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The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/16/2004 10:22:01 PM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		I want you guys to keep in mind that Matrix Games doesn't have a payroll, so to speak. Everyone involved here have real jobs, and keeping this company in existence is a voluntary effort.

Don't forget this-- every scenario, every OOB, every Mega Campaign was designed by unpaid volunteers.

The forum membership should offer kudos and a slap on the back to everyone who has contributed.

It is high time we recognized their efforts.

I'm personally grateful to many people who allowed me to offer my contributions, and here's a toast to all of the unsung heroes.

Well done, lads!

< Message edited by KG Erwin -- 10/16/2004 3:31:09 PM >

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RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/16/2004 10:29:41 PM   
Huffy


Posts: 497
Joined: 7/6/2000
From: ,USA
Status: offline 		Agreed.....thank you to all the people involved in creating...updating...., and always enhancing this game.
It is one of the few that has always been on my comp since I first got it...and I have drawers full of games collecting dust.
Thank you,...and take care,
Huffy

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 2
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/16/2004 10:48:51 PM   
pappasmurf


Posts: 55
Joined: 9/27/2004
Status: offline 		Kudo's

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Post #: 3
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/16/2004 11:06:09 PM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		We're all grateful of course. But that doesn't stop us from being perplexed at some of the shortcomings here.

For example, why are there still some problems, even minor, with the mega campaigns?
And, this is timely, why does it take soooooo long to post a finished patch?
Inquiring minds would like to know.

(in reply to pappasmurf)
Post #: 4
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/17/2004 12:33:41 AM   
Hexed Gamer


Posts: 561
Joined: 6/24/2004
Status: offline 		I am of course grateful for Matrix Games giving me Steel Panthers.

Grateful for introducing me to computer wargaming.
Grateful for showing me there is something to do other than chatting with women online.
Grateful for giving me something that I can occasionally call work "sorry dear I am busy beta testing".
Grateful for showing me a new way to not have enough money for models (I have to many as it is).
Grateful for giving me a means to hang out with guys that are mostly like me (believe it or not).

Yep, I am indeed grateful hehe :)

Hmm did I say all that correctly :)

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(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 5
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/17/2004 5:18:58 PM   
Orzel Bialy


Posts: 2664
Joined: 4/4/2002
From: Wisconsin USA
Status: offline 		KG

I'll do my part and say thank you for the hard work and dedication to those people who perform the work. On the flip side I don't believe that the reminder warranted every time someone questions MG protocol. The community hasn't been forgetful or non-appreciative of the efforts...just baffled by the apparent continued lack of follow up and communication in regard to things like patch availability dates, etc.

The recently discovered 8.3 patch that was found in passing by a community member (while the rest of us awaited the formal announcement) is just another example of the type of stuff that Rich12545 made reference to. A lot of us were waiting around for "the word" and the patch has been sitting there apparently. Surely one could venture to ask "why?" without it being seen as an afront to those who worked on the project...right?

I don't meant to be negative...but it's the little things that add up which cause posts like this to become necessary.

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Post #: 6
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/17/2004 6:52:11 PM   
#Vassago

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 7/15/2004
Status: offline 		Hey gives the guys a break!!!

The patch was posted October 16...I was just doing my usual round up check to see if it was there...and against all expectations..IT WAS THERE!

I may have been a tad bit faster that the official annoucement.

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 7
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 12:26:48 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		Orzel, I explained in another thread what I believe are the circumstances which led to this. Vassago, once again, I'm sorry I doubted your word, but this indeed took me by surprise. There were extentuating circumstances, but the fact that the forum moderator wasn't given this information beforehand does disturb me.

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Post #: 8
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 12:47:14 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		More lack of communication from Matrix.

I've asked about the mega campaign problems on this forum SEVERAL times and so far NOBODY from MG has had the courtesy to answer. I've spent more than $100 of my hard earned money with the company and they don't seem to give a sh*t about these concerns. KG, since you've answered posts on this thread that means you've read my post and simply ignored it. What gives with you people?

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 9
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 12:47:23 AM   
m10bob


Posts: 8622
Joined: 11/3/2002
From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

Orzel, I explained in another thread what I believe are the circumstances which led to this. Vassago, once again, I'm sorry I doubted your word, but this indeed took me by surprise. There were extentuating circumstances, but the fact that the forum moderator wasn't given this information beforehand does disturb me.

