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Cudos Wild Bill! - 10/16/2001 12:44:00 AM   
AbsntMndedProf


Posts: 1780
Joined: 7/6/2001
From: Boston, Massachusetts
Status: offline 		I just finished the first scenario in the 'From Utah to the Rhine', and barely managed a draw. When those Mark Vs showed up, I amost sh*t! I take it achieving a major victory in this first scenario is somewhat difficult, to say the least! I love a challenge, and this campaign looks to be shaping up to be an excellent one! Thanks for creating it! (Btw: How is retirement treating you? Done any fishing?) Just another confirmation that Matrix Games and it's creative staff are the best find in gaming I've made since I discovered wargaming! Eric Maietta

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- 10/16/2001 1:12:00 AM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Hi, "From Utah to the Rhine" is absolutely on of the better campaigns. I must honestly say that I thought the first scenario to be rather a little too easy. I believe the first scenario in a campaign should one of the more difficult ones in it, because then you'll have to spend a lot of your repair points on actually "repairing" your core list instead of improving it. I remember having an enormous list of cheap (mainely infantry, truck, motorized and light armoured) units at the beginning of this campaign, to give it some punch I added a few of the best (armoured)and infantry units (I particularly like those airborne units, they make for a very flexible way of playing) available and deployed them (the best armoured units that is) just behind the centre of the main attack units.
I did this so they don't get ambushed or otherwise accidentally destroyed by a infantry or anything else, not being better then a Pzkw IVG. But, what was your list? What where your tactics in this one? Maybe I or others could give you some advice? Anyway Good luck and go get them germanic bast***s!!! Regards, Pantherblaster * I particularly thought the "hedge" scenario (2 or 3 or something like that to be nasty and one of the most difficult in this campaign).

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"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

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Post #: 2
- 10/16/2001 3:43:00 AM   
AbsntMndedProf


Posts: 1780
Joined: 7/6/2001
From: Boston, Massachusetts
Status: offline 		I guess that I bought too much armor and not enough infantry. I had two sections of M4A3s and a battallion of engineers, plus a couple of bazooka teams. Eric Maietta

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Post #: 3
- 10/16/2001 5:21:00 AM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Hmmm, doesn't look like a lot of armour to me. It's been a long time ago, I could look up my exact list (as I save pretty much all campaign games). But, two tank sections aren't going to cut it. A batallion of engineers??? several companies of engineers or something? Those are mechanized, foot or arm-eng? I had something like: -1 wolverine TD platoon
-1 76/w Sherman platoon
-1 76/w Sherman section
-1 M4 Flame tank section
-1 Stuart light tank platoon
-1 Mineclearing tank section
-1 MHMC Scott light support tank section and lots of jeeps with 60mm mortars and 12,7mm's, scouting teams, snipers, several rifle platoons ans atleast two bazooka sections and a HMG section. Ohh, and ofcourse some trucks. from my support points I bought airborne troops and transport aircraft, extra bazooka teams, and some engineers and some extra trucks and APC's. Regards, Pantherblaster

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"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

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Post #: 4
- 10/16/2001 11:32:00 PM   
AbsntMndedProf


Posts: 1780
Joined: 7/6/2001
From: Boston, Massachusetts
Status: offline 		Oops! I meant to say that I bought two battalions of M4A3s! (Sorry!) Eric Maitta

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Post #: 5
- 10/17/2001 1:46:00 AM   
Bing

 

