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Bug and question - 8/30/2001 11:49:00 AM

Dean Robb

Posts: 204
Joined: 5/25/2000
From: Va Beach, VA USA
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Golly gee whillikers, this game just keeps getting better and better!

OK, first the bugs. US Army OOB: M1 Bazooka has a penetration value of "0". Don't think it'll do much good like that! True troop cost/rarity ON. When you buy a unit and some component is missing, you still have to pay full price AND when you return a unit to the pool, if they got the last one of a component, the component is not re-allocated to the pool. Case in point: Playing a campaign and got a MOUT (Military Operations in Urban Terrain) scenario. Decided to supplement my 2 Inf platoons with some more fodder -er, troops. Started buying US Rifle Platoons and after 2 buys noted that they ran out of .30 MGs (guess the Liberty ship carrying them met a U-Boat!). Bought another couple of platoons, but changed my mind, thinking that MGs are pretty handy in MOUT. I sent these boys back to the repple-depple, but they must have sold the two MGs on the black market 'cause they were still out of stock! This is one example, happens all the time. Oh...and I had to pay the full 105 pts for the MG-less platoons, too! Now the question: Whyfor don't ammo dumps carry smoke shells? I rather like using arty smoke to keep the Evil Jerries from seeing me, but when the Willy Pete is gone - it's gone! Overall though, I DO like the 6.1. I'm now happy with MGs and don't have to edit the OOBs anymore to make them killers! Whooppeee! And I'm having a blast! Just tonight I pitted two M4A1s against a Jagdpanther (no, I'm not suicidal - the Sherms were immobilized and I was praying for a golden BB!) After bouncing some 10 rounds of 75mm off the JgPnthr's bow and miraculously avoiding the return 88mm, the Jerry crew bailed out (must have had blood running outa their ears from those ruptured eardrums!). How kewl is a game where that sort of thing can happen? In any other wargame, those M4s would have been Ronson-ized if not for the suppressive effects and that BigNaze would STILL be a threat. I go play other games too - but I keep coming back to SP:WaW. THAT says a lot about the quality of this game. [ August 30, 2001: Message edited by: Dean Robb ]

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- 8/30/2001 2:01:00 PM

Mai Thai

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Joined: 4/21/2001
From: Switzerland
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To Dean Robb:

quote:

True troop cost/rarity ON. When you buy a unit and some component is missing, you still have to pay full price AND when you return a unit to the pool,
if they got the last one of a component, the component is not re-allocated to the pool.

Afaik, this not a bug, i can't remember exactly where but it was stated at some point that if you return a unit who is now a "rarity" you don't have it back in the pool.
The best thing you can do is to turn "OFF" the rarity factor when you buy your core force at the beginning of a campaign and turn it back "ON" before starting turn1.
Hope this would help you.
Bye

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- 8/30/2001 9:13:00 PM

Jeff_Ewing

Posts: 45
Joined: 7/16/2001
From: Staten Island, NY, wargame captial of the US
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> US Army OOB: M1 Bazooka has a penetration value > of "0". Don't think it'll do much good like
> that! NAB -- This is a bit of OOB wizardry. See this thread: http://www.matrixgames.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=26&t=000300&p= > True troop cost/rarity ON. When you buy a unit > and some component is missing, you still have
> to pay full price AND when you return a unit to BD -- This is what rarity on does, as noted. Fortunes of War and all that, what? Jeff

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- 8/31/2001 12:38:00 AM

Paul Vebber

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In the 5.2 OOBs the Bazooka lacked 222 in the AP pen slot adding that fixes them. I've returned the Infantry AT to seperate AP (HEAT with the 222) and HE for bazookas (only - poorly representing WP or use against bunkers etc, the germans called bazookas "shoulder 75s" so had some significant impact that other inf AT weps did not enjoy to the extent the bazooka did. Standard infantry load is 3HE and 6 AP, Bazooka Teams get 4 HE and 8 AP) In the testing I did for 6.0 you were not charged for units you did not get in battle generator purchases, never checked in in campaign, but should work the same - The price lists the full price, but if you do the subtraction on the points, it only charges for what you get. Please check this again? Limiting smoke is a game play issue or else it gets way over done. OBA has LOTS of smoke and is the "proper" way to deliever it

Glad you are enjoying the game! Lots of strange things happen in war and we try to let them happen in the game

[ August 30, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]

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- 8/31/2001 3:11:00 AM

RockinHarry

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quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber:
In the 5.2 OOBs the Bazooka lacked 222 in the AP pen slot adding that fixes them. I've returned the Infantry AT to seperate AP (HEAT with the 222) and HE for bazookas (only - poorly representing WP or use against bunkers etc, the germans called bazookas "shoulder 75s" so had some significant impact that other inf AT weps did not enjoy to the extent the bazooka did. Standard infantry load is 3HE and 6 AP, Bazooka Teams get 4 HE and 8 AP)
[ August 30, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]

Good! Some solution one can live with.

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Harry

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- 8/31/2001 5:14:00 AM

AbsntMndedProf

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Regarding the armor penetration ability of U.S. bazookas, I recall reading in General James Gavin's 'On to Berlin' his complaints regarding the lack of effectiveness of the bazookas the U.S. troops used. He also commented that the Germans used the bazooka to produce a much superior anti-tank weapon, which U.S. troopers prized highly when they were captured. He lamented that, even as late as the Korean Conflict, U.S. troops were still using the same 3" bazookas.

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- 9/1/2001 1:59:00 PM

Dean Robb

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From: Va Beach, VA USA
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quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber:
In the testing I did for 6.0 you were not charged for units you did not get in battle generator purchases, never checked in in campaign, but should work the same - The price lists the full price, but if you do the subtraction on the points, it only charges for what you get. Please check this again?

Checked within a campaign and it's as you say: The listed COST doesn't change but the actual points charged is adjusted for the missing components. That would be a good manual point - most folks aren't gonna be busting out the calculators, just reading the cost.

quote:

Limiting smoke is a game play issue or else it gets way over done. OBA has LOTS of smoke and is the "proper" way to deliever it

OBA my rear end! Never around when you really need it! Organic Arty is the only way to go!

. OK, design decision - I can live with that. I do think another once-over on the rarity routine would be a good idea. The current methodology penalizes you for changing your mind - never a good thing. I like rarity, just think that if there's only 1 tank in the depot and I grab it; then return it; then the tank should be back in the depot for this buying round!

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- 9/1/2001 8:24:00 PM

11Bravo

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quote:

Originally posted by Dean Robb:
OBA my rear end!

OBA...Does the O stand for Off or On? I'm confused.

Also, how can YOU be a solopsist? I thought I was the only one that exists?

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- 9/2/2001 3:16:00 AM

Dean Robb

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It's general usage is OFFboard arty. I personally refer to ONboard arty as organic since it's under my direct command, as opposed to OFFboard which is in general support (ie: is often "out of contact", meaning firing missions for someone else, etc.). And I just allow you to be in my world...

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