Posts: 1651
Joined: 8/20/2003 From: back in Commiefornia Status: offline
The editor manual says the maximum speed and the cruising speed of aircraft should be entered in knots. However, from my reading of the database and comparison with the data I have in a number of sources, the speed look like miles per hour, and not nautical miles per hour.
Next, please tell me if this is correct: the Ferry range in hexes is calculated using the formula cruising speed X endurance (in minutes) divided by 3600.
Then, how are Extended and Normal radius calculated?
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Joined: 8/26/2003 From: Japan Status: offline
Hi Pascal,
quote:
The editor manual says the maximum speed and the cruising speed of aircraft should be entered in knots. However, from my reading of the database and comparison with the data I have in a number of sources, the speed look like miles per hour, and not nautical miles per hour.
Why don't you try taking the longest range aircraft you can find (speed x endurance), calculate the ferry range a) using the data as in the database, and b) applying a knots to mph correction and then comparing these two results to what is given in the game?
quote:
Next, please tell me if this is correct: the Ferry range in hexes is calculated using the formula cruising speed X endurance (in minutes) divided by 3600.
What it says in the editor manual is "Endurance This is the number of minutes the plane can fly before running out of fuel. The max range of the aircraft in miles is calculated by taking the endurance times the cruising speed and dividing this by 3600".
Now I don't think this can be correct.
distance in miles(or nautical miles) = cruise speed (mph or knots) x endurance/60 (endurance in hours not mins) distance in hexes = cruise speed (mph or knots)/60 (speed on hex/hr basis not mph/knot) x endurance/60 (endurance in hours not mins)
So I think the manual should read distance in hexes, not miles.
Posts: 883
Joined: 7/26/2004 From: Glendora, CA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: Pascal
The editor manual says the maximum speed and the cruising speed of aircraft should be entered in knots. However, from my reading of the database and comparison with the data I have in a number of sources, the speed look like miles per hour, and not nautical miles per hour.
Next, please tell me if this is correct: the Ferry range in hexes is calculated using the formula cruising speed X endurance (in minutes) divided by 3600.
Then, how are Extended and Normal radius calculated?
I asked the same question on the 3rd and still do not have an answer.
"The Editor Manual indicates that the Max Speed and Cruising Speed is based on knots. In checking out some planes, it appears that the speed used is in miles per hour.
Is the speed ratings supposed to be in knots or is this a typo?
Thank you."
In comparing my sources to WITP figures for the aircraft I would say everything is in st. miles and not nautical miles.
Posts: 32265
Joined: 9/20/2000 From: Santa Rosa, CA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: Herrbear
quote:
ORIGINAL: Pascal
The editor manual says the maximum speed and the cruising speed of aircraft should be entered in knots. However, from my reading of the database and comparison with the data I have in a number of sources, the speed look like miles per hour, and not nautical miles per hour.
Next, please tell me if this is correct: the Ferry range in hexes is calculated using the formula cruising speed X endurance (in minutes) divided by 3600.
Then, how are Extended and Normal radius calculated?
I asked the same question on the 3rd and still do not have an answer.
"The Editor Manual indicates that the Max Speed and Cruising Speed is based on knots. In checking out some planes, it appears that the speed used is in miles per hour.
Is the speed ratings supposed to be in knots or is this a typo?
Thank you."
In comparing my sources to WITP figures for the aircraft I would say everything is in st. miles and not nautical miles.
Sounds like a typo to me. I'd go with whichever seems to match the data for the aircraft in the game.
Posts: 1651
Joined: 8/20/2003 From: back in Commiefornia Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: Joel Billings
quote:
ORIGINAL: Herrbear
quote:
ORIGINAL: Pascal
The editor manual says the maximum speed and the cruising speed of aircraft should be entered in knots. However, from my reading of the database and comparison with the data I have in a number of sources, the speed look like miles per hour, and not nautical miles per hour.
Next, please tell me if this is correct: the Ferry range in hexes is calculated using the formula cruising speed X endurance (in minutes) divided by 3600.
