Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004 From: Near Columbus, Ohio Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: kev_uk
IJN Pilots went through a rigorous training program where many failed, not sure on the historical replacement figure, but seems good enough.
It is only enough if (and hopefully WHEN) they fix the problem that airgroups with more planes than pilots will steal pilots from the pool even with replacements turned off... Turning on replacements only seem to effect aircraft, not pilots.
Posts: 288
Joined: 6/5/2004 From: South Wales, UK Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: Xargun
quote:
ORIGINAL: kev_uk
IJN Pilots went through a rigorous training program where many failed, not sure on the historical replacement figure, but seems good enough.
It is only enough if (and hopefully WHEN) they fix the problem that airgroups with more planes than pilots will steal pilots from the pool even with replacements turned off... Turning on replacements only seem to effect aircraft, not pilots.
Xargun
Thats interesting. Maybe they should have another option to accept replacement pilots on the screen as well, so you can prioritise where you want your pilots to go.
Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004 From: Near Columbus, Ohio Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: kev_uk
Thats interesting. Maybe they should have another option to accept replacement pilots on the screen as well, so you can prioritise where you want your pilots to go.
Yep. Thats how the KB in my PBEM game has such crappy pilots in it.. By the time the KB came home for replacements, the IJN pool was at like 30 pilots (starts with 100).
Historically speaking dkid the KB get preference when it chose pilots or did it just have to get what it could after the Naval LBA got its choice? How did the Japanese do this?
Do note that (proividing the manual is correct) if there is not enough trained pilots available and more are needed for an air unit, poorly pilots will be provided (as long as aircraft are also available Id guess).
These poorly trained replacement pilots will enter the game with roughly 1/2 the experience of that of the nationality's replacement pilots.
Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004 From: Near Columbus, Ohio Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: incbob
Here is a question.
Historically speaking dkid the KB get preference when it chose pilots or did it just have to get what it could after the Naval LBA got its choice? How did the Japanese do this?
From what I understand the IJN air units only took the top pilots.. I would only assume that CV air wings got the top pick of pilots.. Then the land bases ones - fighters and bombers.. But even little recon groups steal the good pilots away.. I have several Recon groups with experience in the 80s due to this.
Posts: 371
Joined: 9/12/2002 From: Buffalo, NY Status: offline
Will the airgroups draw replacement pilots if they are in stand down mode. That may be a way of dealing with the air groups that have more planes than pilots at the beginning. I think a better solution would be if the air groups matched up number of planes and pilots at oppenning shot of scenario.
That is untrue JohnK; The Japanese Navy undertook to fix their pilot program in 1940. They graduated well over 1000 pilots and 1500 aircrew in '42. It still was not enough but it was not 100!
Also, the numbers in the game for pilot training through the years is just silly. The Japanese did not begin to seriously cut hours till mid-late '43. Till then they were getting the same training that they had been receiving in January '41. Late war Japanese training was awfull but the earlier was not so bad.
That is untrue JohnK; The Japanese Navy undertook to fix their pilot program in 1940. They graduated well over 1000 pilots and 1500 aircrew in '42. It still was not enough but it was not 100!
Also, the numbers in the game for pilot training through the years is just silly. The Japanese did not begin to seriously cut hours till mid-late '43. Till then they were getting the same training that they had been receiving in January '41. Late war Japanese training was awfull but the earlier was not so bad.
Mike
Brady mentioned the number of pilots Japan trained duringthe war years. It was many times what you will get out of the game. We are just resigned to train our pilots manually. It is more micromanagement for Japan but it is possible.
There seem to be differences of opinion regarding what the facts were about Japanese training programs for IJN carrier pilots. I've also seen the 100 pilot per year in Dunnigan's Book. In it he claims that the Japanese never really fix this issue, and disputes the 1000 pilots in 1942 (unless perhaps that includes army and navy?). Based on their response to loss of planes and pilots at Coral Sea, I'd be inclined to belive they really could not replace pilots at this time.
