Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Omaha beach (smokeC)

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> Omaha beach (smokeC) Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Omaha beach (smokeC) - 5/21/2004 1:57:13 AM   
No New Messages
mike etc
Matrix Recruit



Posts: 13
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline
So i'm watching this PBS special on D-day the other night, and I kept thinking why didn't they shell the beach with smoke? OR at least why didn't the US infantry pop smoke once they were on the beach? Now it's my understanding that there was a pretty big ledge on Omaha, where the Germany's were postioned. So maybe that would of made a smoke screen rather ineffective. But I know when I play the Omaha scenario later tonight, i'll be using all the smoke I can.
Post #: 1
RE: Omaha beach (smokeC) - 5/21/2004 2:02:36 AM   
No New Messages
mike etc
Matrix Recruit



Posts: 13
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline
and yes I know smoke is more effective in the game then in real life, but still.

(in reply to mike etc)
Post #: 2
RE: Omaha beach (smokeC) - 5/21/2004 2:44:53 AM   
No New Messages
KG Erwin
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline
The answer is simple: put yourself in the position of a soldier landing on a smoke-enshrouded beach. You have no clue about what is in front of you. How could control be maintained on an invasion force landing into the unknown? The fear of what MIGHT be ahead of you overwhelms your discipline--it is replaced by primordial fear. The bad guys can't see you, but they know you are coming.

However, in SPWaW terms, in amphib assaults I use generous amounts of smoke, directly on the beachhead. If you have enough offshore assets to pound the defenders into inaction, the initial landing can be a piece of cake. However, once you move inland, past your smokescreen and into the second line of enemy positions, that's when the battle really starts.

All this doesn't matter--once a force is firmly established onshore, you can consider the battle won. This is rule number one of amphib assaults--get your men ashore, any way you can. Once they are there in adequate force, they will not be forced off the beach.

_____________________________


(in reply to mike etc)
Post #: 3
RE: Omaha beach (smokeC) - 5/21/2004 5:18:29 PM   
No New Messages
m10bob
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 8622
Joined: 11/3/2002
From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
Status: offline
The Air Corps(mostly 9th U.S.air force that day)was to bomb the heck out of the beach defenses but they released late.(Remember,they went in in the dark during inclement weather,and Americans were not pros at night bombing).
Then,the Navy(in theory)was to take out the beach defenses(if any were left),but it was done from a distance(so as to not give warning of the armada's approach).Ergo,when A. Co of the 116th hit that beach,NONE of the defenses had been taken out.
The scene on the beach for the approx 25% of Co A who survived,was "every man for himself,get off the beach"..The panic and confusion was multiplied by the constant mortar,MG,and direct artillery fire coming down on the beach from the Germans,(who were at a height advantage).
The need to drop smoke was never a consideration,in light of the fact the defenses were expected to be knocked out before anybody even got to the beach.
The error of "over-expectations" was repeated at other times during the war..
"The Germans are beaten and fighting with men and boys"(was a common myth),because even when this was the case,the rifle was just as deadly once pointed in the direction of the enemy).
Too,likely the most glaring example of Allied over-optimism was "Market-Garden"..
BTW,The Air Corps got in trouble(wrongfully)for missing the Normandy beaches on D-Day,and so,when Operation Cobra was ready to kick off,the bombers went in ready to hit the enemy with a "nervous-finger" on the bomb site button,and when the lead plane dropped,all dropped,(even though most of the planes had not approached the enemy lines yet).
Members of the American advance RCT's took direct hits,and a MG was killed with his troops.
Long-winded story when the initial question was "Why no smoke",but just wanted to explain the mentality of the moment and point out that it was not a singular moment,but had a commonality in war planning.

_____________________________




(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 4
RE: Omaha beach (smokeC) - 5/25/2004 8:57:25 AM   
No New Messages
Wild Bill
Matrix Legion of Merit


 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline
The four D-Day scenarios have all been updated for version 8.2 by Resisti and me. It should work fine as is, but I'll attach the updated version of Omaha for you, Mike.

Oops, no zips allowed. Write me and I'll send if you wish.

WB

_____________________________


In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to mike etc)
Post #: 5
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> Omaha beach (smokeC) Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.891