Posts: 1366
Joined: 5/20/2000
From: Gaylord, MI, USA
Status: offline 		Prof - For U2R - my absolute fav of all the campaigns and you bet I played it all the way to the end ... then I started "The Victors". With the same devils in baggy pants that got me all the way across France and Germany. My formula for success came from many, many restarts, until I got what I thought was a decent chance to survive: As many airborne troopers as the PP's will allow AND they MUST be given rides. HT's are preferable. Trucks are OK. Either way, get'em off their feet and on something with wheels. Made sure the boys had the latest model of the Bazooka - edited to be sure, why should they have the old model when the engineers for God's sake have the newest??? Because of the airborne morale and (later) their superb battle experience, they are the way to take out German armor. Pure and simple: Get the guy in baggy pants behind the Panzer, open up, or just wait in the weeds. Works like a charm. I would not dream of playing U2R or any other campaign without an FO of minimum 80 Arty rating. I respect all those who say LOS makes a difference. I say it has not made on iota of difference, put the FO wherever I want and the results are exactly the same. With less than 80 rating, forget it. Artillery is the God of War. On replays I get as much offboard as possible but lately have been going for onboard 105's: They're cheap, easy to move and en masse do a good job. Later in the campaign I go to onboard rocket launchers which miraculously transport themselves around the battlefield (!!). If the Heinies can use Flamenwurfen, this kid can respond with his own rocket barrage. Believe me, it works. Wild Bill certainly has my kudos. U2R is the most sustained gaming fun I've ever had. Bing

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"For Those That Fought For It, Freedom Has a Taste And A Meaning The Protected Will Never Know. " -
From the 101st Airborne Division Association Website

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 6
- 10/17/2001 4:49:00 PM   
JNL

 

Posts: 43
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: Massenheim, Germany
Status: offline 		AMP - your right, this is one of my favorite campaigns. For added goodness try the Long Long Road to Victory - Alexandra did a wonderful job stringing together Preparing the Way (North Africa thru Sicily), From Utah to the Rhine, and (I forgot the name) US vs. USSR in May of 45. Must be about 30 to 45 scenarios which will make you laugh, cry, swear at WB, sweat, and overall have just about as much fun as you can with your clothes on. My OOB for UtR was 4 Secs of the cheapest Sherman, 2 secs of jeeps (future AFVs), Mech Inf (without the APCs - I preferred M1's over Thompson's - personal preference), 8 to 12 75mm FH, FO, and a couple of trucks which were going to go to Ammo trucks to support the FH. In the straight UtR campaign my Inf were the primary tank killers - those M9 bazookas will take out even a King Tiger. I always strive to get a good amount of on board artillery - the suppressive fire is without peer - the odd kill is just gravy. In the LLR my tanks became the primary killers - the experience you get from all the additional scenarios makes a huge difference in their capability. Alex is doing the LLR with a Polish core (see her posting "A new Campaign AAR") Good blow by blow accounting of the scenarios - also by using a Polish core is an excellent way of giving an older campaign new life. I've got one going using the Brits as my core. Despite the fact that allot of US and Brit OOB is the same - I find that I have to use different tactics to accomplish the mission objectives. A Free French force would be an interesting experience as well. Enjoy - you got your hands on a good one.

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JNL

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Post #: 7
- 10/17/2001 5:37:00 PM   
Richard Harris

 

Posts: 40
Joined: 5/10/2001
Status: offline 		How on earth are you people affording all of this??? I am currently playing UtR (Ver 6.1 truetroop ON, rarity ON, all values at their defaults except for search which I set at 120% US as this was mainly going to be advance missions, and I know what WBW's campaigns are like...) all I could afford at the start was:
A US HQ (free natch)
B 1x Platoon (5) M4A1 Sherman
C 1x Platoon (5) M3A1 Stuart
D 1x Platoon US Rifle (3 sqd + .30 cal MMG)
E 1x Platoon US Engineers (3 sqd)
F 1x Recon Platoon (3) .50 cal Jeep + (3) 4 man teams I am now in Paris (after about 5 missions) and have:
A US Armd Engineers (as HQ)
B 1x Mixed Platoon (3) M4A3 (76)W + (2) M4A1 (76)W Shermans
C 1X Very Mixed Platoon (1) M5A1 + (2) M3A1 Stuarts + (2) M36 Jacksons
D 1x Platoon US Armd Inf (2 rifle sqd + 1 Eng Sqd + 1 Arm .30 cal sqd)
E 1x Platoon US Engineers (unchanged)
F 1x Mech Platoon (3) M2A1 H/T + (2) Arm Inf (rifle) sqd + (1) Arm Eng sqd... Some of the fighting has been very nasty, as we are generally advancing and usually outnumbered... It's a lucky thing I like 155mm Batteries and copious smoke! How are you affording all those lovely toys????

