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Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2

 
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Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 5:36:30 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		All those tankers that got torpedoed... or every time a ship went down...

Not all of that oil burns off, and it's got to go somewhere.

And all those small airfields built on atolls, those are coral reefs were talking about! Digging out an airfield from a live reef! Imagine the outcry from Green Peace! Or having a vessal get sunk nearby, with all that oil leaking out, corrupting the place!

Not that I'm sympathizing. You do what you have to do. I don't believe in pulling punches. But I'd bet it would make an interesting Master's Thesis on "The environmental impact of war in Truk lagoon." I know Truk is now a Mecca for divers, and quite nice. Does that mean that our environment is more resiliant than we give it credit for, all the crying over oil-spills is over-rated?

(* trolls *)

-F-

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 5:45:23 PM   
MengCiao

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 7/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

All those tankers that got torpedoed... or every time a ship went down...

Not all of that oil burns off, and it's got to go somewhere.

And all those small airfields built on atolls, those are coral reefs were talking about! Digging out an airfield from a live reef! Imagine the outcry from Green Peace! Or having a vessal get sunk nearby, with all that oil leaking out, corrupting the place!

Not that I'm sympathizing. You do what you have to do. I don't believe in pulling punches. But I'd bet it would make an interesting Master's Thesis on "The environmental impact of war in Truk lagoon." I know Truk is now a Mecca for divers, and quite nice. Does that mean that our environment is more resiliant than we give it credit for, all the crying over oil-spills is over-rated?

(* trolls *)

-F-


You're forgetting:

1) the "environment" is not only largely destroyed, but what little is left is only a crappy, impoverished version of what the world was like before it was totally trashed from pole to pole
2) WWII did have the immense benefit of stopping whaling for a few years. Whale populations exploded while mankind was busy blowing up whaling ships.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 5:45:59 PM   
Brady


Posts: 10701
Joined: 10/25/2002
From: Oregon,USA
Status: offline 		I have often thought of this as well, just think of all the Tankers that were sunk off the east coast in WW2 During the second Happy time..operation Drum Beat, and what if any impact those spills have had today.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 5:51:47 PM   
ElvisDaKing


Posts: 130
Joined: 9/7/2004
From: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Status: offline 		Well, if Greenpeace boats were present in game, then OOB must be modified to add french frogmen…

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 5:54:21 PM   
Clipper1968


Posts: 445
Joined: 7/22/2004
From: LA, Ca
Status: offline 		We would probably have sunk their boats...

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 6:08:38 PM   
MengCiao

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 7/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Brady

I have often thought of this as well, just think of all the Tankers that were sunk off the east coast in WW2 During the second Happy time..operation Drum Beat, and what if any impact those spills have had today.


Good question. Right now in North Carolina there are so many other things messing up the coast that you probably wouldn't even notice the difference from a few tankers being blown up by subs.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 6:35:39 PM   
Brady


Posts: 10701
Joined: 10/25/2002
From: Oregon,USA
Status: offline 		If memory serves somthing like 600 ships were lost off the east coast and in the carabiean, and given that the freighters and other ships typicaly had conseradable bunkerage I would think even they would of presented some kind of issue. Many ships went down in sight of land as well.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 6:35:58 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		I just had 12 tankers sunk off Palembang while loading oil. Definately getting taken off Greenpeace's Xmas card list....

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 6:39:46 PM   
Brady


Posts: 10701
Joined: 10/25/2002
From: Oregon,USA
Status: offline 		When I was in my early 20's I had this beater of a Toyata, it leaked stuff from almost every posable source and left a slick behind it on rany days, my bosses wife looked at me one day while we observed the oil streak that lindicated the path I had taken to get to their house on a wet streat, she said "Bradyyour just not a frend of the enviourment are you"....

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 6:57:25 PM   
ElvisDaKing


Posts: 130
Joined: 9/7/2004
From: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Status: offline 		I saw a document someday ago about a US Tanker sunk by one these kamaikaze torpedoes at Saipan.
The ship went down quite quickly with a huge part of her cargo.
Some years ago, so more than 50 years after the events, a US Navy operation recovered the cargo, millions of avgas litres, which were remaining in the belly of the tanker at the bottom of the sea…(not very deep).
I know also that fuel is still leaking from the BB Arizona at the bottom of PH bay.

So there is still danger of sea pollution due to WWII , but fortunately it seems that, in some case, governments are concerned about this…

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:14:17 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		we should be more worried about the fact that the average temperatures in the polar regions are increasing yearly. Thats alot of ice meltin.....

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:19:35 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline 		But Global Warming is just a theory.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:22:33 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		tell that to the Polar Bears.... (glug glug)

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:38:57 PM   
MengCiao

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 7/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

But Global Warming is just a theory.