There seem to be differences of opinion regarding what the facts were about Japanese training programs for IJN carrier pilots. I've also seen the 100 pilot per year in Dunnigan's Book. In it he claims that the Japanese never really fix this issue, and disputes the 1000 pilots in 1942 (unless perhaps that includes army and navy?). Based on their response to loss of planes and pilots at Coral Sea, I'd be inclined to belive they really could not replace pilots at this time.
it depends on what one defines as "trained" and opinions do vary. According to some pilots (both japanese & USN) signs of green or incompletely trained IJN pilots was evidenced as early as Eastern Solomons.
Frag was technically correct, least according to Pettie (Sunburst), who stated that even at war's start, the Japanese navy did not have enough qualified pilots to fill out her complete muster of planes (land + carrier) Obviously KB got first pick on the best and the concentration was greatest there.
the only way to prevent airgroups from getting green/incompletely trained pilots is to set the frontline units to no replacements and instead, rotate airgroups that are depleated, fill them out and set aside a period of time for "advanced training" to bring the newbies up to 50-60+ status.
Otherwise you get the greenhorns dumped straight into the frontline units. (which japan appeared to have done historically to a degree) and face the same situation...a mix of battle hardened vets and greenies. the latter who will make the mistakes witnessed by both sides.
I have a modded scenario starting with 1500 pilots in the pool (Japan), with 150 new ones arriving per month. My ggoups that have lots of A/C but short pilots don't seem to recieve them quickly enough.
eg. newly formed group arrives 6 A6M2 zero out of 27 Max. -next turn I recieve 21 A6M zero planes damaged to bring up strength. - Next couple of turns, planes get fixed slowly. - however pilots are not coming fast enough, even though I have more ready A/C than Pilots. (1500 or so in Pilot Pool)
I have a modded scenario starting with 1500 pilots in the pool (Japan), with 150 new ones arriving per month. My ggoups that have lots of A/C but short pilots don't seem to recieve them quickly enough.
eg. newly formed group arrives 6 A6M2 zero out of 27 Max. -next turn I recieve 21 A6M zero planes damaged to bring up strength. - Next couple of turns, planes get fixed slowly. - however pilots are not coming fast enough, even though I have more ready A/C than Pilots. (1500 or so in Pilot Pool)
Possible bug??????
ROFL, I didnt know Japan had an Air National Guard. LOL All those drunk airline pilots should make great kamikazes.
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"Mighty is the Thread! Great are its works and insane are its inhabitants!" -Brother Mynok
Are you guys incinuating that Japanese pilots would be pulled back to (fill in the blank) after a tour of duty? You've gotta be kidding. Need I mention that the US was the ONLY nation to ever do that on any scale? Have you heard of Russian of German pilots having a tour of duty?
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"Mighty is the Thread! Great are its works and insane are its inhabitants!" -Brother Mynok
Many IJA and IJN aces and veteran pilots were pulled off the frontlines to become instructors. Not many made it that far but Japan did try to save veterans from being attrition killed. Although that ddn't much matter after while when the Allies started hitting the Home Islands.
According to Rudel, Hitler tried at least twice to bring him home to train the next generation of bomber pilots but Rudel pleaded to keep fighting and won him over.
< Message edited by Nikademus -- 7/15/2004 5:37:10 AM >
According to Rudel, Hitler tried at least twice to bring him home to train the next generation of bomber pilots but Rudel pleaded to keep fighting and won him over.
It stands to reason that someone who knows how to fly properly will be brought back to teach those who dont. I was commenting on the scale, as in having a miccion cut-off point...only the US. And as long as we're on the subject, not one of the Abbeville Boys got transferred back. Only Galland had any sort of a breather, and he was trying to build a jet squadron.
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"Mighty is the Thread! Great are its works and insane are its inhabitants!" -Brother Mynok
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Japanese Pilot Pool - 
We are just resigned to train our pilots manually. It is more micromanagement for Japan but it is possible.
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