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Post #: 8
- 10/17/2001 7:37:00 PM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		I only used the support points to buy some artillery (usually one bat of 75mm for smoke and one 155mm for suppression). In the first scenario's I also used two sections of 60mm mortar jeeps which I upgraded later. My principle basically was: 1: drop lots of airborne infantry, bazooka teams, MG's, snipers, scouting teams and engineer squads (upgraded rifle sguads) to take up strategic positions around and leading up to the victory hexes and suspected AT-positions. They would make the first serious contacts and give away enemy positions, while also capturing some victory objectives. The CPU then had to respond to get those back, which he mostly does by moving his motorized and armoured elements, which would than be cannon fodder form my own bazooka teams and other infantry squads. Meanwhile, my own armour and mech-inf would race forward to get to the airborne troops. In the whole of this campaign this worked briliantly, relatively low losses and lots of points. I didn't use that much artillery overall though. As I said good campaign! watch those HuntingTigers in the end though, they truly live up to there reputation. Regards, Pantherblaster

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"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

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Post #: 9
- 10/18/2001 3:13:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Thank you gentlemen! Thank you! A word like this serves as great encouragement. A lot of work and testing went into this one. When you are done, you might want to try a second one at Fabio Prado's Armor site on the harsh fighting in the Hurtgen. I took what I learned from U2R and put it into play in this one..five hard battles. Where have I been? Nope, no fishing. I'm too much of a hyped up old dude for that. I've been at Guadalcanal, fighting the Japanese. MC-W will be available soon, some 30 nodes with 71 scenarios that will take you through all the Marine fighting during their longest single military campaign of their history. Red Beach, Tulagi, Gavutu, THe Ilu River, Bloody Ridge, Battles of the Matanikau, resucing downed pilots or trapped coastwatchers, paradrops (hypthetical but fun) ambush of the Goettge patrol, and a ton of other goodies. This one will give you insights into the Pacific you have not had before, with articles, pictures and a ton of other goodies to make your wargaming experience a most pleasant one. MC-W should be a "Must have" for your SPWAW gaming experience. It calls into play all the newest features of the game. And you'll love those SBDs Wildcats and P-400s just sitting on Henderson Field. Every kind of situation you can imagine and some you can't will be in this Mega Campaign. So, it has been time well spent, fellas. I think you'll really love this one! Wild Bill

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 10
- 10/18/2001 10:05:00 PM   
JNL

 

Posts: 43
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: Massenheim, Germany
Status: offline 		Richard, I always massage my OOB selections - usually I go for a non-historical OOB. I try to match up AFV with Inf squad 1 for 1. Not only for the squad transportation it offers - Also for the benefits of combined arms. SPWaW truly requires the use of all arms to be successful. I've got German class tonight - tomorrow I'll check and see if I can pull out an old OOB from the first scenario of LLR or UtR. I would usually get 6 M4s and maybe 6 jeeps (looking to 4 (3 tank) AFV Platoons - I'd mess around with point totals (buy like 10 sections of APCs or something) so my point total would be just enough for 2 Mech Inf Platoons and a .30 cal MG. Eventually they would become a 3 squad Mech Inf Platoon. They would match up nicely with my AFV Platoon structure. The 75mm FH is one of the cheapest units in the whole US OOB. I'd buy as many as I could afford then round out the rest of the OOB with jeeps or trucks. I'd shoot for 12 or so - but I've gone with just 8 before. I guess the trick is - to get as little combat power for the first 2 scenarios as you can get away with - then pad your OOB with as many place holders (Jeeps, Trucks, 2 man Recon Squads) as you can. Use your AUX units for the advance to contact - use your units for the final kills (experience) and upgrade like crazy between scenarios. All this massaging is for really for naught - You can do this campaign with a historical OOB. You just won't get as many DVs - and the ones you do get you'll earn.

