Revealing Forces

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Empires in Arms the Napoleonic Wars of 1805 - 1815 >> Revealing Forces

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Revealing Forces - 8/28/2004 4:36:31 AM

oldtimer

Posts: 48
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline

Okay I can't find the thread where people were talking about how force strengths of Corp are known at all times, but not what corp is where on the map until combat.

If you read rule 7.5.2.6.3 Reveal Forces: Both sides simultaneoulsy reveal corps identities, the exact size and composition of their forces and their final morale levels.

That seems to me that people don't know the location of a corp, the strength of the corp, or composition of the corp until combat is initiated. The rule above is one of the land phase combat steps.

Post #: 1

RE: Revealing Forces - 8/28/2004 5:08:19 AM

Titi

Posts: 153
Joined: 9/15/2001
From: Montr�al
Status: offline

To summary

you agree with me that following the chapter of game setup [rules 2.X], the national card is show to everybody (it's why the strength of every fleet is public).

you agree also that the strength of every corps is showing on it, so everybody can see that the french guard is 9 factor strong for example.

the FOG is knowing where that f*** corps de guarde is on the map.

As i just tell on another threat you then know where nearly each corps is by watching the foraging losses or the transfert of guarrison between the city on the map, the corps laying on the same city and the strength altering on the national card.

It's not written black on white in the rules, it's just the way it plays.
Now it's why we used to play with 2.4.2.2 using a pencil to record the strengths and keeping it hidden except for the fleets.

< Message edited by Titi -- 8/27/2004 10:09:15 PM >

(in reply to oldtimer)

Post #: 2

RE: Revealing Forces - 8/28/2004 5:30:47 AM

cckcdw

Posts: 34
Joined: 8/28/2004
From: Townsville, Australia
Status: offline

Rule 2.4.2 USING THE NATIONAL CARDS and the ensuing sub rules is the section that covers this question [there is a layout error in my copy that has rules 2.4.3.2 and 2.4.3.3 listed in the wrong places which breaks up the 2.4.2 rule]

After reading 2.4.2 through 2.4.2.2.3 it can be seen that the orginal rules required each player to have their national card stacked with counters indicating the current strength of each corps. If you had 10 inf in your I Corp counters adding up to ten were supposed to be put in the inf box for that corps. The same was to be done for the minor corps. [In every game I played this was not done, each card was laminated and then chinagraph epncils were used to record information (the information remain public though)]

Now the minor corps sheet was a public document, since not all countries were controlled by one player.

There is no statement that these cards are secret, indeed the only reference to secret information is in the 2.4.2 precis that says:

"Which corps each counter respresents is shown on the back of the counter and my be examined by only the owning player, except when its identity must be revealed to the other players (e.g., during a combat-see 7.5.2.6.3). The designation of each fleet (and its movement allowance) is shown on the front of the counter and so its designation and exact strength should always be known to all players."

Taking all this into account this clearly indicates that:
The national cards information is public knowledge and is this visible to all players at all times.
The corps strength is thus know to all
The corps location is known only to the player owning it, except when the rules direct it to be revealed (eg combat) [or to clever players who make notes and keep an eagle eye out]
The fleet strength and location is known to all at all times

I have played in a number of PBeM and FtF games and this has always been the case.

(in reply to oldtimer)

Post #: 3