All of us have been victims of commo breakdowns sometime in life..I can get over it..
Since you are the moderator,it looks like sometimes people hold you accountable,singularly..That is WRONG..
I don't forget that Matrixgames ressurrected SP from the ashes after Mr Gates "latest and greatest flavor o' the week" made SP stop working on my old CPU's..
I would not be so quick to not be forgiving,and should keep in mind that no patches are really owed anybody..
If a company makes a patch,excellent,I'll keep coming back,and that is everybodies option,but I'm a little more loyal than to hold a grudge,(or not notice when a thread has been compromised by somebody with cross-purpose or questionable motive?).
..........................................................The Old Guard

< Message edited by m10bob -- 10/17/2004 5:49:21 PM >

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Post #: 10
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 1:07:27 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		I think a relationship works both ways.

We wait patiently for the patch. The patch date is announced. Then reannounced. We wait patiently some more. The patch is delayed a couple more times. We again wait patiently.

The patch is secretly released with no announcement to the anxious players of the game. Oops, the relationship doesn't work both ways.

Since it takes far less than one minute to post on a forum, and any Matrix staff member could have done it (or KG would have been happy too have posted it for them, I am sure), I find the lack of any official notification to be inexcusable.

Maybe its because I have been around long enough now to remember when Matrix always communicated with us, and made sure we were 'in the know' on things that everyone was anxiously waiting for, that this bothers me so much.

Goblin

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Post #: 11
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 1:08:50 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

We're all grateful of course. But that doesn't stop us from being perplexed at some of the shortcomings here.

For example, why are there still some problems, even minor, with the mega campaigns?
And, this is timely, why does it take soooooo long to post a finished patch?
Inquiring minds would like to know.


Rich, the MCs are not gonna be patched to conform with the latest OOBs, period. Apart from some minor lbm-icon glitches, all of them work fine and are fully playable with the subsequent versions & patches. However, many of the existing game scenarios/campaigns have been updated to incorporate the latest OOB revisions. Some of these are included in the 8.3 patch.

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Post #: 12
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 2:15:21 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		I was speaking specifically of the lost leader problem, the save problem (called a feature but virtually everyone hates it enough for mg to fix it) and LV not being finished. All we've heard in the past have been excuses that don't hold water.

Also, nobody addressed my second question.

KG, not your fault of course, but I'll repeat what I've said before - if I had known then about the MC problems and all the hassles for so long a time I never would have spent my money on them. But even more than the money what I really don't like is the silence and the "to hell with you" attitude toward problems by the company.

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 13
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 3:20:25 AM   
kingwanabee

 

Posts: 103
Joined: 9/27/2004
Status: offline 		Bravo, Matrix Games crew, and thank-you very much! That you are still breathing new life into a great game like Steel Panthers after all these years is truely remarkable. Thanks again!

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 14
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 4:00:19 AM   
Sgt Popov


Posts: 101
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Ga USA
Status: offline 		I do not feel the need to donate, as I have spent $100s of dollars with Matrix Games.

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- Sergeant, what should I do if my parachute won't open?
- Bring it back and I'll replace it.

(in reply to kingwanabee)
Post #: 15
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/18/2004 3:12:43 PM   
rrockw


Posts: 74
Joined: 7/6/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks to all for creating this product which continues to provide me with such enjoyment!

Rich

(in reply to Sgt Popov)
Post #: 16
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/21/2004 4:28:39 PM   
RockinHarry


Posts: 2963
Joined: 1/18/2001
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

I was speaking specifically of the lost leader problem, the save problem (called a feature but virtually everyone hates it enough for mg to fix it) and LV not being finished. All we've heard in the past have been excuses that don't hold water.



#1: The cause of the lost leader problem was never safely identified. I investigated many hours to find out about various data that might have an impact to the issue, but couldn´t find a final solution although it might have helped following MCSE somewhat. Wild Bill probably knows better. Suffice to mention, I´m one of the unpaid volunteers, which are many as Glen already mentioned. Michael Wood who was the programmer of the Mega campaign engine and most parts of the current SPWAW game code left the SPWAW development team somewhere in 2001 or 2002 and since then no programmer was available to make any more bug fixes or code enhancements. What we have now is still a V7.1 mech.exe with a handful bug fixes made by an "outside" programmer so to say. The rest is OOB, LBM, SHP and other minor file "enhancements" that finally lead to an overall V8.3 version.