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JNL

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Post #: 11
- 10/18/2001 11:16:00 PM   
Lars Remmen

 

Posts: 357
Joined: 5/9/2000
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by Richard Harris:
How are you affording all those lovely toys????
You can increase the points in the prefrences. But I played it like you with a small core. Very hard indeed. Regards, Lars

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"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin

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Post #: 12
- 10/19/2001 11:18:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Take the challenge, guys! You can get a major victory here. Choose a balanced force. Tanks must have infantry support. You'll get extras in each battle. Grit your teeth and head in there You can make it to the Rhine and beyond...WB

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 13
- 10/19/2001 1:03:00 PM   
Richard Harris

 

Posts: 40
Joined: 5/10/2001
Status: offline 		Currently on 'Bogeyman Hill' after 7 missions (6DV and 1MV)... My core force is now:
A US Armd Engineers (HQ)
B 1x Platoon (5) M4A3(76)W Shermans
C 1X Very Mixed Platoon (2) M5A1 + (1) Captured Tiger IE + (2) M36 Jacksons
D 1x Platoon US Armd Inf (2 rifle sqd + 1 Eng Sqd + 1 Arm .30 cal sqd)
E 1x Platoon US Engineers
F 1x Mech Platoon (3) M2A1 H/T + (2) Arm Inf (rifle) sqd + (1) Arm Eng sqd
Heh, the Tiger was interesting, I read Alexandra's AAR and noticed she wound up with a captured Pz IV... Well on the Seigfreid Line scenario, this Tiger charged out of the bushes and whacked one of my Shermans, the Stuarts (who have always been madmen) had a go at it and (amazingly) knocked a track off without getting vapourized by the Tiger in return. Some passing engineers then assaulted it with FT's (unsuccessfully). However next turn its crew had bailed! Never ones to pass up such an opportunity the Stuarts demonstrated the effectiveness of 3 weapon slots filled with machine guns... Scenario ends; DV. There is this pretty much undamaged fully armed (it fired twice) Tiger just sitting there see? So we nicked it. Yeah, that's right. Sure we did...
I must say though, this campaign is sure hard on my AUX troops! (Poor SOB's... They must hate my unit by now!)
Support troops are usually 2-3 Batteries Arty 75/105 or occasionally 155mm plus as many cheap leg infantry as I can get... (Usually about 1 Coy, but more if I can afford it.) In the Paris scenario I tried out some para's (2 platoons plus some recon squads in 4 C47's) which seemed to work rather well.
Will report further when I have booted the squareheads off this hill. Oh look, here come some Panthers... Typical Krauts, no sense of humour at all...

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Post #: 14
- 10/19/2001 1:48:00 PM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Ok, I just looked up one of my exact lists for this campaign. It's for the scenario in which you fight in the hedges (third scenario if I'm not mistaken). underneath I've just listed the addded up totals for each units and vehicles I had chosen by that time, no support troops just my core force. Here goes: -5 M3A2 Halftrack APC
-2 M4 Flame tank
-2 M4 Sherman Flail
-2 M4A2 Sherman MBT
-5 M4A1/76w Shermans MBT
-5 M5 Stuarts light tank
-2 M8 HMC Scott light support tank
-4 M10 Wolverine TD
-2 M20 Scout armoured scout car
-2 FO jeep
-7 Jeep SP60mm mortar
-5 Jeep .50cal HMG
-1 HQ section (free)
-6 Rifle squads
-1 Airborne squad (more added later in the camp)
-1 Army Ranger section
-3 Scout teams
-4 Recon patrols
-3 Bazooka teams
-4 Snipers In the support section I usually buy transport aircraft, some 75mm artillery, extra airborne squads, 12.7mm teams, bazooka teams and if I have points left either some extra tank destroyers or some 155mm howitzers. Btw I too played the game WITHOUT adding points in the preferences log, I don't have the list for the first scenario anymore, unfortunately. I do know I had an enormous amount of cheap upgrade vehicles and infantry. Regards, Pantherblaster