I thought it was a confirmed observation. What is a bit theoretical is to what extent some of it is part of some "normal" cycle...like the normal cycle that cataclysmically alters the circulation of the Gulf Stream when the planet goes in and out of "Ice Ages" and so on.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:51:07 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		Living in Land o' Lakes, Florida, I welcome our new Global Warming Masters. At 81' above sea-level in Central Florida, I'm kinda looking forward to having beach-front property.

-F-

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 7:56:33 PM   
PeteG662


Posts: 1263
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Status: offline 		Time to move inland or get scuba gear!

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Post #: 16
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 8:06:43 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MengCiao

quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

But Global Warming is just a theory.


I thought it was a confirmed observation. What is a bit theoretical is to what extent some of it is part of some "normal" cycle...like the normal cycle that cataclysmically alters the circulation of the Gulf Stream when the planet goes in and out of "Ice Ages" and so on.


It's a joke. I'm making fun of a certain US politican who wants more data before he makes up his mind as to whether it really exists or not.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 8:36:56 PM   
watchtower


Posts: 867
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Republic of Kilburn. London UK
Status: offline 		Well this is henderson 1n 2002 - I'ts the green patch on right ( http://home.earthlink.net/~jfeenstra/south_pacific_tour.htm ) taken from this site.




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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 8:37:37 PM   
watchtower


Posts: 867
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Republic of Kilburn. London UK
Status: offline 		don't look too bad!!!

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Post #: 19
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 8:44:40 PM   
dereck


Posts: 2800
Joined: 9/7/2004
From: Romulus, MI
Status: offline 		You have to remember that when a submarine torpedoed a tanker that not only was the oil spilling into the ocean but it was also BURNING. Probably wasn't much oil left that hadn't been burnt away.

From watching shows on the History Channel about convoys and seeing them talk to ex-merchant marine sailors who served on convoy ships it seems as if the tankers, when torpedoed, caused an explosion which naturally resulted in the oil/gas starting fire.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 8:47:50 PM   
MengCiao

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 7/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

quote:

ORIGINAL: MengCiao

quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

But Global Warming is just a theory.


I thought it was a confirmed observation. What is a bit theoretical is to what extent some of it is part of some "normal" cycle...like the normal cycle that cataclysmically alters the circulation of the Gulf Stream when the planet goes in and out of "Ice Ages" and so on.


It's a joke. I'm making fun of a certain US politican who wants more data before he makes up his mind as to whether it really exists or not.


I know...but the only real controversy is whether the likely range of fairly catastrophic events is "normal" or not. If there is no human impact driving the changes, then things are a great deal worse than they seem.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 9:02:39 PM   
watchtower


Posts: 867
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Republic of Kilburn. London UK
Status: offline 		Some scrap here - anyone ID it?




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Post #: 22
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 9:16:12 PM   
watchtower


Posts: 867
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Republic of Kilburn. London UK
Status: offline 		This is a memorial - dude's might have copped it here - look at em!!!!!




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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 9:17:25 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		Maytag.

Model 1964.

Originally available in White, Beige, and Avacado.

-F-

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Post #: 24
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 9:19:27 PM   
watchtower


Posts: 867
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Republic of Kilburn. London UK
Status: offline 		Oooh avacado I'll have one - make it two, One avacado, one beige - will match my jumper.

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Post #: 25
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 10:10:55 PM   
PJJ

 

Posts: 167
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline 		An interesting topic! :D

Does anyone know of any real studies about the environmental effects of WWII? I've never heard about such studies before, but of course that doesn't mean they haven't been done!

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 10:17:57 PM   
Charbroiled


Posts: 1181
Joined: 10/15/2004
From: Oregon
Status: offline 		There was a pretty good documentry about the testing of a A-Bomb on Bikini Island and the long term impact on the islands ecosystem.

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/9/2004 11:53:05 PM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		I'm glad I won't be around when the magnetic poles reverse. 50-100 years of the worst weather and climate changes imaginable!

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RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/10/2004 12:23:37 AM   
Sredni

 

Posts: 705
Joined: 9/30/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		lol, I found myself thinking about valdez after I had a tanker with 18k worth of oil sink off thursday island. Since then I've lost full tankers at palembang, balikpapan, tarakan, and that base on the north side of borneo.

Kinda doubt if there were volunteers running around cleaning up oil, and soaping down wildlife back in january 1942.

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Post #: 29
RE: Imagine if Green Peace had been around in WW2 - 11/10/2004 12:28:58 AM   
madmickey

 

Posts: 1336
Joined: 2/11/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline 		Actually the oil companies wanted to pipeline the oil from Alaska to the Alberta/Montana border than pipe it from there to other location in USA.

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