#2: The save problem: I don´t like the mega cam "save" feature much either and things are made worse by some bug that causes the save file to get corrupted at times. I have my guesses about that bug, but it does not help since a programmer is needed to check the code for it. Since there is currently no programmer....oh well.

#3: LV not beeing finished? It is as much finished as a mamooth project like this can be finished AND under the circumstances it was finished! Many people from all over the world who were (and are) unpaid volunteers contributed and communicated solely by means of the internet. The team leaders did their very best to get it all coordinated and organized and I wouldn´t volunteer to make the job they did since it was so hard after all! Since 2001 when MCLV was released some key members of the team dropped out for various reasons. Don´t know if it was health, job or a simple shift of interests but I respect their decision that SPWAW (and mega cams) can not be the most important thing in life for a very long time. I surely DON´T respect those people who always complain, never contribute and think unpaid volunteers owe them something! I also don´t respect those people who proofed repeatedly that they are unable to read the game manuals or are too lazy to try the forum search feature.

Also a big thanks and RESPECT to Glenn, who both contributed and volunteered to take all that flak from those who don´t!

_____________________________

RockinHarry in the web:

https://www.facebook.com/harry.zann

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 17
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/22/2004 8:03:12 PM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		#1 Lost leader. Don't know the cause? Get a programmer, find the cause and fix it.

#2 Save Game. No programmer? Get a programmer and fix it.

#3 LV not finished. I've been talking about this ad finitum for years (YEARS). The volunteers unable to finish it? Then hire someone to do the job.

The megas are programs we PAID for. They have bugs. Don't give us excuses. Give us results.

"I surely DON´T respect those people who always complain, never contribute and think unpaid volunteers owe them something!"

You talkin' to me? YOU TALKIN' TO ME? I'm not a programmer or a scenario designer or an artist. BUT I contributed in the only way I am capable of. With my money. I bought all four megas. Cost me more than $100. Now that's what I call contributing. And I expect the company to live up to its share of the bargain - by ridding them of bugs.

(in reply to RockinHarry)
Post #: 18
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/22/2004 8:12:35 PM   
Hexed Gamer


Posts: 561
Joined: 6/24/2004
Status: offline 		Rich, just curious, are you this bad on other game's forums?

Just curious, because if I had to list every game out there with significant problems, you know where the program won't even run at all, or where even when it do runs so what, the game was so crummy a person would have trouble caring, it would be a long list.

I am well known for my rants :), and you might as well get over it, everyone here knows the history of your LV rant.

What I want to know, is when are you going to accept what has already been said (by everyone that could count).

Your LV isn't going to be modified further.

Play it or don't, your choice.

I am just assuming you have been very angry a great deal over the years by many wargames that have failed to live up to your needs.

< Message edited by Hexed Gamer -- 10/22/2004 6:13:43 PM >

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Post #: 19
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/22/2004 8:24:38 PM   
JJKettunen


Posts: 3530
Joined: 3/12/2002
From: Finland
Status: offline 		I love you guys!

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Jyri Kettunen

The eternal privilege of those who never act themselves: to interrogate, be dissatisfied, find fault.

- A. Solzhenitsyn

(in reply to Hexed Gamer)
Post #: 20
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/22/2004 11:44:11 PM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		LOL.

Les, you have a lot of chutzpah criticizing my posts considering your history. You don't even use your name.

I've said this several times but I'll repeat it for you.
I'm not so much mad at the game problems (they are, in fact, minor) as the lack of communication and the "hell with the customer" attitude of MG. Do you get it now? Virtually every game I have or have ever had or will ever have has minor bugs. That's not the point. The real point of my constant haranging is the company's attitude. OK?

(in reply to JJKettunen)
Post #: 21
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/23/2004 1:20:48 AM   
Hexed Gamer


Posts: 561
Joined: 6/24/2004
Status: offline 		What's n a name rich (I am sure mom doesn't call you rich12545 :)).

I changed the ID for matters of closure. The old name was not on my birth certificate either heheh.

