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Best Modernized Treaty battleship?

 
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Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 12:35:10 AM   
Hornblower


Posts: 1361
Joined: 9/10/2003
From: New York'er relocated to Chicago
Status: offline 		Along the same lines as MAVRAAM’s Baddest Battleship thread: What is the opinion of this well read forum as to the best pre-1922 battleship after modernization? Doesn’t matter when she was modernized, but she had to be completed in her first form by the 1922 Washington Treaty. (basically anything built up to the Nelson/Rodney) So, in its final form what was the best ship? Warsprite, QE, Renown, Hood, West Virginia, Tennessee, California, Nagato, Hiei, Mutus, Conte di Cavour, Andrea Doria, etc….
I have my own opinions, but it would like to see what the forum thinks…
Post #: 1
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 12:42:25 AM   
Delphinium

 

Posts: 123
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: United Kingdom (England)
Status: offline 		I'd vote for

1) New Mexico

2) Queen Elizabeth Class (Speed/Balance etc)

(in reply to Hornblower)
Post #: 2
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 12:46:31 AM   
TWolf

 

Posts: 21
Joined: 7/2/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline 		I believe that the HMS Hood should be one of the top contenders in this area.

Later,

T

(in reply to Hornblower)
Post #: 3
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 12:48:19 AM   
kaleun

 

Posts: 5145
Joined: 5/29/2002
From: Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

I believe that the HMS Hood should be one of the top contenders in this area.


One word: "Kabooom"

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Appear at places to which he must hasten; move swiftly where he does not expect you.
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(in reply to TWolf)
Post #: 4
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 1:54:47 AM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hornblower

Along the same lines as MAVRAAM’s Baddest Battleship thread: What is the opinion of this well read forum as to the best pre-1922 battleship after modernization? Doesn’t matter when she was modernized, but she had to be completed in her first form by the 1922 Washington Treaty. (basically anything built up to the Nelson/Rodney) So, in its final form what was the best ship? Warsprite, QE, Renown, Hood, West Virginia, Tennessee, California, Nagato, Hiei, Mutus, Conte di Cavour, Andrea Doria, etc….
I have my own opinions, but it would like to see what the forum thinks…


It really depends on what you are rating them for and what mission.

First off, i'd have to disqualify California, Tennessee and West Virginia because these three ships were rebuilt during WWII and recieved the best that money could buy in terms of up to date technology and electronics, particularily AA. So much so that in all catagories save speed they could be considered modern battleships.

If one is talking "Utility" or all around general purpose in a WWII environment, you might consider a Cavour, Kongo or even Renown. Neither class will top off in a classic BB slugfest, but thanks primarily to their speed they can be utilzed for more missions. For any of these mission that 'dont' involve slugging it out with a slower heavy, their firepower could be decisive if not overpowering. Cavour is marginal in this perspective compared to the other two because of the partnering of their limited firepower with limited protection. They in particular would have to embrace the old style 'battlecruiser' role and avoid if possible confrontations with true battleships. But as raiders (in the Med) they could have proven themselves a nuisance.

From a classic battleline perspective, i'd say either New Mexico or Nagato would be top contenders in my book. The former was, prior to WWII, the most updated USN battleship and i'd give her a good chance against virtually any opponent (outside of Yamato) Same for Nagato, her protection was even more augmented and she retained a fairly fast speed. I'd probably edge Nagato slightly but if so not by very much.

Warspite/QE would be runners up IMO to the former two. Their firepower and electronics are comparible though armor upgrades were not as extensive. (note in a real world environment this counted for squat.....Warspite returning more bang for the buck to the taxpayers than possibly any other British battleship) The classic MK-1 15inch, while not 'wowing' in the sheer penetrative power catagory remained one of the most accurate and reliable battleship weapons of either era (WWI and II)

Hood was never seriously modernized (which was her major problem!) so is disqualified.

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RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 2:11:12 AM   
IanLister

 

Posts: 158
Joined: 4/7/2002
From: Pennine Hills, Northern England, UK
Status: offline 		Warspite...definitely. That's if you judge a battleship by things like effective gunnery, actual performance etc rather than numbers in a book. She was a star.

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Battleaxe Rules!

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RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 4:24:03 AM   
Hornblower


Posts: 1361
Joined: 9/10/2003
From: New York'er relocated to Chicago
Status: offline 		I am in favor of the WV myslelf. Granted it was a moderinzation after a rather hard treatment at PH with the knowledge of what the needs - i.e., air attack, are. ohter then there 21 knot speed, they were the equivilent of ships half there age. BUT, You make a good point with the New Mexico's.

(in reply to IanLister)
Post #: 7
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 12:56:27 PM   
Tiornu

 

Posts: 1126
Joined: 4/1/2004
Status: offline 		Nik's right, we'd better disqualify Cal, Tenn, and WVa because otherwise no one else will have a chance. When it comes to beating the snot out of enemy battleships, these were the tops. Only with regard to speed were they wanting.
There's a good argument for Nagato, the only class I know with 11in deck armor. New Mexico would obviously be the American candidate. QE is slightly behind.
I have a fondness for the Italian rebuilds, but they were too weak to start with. For similar reasons, I like the Kongos.
One thing I know--it ain't Lorraine.

(in reply to Nikademus)
Post #: 8
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/17/2004 4:05:33 PM   
TWolf

 

Posts: 21
Joined: 7/2/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline 		I stand corrected.

Later,

T

(in reply to Nikademus)
Post #: 9
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/18/2004 8:13:05 AM   
Tiornu

 

Posts: 1126
Joined: 4/1/2004
Status: offline 		I see that no one has nominated Parizhkaya Kommuna.

(in reply to Hornblower)
Post #: 10
RE: Best Modernized Treaty battleship? - 7/18/2004 1:58:30 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		HMS Warspite gets my vote or possibly Renown.

Andy

(in reply to Tiornu)
Post #: 11
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