the British without a DoW (WatW).

Always willing to entertain other player's house rules as long as they are about preventing ahistorical play or gamey moves.

(in reply to OxfordGuy3)

Post #: 14

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Strategic Command Series >> Strategic Command WWII War in Europe >> What are good "house rules" to make play vs. AI more like PvP play?

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