I will agree, some things happen here at Matrix Games, and a person is left to wonder "why". Sometimes the reason I might not know something, is simply I am not Matrix Games staff and not on the staff email list hehe.

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Post #: 22
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/23/2004 4:02:08 AM   
Paul Vebber


Posts: 11430
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Portsmouth RI
Status: offline 		Rich, David Heath himself has addressed the issue and your continued complaints on things that are either unable to be identified, as the designer intended, or issues of additional documentation that was "nice to have" but not an impact on game play are simply redundant to the absurd.

How many times do we have to say "no" before you get the message? This has benn going on literally for YEARS with you.

IF you must feel free to keep posting though...

You may hope that people forget we have answered this many times before. BUt we'll keep reminding them that we have.

Its hardly "to hell with the customer" if you keep making the same complaints over and over and over and we get tired of giving the same answer over and over and over.

Our customer service speaks for itself, as many of the appreciative emails demonstrate.

You can't please all of the people all the time.

(in reply to Hexed Gamer)
Post #: 23
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 1:21:01 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		David Heath, himself, addressed these to me personally. First he said that Brent was the ONLY person in the whole world qualified to add a few pictures and text at the end of MCLV and that he would not assign it to anyone else. (Paraphrased) And Brent told me that although he would like to finish the project that first, he was having medical problems, and second, that DAVID WANTED HIM TO WORK ON OTHER THINGS INSTEAD OF FINISHING MCLV.
As for my other two complaints, David told me that Michael Woods did the programming and was nowhere to be found. Tough luck. Yeah, like, he's the only programmer in the world capable fixing a couple of bugs.
This tells me that Matrix has a "to hell with the consumer" attitude and that's my opinion. The only thing we agree on is that this has been going on for YEARS. And whose fault is that?

Paul, I have NEVER complained about SPWAW. In fact I have done nothing but shower you folks with praise for YEARS on that score. What you've done with SP, for free, is beyond the call of duty. But you need to get your act together and fix the products that we paid for.

(in reply to Paul Vebber)
Post #: 24
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 2:19:41 AM   
Paul Vebber


Posts: 11430
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Portsmouth RI
Status: offline 		Like I said, I respect your right to complain, appreciate your support, but feel there are two sides to the story.

Both sides are out there and I leave it to the forum readership to decide if its an issue to them or not.

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 25
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 2:40:47 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		The forum readership?
Paul, doing the right thing for your customers isn't a popularity contest. You either do or you don't. The MCs have problems. They've been problems for YEARS and you folks refuse to fix them and only offer lame excuses. And you've made it clear that you will NOT do the right thing for your customers, but that doesn't stop me from giving my opinion on that decision.

(in reply to Paul Vebber)
Post #: 26
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 2:49:23 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		Rich, even after hearing from David, you're not willing to let it go? C'mon man, that borders on obsessiveness.

You've gotten personal attention from the management, but you are still not happy? I have nothing but the highest praise for Matrix' customer support, and the vast majority of gamers here will agree with me.

You're turning into Don Quixote, rich. Get a grip.

_____________________________


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Post #: 27
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 3:05:28 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		Get a grip?

Are you saying I don't have the right to express my opinion? I spent over $100 on the MCs and I can't even gripe when they still need fixing after years? KG, with respect, I think it's you who needs to get a grip.

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 28
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 3:38:55 AM   
Hexed Gamer


Posts: 561
Joined: 6/24/2004
Status: offline 		Currently, after a bit of reading elsewhere, therefore with barely any visible respect, Rich take it somewhere else.

I can assure you, you are as boring as they tell me all my unwanted viewpoints are.

And I don't care how much money you spent to be as tediously boring as you are being.

And as I am not in anyway a Matrix Games voice, you can assume "I" said this for "ME"

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Post #: 29
RE: The Matrix Volunteer Appreciation Thread - 10/24/2004 3:56:13 AM   
rich12545

 

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
Status: offline 		And that is your opinion. You're entitled to it. I don't agree but I would fight to the death for your right to express it.

If you get bored, you're under no obligation to read my posts. Maybe there's some way you can filter me out. Feel free. Sometimes I'd like to do that to you. Your posts have caused so much trouble on the two forums that you felt compelled to change your name.

(in reply to Hexed Gamer)
Post #: 30
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