Then, how are Extended and Normal radius calculated?
I asked the same question on the 3rd and still do not have an answer.
"The Editor Manual indicates that the Max Speed and Cruising Speed is based on knots. In checking out some planes, it appears that the speed used is in miles per hour.
Is the speed ratings supposed to be in knots or is this a typo?
Thank you."
In comparing my sources to WITP figures for the aircraft I would say everything is in st. miles and not nautical miles.
Sounds like a typo to me. I'd go with whichever seems to match the data for the aircraft in the game.
The definite solution is the answer to the question: are the hexes 60 statute mile or nautical miles across? If statute, the speeds should be mph, if nautical, the speeds should be in knots (and in the latter case there would be a lot of mistakes).
Posts: 300
Joined: 1/6/2003 From: Newnan, GA Status: offline
I am working on some database changes in the editor, also and find this an interesting question, as it impacts other areas of the game. The manual states that the hexes are 60 miles across. It does not state whether these are statute or nautical miles. As an aside, the difference would be 60 st.mi = 57.8nm and 60nm = 62.3 st.mi. To extrapolate, if ship speeds and ranges are in knots, unless there is a mechanism in the game program to do conversions, it would seem right that the hexes are in nm. This would imply a/c speeds and ranges are in nm, despite the database showing data more in line with st.mi., ie. max speed of A5M4 is 270mph or 235kts, but the database lists 270 as the max speed. There are a number of interesting numbers in the database. I was surprised to see 150mm armor on Japanese CA turrets. This is interesting because the most recent and thorough research on Japanese cruisers shows turret armor of 25mm NVC plate. If it is supposed to represent the total turret structure (ie. turret, barbette and structure behind the belt or SPS), this is still wrong as no combination of magazine, barbette or turret protection adds up to 150mm.
Posts: 300
Joined: 1/6/2003 From: Newnan, GA Status: offline
There's something wrong with the endurance formula anyway. The number in the data field for the A5M4 is 200. Now Francillion gives the A5M4 a ferry range of 648nm w/o the 160l ventral drop tank. With external fuel, range was probably 800nm. 800/150 (the cruising speed in knots) = 5.33 hrs or 320 min. 320 x 150 = 48,000/3600= an endurance figure of 13.33?!?. Let's take a wild stab into the dark. 13.33 x 60nm = 799.8nm. So 13 would be ferry range in number of hexes?!.
Posts: 300
Joined: 1/6/2003 From: Newnan, GA Status: offline
Any answers anyone? Is the endurance figure in the database minutes, st.mis or nm.s? Is the endurance formula corerect? I believe it produces range in hexes, but that doesn't correlate with the numbers in the database.
Posts: 300
Joined: 1/6/2003 From: Newnan, GA Status: offline
I think I caught on to the manual. The figure in the database is the number of minutes the a/c can fly at the cruising speed indicated in that field. The game engine converts this to hexes through the formula: endurance (in minutes) x cruising speed divided by 3600 = number of hexes. Take the Ki-30. Cruise speed is 227kts (I'm converting everything to nm to be in line with the ships and subs). Maximum range is 1,017nm. This means 1,017 divided by 227 = 4.48hrs or 269 min. The database shows 270 in the endurance field. Now 270 x 227 = 61,290 divided by 3600 = (voila!) 17 hexes at 60nm per hex.
Posts: 13500
Joined: 5/5/2001 From: Melbourne, Australia Status: offline
The AIR build rate is a single character (value range 0-255), while the AIR pool is two characters (value 0-65535). The DEVICE build rate is however two characters (value 0-32767).
Hey, what can I say. Thats programming .... Michael
Posts: 300
Joined: 1/6/2003 From: Newnan, GA Status: offline
Well it does at least prevent you from putting in the ACTUAL US a/c production figures, like 504 P-47D or 691 B-24H a month and gives the Japanese player in a "Plan Orange" scenario some chance of lasting out 1944.
< Message edited by LTCMTS -- 11/19/2004 7:27:11 PM >
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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Scenario Design >> Ferry, Extended and Normal Range 
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