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"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 15
- 10/20/2001 6:33:00 PM   
Richard Harris

 

Posts: 40
Joined: 5/10/2001
Status: offline 		Um, Pantherblaster that list of equipment comes out to nearly 4000pts worth in V6.1! (Actually around 3800pts depending on infantry squad makeup...)
The campaign starts you with only 1400pts at best, plus 400 for each battle to replace losses etc... What version are you using?
Lost my "M6E" Tiger in the Huertgen...
Oh well easy come, easy go...

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Post #: 16
- 10/20/2001 7:38:00 PM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		I don't know how many points my list was in total. I played it with one of the earliest versions. It was about october/november 2000 when I played it. I restate that I did NOT up my points, in fact I didn't even know you good do that until Lars Remmen pointed it down in this thread, honestly.
The list I gave was from the hedge scenario. Until that time I had very, very limited losses (250 points maybe). Regards, Pantherblaster

_____________________________

"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 17
- 10/21/2001 12:44:00 AM   
Pantherblaster

 

Posts: 338
Joined: 11/13/2000
From: Bilthoven, Utrecht, The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Are the points cost for later versions higher or are the offered points for the campaign lower toward later versions of the game? Regards, Pantherblaster

_____________________________

"War is the continuation of politics by all other means"-Vom Kriege, Carl von Clausewitz.

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 18
- 10/21/2001 10:32:00 AM   
Richard Harris

 

Posts: 40
Joined: 5/10/2001
Status: offline 		Admittedly this is a bit of a generalisation, but as the game has been updated with newer versions point costs for equipment have increased. (Perhaps this will change with V7.)
For example in V6.1:
M5A1 Stuart; 110pts
M4A3(76)W Sherman; 160pts
M10 Wolverine; 125pts
M4A1 Flame; 120pts
US Halftracks; anywhere between 35-40odd pts
1944 US Infantry squads (inc A/B etc) average out to around 30pts each...
Makes life interesting to say the least!

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Post #: 19
- 10/22/2001 7:22:00 AM   
Bing

 

Posts: 1366
Joined: 5/20/2000
From: Gaylord, MI, USA
Status: offline 		Though not the only way to do it, the method I've used to eventually get more and better equipment is to load up the very first selection with cheap units - light trucks and that sort of thing - then replace them with better units in the next scenario. Never did artificially inflate the purchase points, even so mostly got what I thought worked pretty well. Takes time to get the upgraded Shermans across the board, in the meantime I let the Aux units take the heavy fire - that way I have more points to replace units rather than repair them. For instance, I find the .30 cal MMG's to mostly be a pain in the you-know-what. I get covering fire from the HT's, therefore don't need MMG squads that can't keep up with the others. So the .30s gradualy become Shermans, and so on. Bing

_____________________________

"For Those That Fought For It, Freedom Has a Taste And A Meaning The Protected Will Never Know. " -
From the 101st Airborne Division Association Website

(in reply to AbsntMndedProf)
Post #: 20
- 10/22/2001 7:38:00 AM   
john g

 

Posts: 984
Joined: 10/6/2000
From: college station, tx usa
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by Richard Harris:
Admittedly this is a bit of a generalisation, but as the game has been updated with newer versions point costs for equipment have increased. (Perhaps this will change with V7.)
No it seems to get worse, the cost of the A0 has gone to 200 pts as of the August beta of the v7 oob. Thats about 100 points less core for every campaign that doesn't get upgraded right away. When I tried Tulagi, I could no longer afford the engineer platoon. Other low points campaingns like Arras are in a similar fix. Not to mention how painful it is to lose your A0.
thanks, John.

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