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How can we stop enemy supply air transport???

 
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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? Page: [1]
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How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 3:33:41 PM   
alek2004xx

 

Posts: 87
Joined: 11/17/2004
Status: offline 		I wonder if it is possible??? I just blocked Pearl Harbour - I captured Hilo and Lathinia (or something like that),my bombers attack any ship that come in close range - but I suppose that US may transport some supplies by air (I'm not sure - but sometimes even that I cut off any water routes some of airplanes start to fight (for example in previous turn 12 vidicators from Pearl Harbour attacked my supply ships and sunk one of them).Because I blocked Pearl Harbour and there is no chance to reach it by sea I suppose that they must deliver some supplies by air - if there weren't new supplies bombers wouldn't be able to attack my ships)
Post #: 1
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 4:18:09 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline 		LRCAP targeting the enemy base is the only way to challenge air supply to that base. Even that does not prevent it, it just gives you a chance to intercept. He has no way to provide escort, so any interception could be bloody. Could also miss entirely, but if you do manage to hit his transports now and then, you may make it expensive for him....

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 9:12:14 PM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		A stupid thing about this.

When you place a sweep mission with a unit stationed at the base receiving the transport mission to intercept the LRCAP. Guess what? They do absolutely nothing! They do not intercept the LRCAP! Instead they go to the O Club and have a beer, while the transport planes are being shot down overhead. Just like it was in UV.

This is another issue never mentioned or addressed.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 9:44:00 PM   
bilbow


Posts: 741
Joined: 8/22/2002
From: Concord NH
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Halsey

A stupid thing about this.

When you place a sweep mission with a unit stationed at the base receiving the transport mission to intercept the LRCAP. Guess what? They do absolutely nothing! They do not intercept the LRCAP! Instead they go to the O Club and have a beer, while the transport planes are being shot down overhead. Just like it was in UV.

This is another issue never mentioned or addressed.


This is not entirely true. I'm allies, holding Mandalay with CAP (escort, not sweep)overhead, the other guy had LRCAP overhead from Padang. I'm resupplying by air from Imphal. There doesn't seem to be interaction between the two CAPs unless his LRCAP intercepts the transports. In this case there is an unseen combat between the CAPs (text messages only). I've only noticed this a few times, but that time my AVG chopped up a bunch of Oscars. I confirmed it with the plane loss report. CAP over the recieving base will defend the transports. He hasn't put LRCAP over Mandalay since.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 9:47:11 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline 		The only way I can think of to do anything to an enemy LRCAP mission in a hex would be to send a heavily escorted strike mission against that hex (only possible if enemy-controlled, obviously). The escorts might possibly hurt the LRCAP-ing unit so badly that it would have to break off....but why don't I really think so?

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 9:48:58 PM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		Except that Sweeps are supposed to intercept CAP.

Also if that's the case you describe in your situation, then a recon mission from another allied base to Mandalay should give the same results. Never seen it.

< Message edited by Halsey -- 1/9/2005 1:55:02 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 11:10:50 PM   
BlackVoid


Posts: 639
Joined: 10/17/2003
Status: offline 		I really dont think he can transport from the US, it is way too far away.

Maybe Dutch harbor (hint: hit it with 8 BBs if that is the case ;) ).

If the enemy supply base is in the south, that is easy to hit too.

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Post #: 7
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 11:21:17 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, A sweep will engage enemy CAP but not enemy transports. The two combats do not occur in the same part of an air phase. The sweep should have already came and left before transports begin arriving. The only way to intercept transports is to have LRCAP over the hex.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 11:30:41 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		Noob time!

If I LRCAP over the (enemy) base that the transports are flying from, do I intercept?

Or do I have to LRCAP the destination hex of the transports?

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/9/2005 11:40:02 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, destination. The transports will have already taken off before your CAP arrives over their airfield.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 12:47:01 AM   
dtravel


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Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, A sweep will engage enemy CAP but not enemy transports. The two combats do not occur in the same part of an air phase. The sweep should have already came and left before transports begin arriving. The only way to intercept transports is to have LRCAP over the hex.


Will LRCAP engage or be engaged by the CAP from fighters based in the LRCAP's target hex?

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 1:03:34 AM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, No not normally. However if the enemy LRCAP tries to engage the friendly transports then the CAP will intervene. (LRCAP does not fly directly over the airfield but rather around it. When they try to intercept the transports the friendly CAP is vectored out to intervene. Without this action the two forces do not normally come into contact since if the player sending the LRCAP wished to engage the airfield CAP he would have just sent a sweep. But he is instead trying to intercept traffic into the hex. The airfield CAP is protecting the hex and could care less about enemy fighters unless they engage friendly aircraft.

< Message edited by Mogami -- 1/9/2005 6:04:28 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 1:23:27 AM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		Mogami,

This might sound like a silly question but I would like to know before-hand in case I run into it.

Suppose I have LCU's attacking an enemy base. The enemy base has CAP. I am trying to supply my LCU by airdrops. Do I use a sweep or LRCAP to protect my transports? Or, would escort take care of it just like escorting bombers?

Any difference if the target enemy base has enemy LRCAP up instead of CAP?

Thanks in advance.

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Post #: 13
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 2:35:25 AM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		I'm actually fairly sure there's nothing that can be done about air-tran. The problem is that the air-tran phase is -after- all Cap/Lcrap/Sweep missions have taken place (and landed).

I've seen a few of my transports lose pilots due to fatigue. But I fly a LOT of transport missions, even into very contested areas (even with negative air-bal), and they always fly. I might not get 100% participation, but it could be from moral, fatigue, leaders, whatever. Enough that I'd say the reason they didn't fly was because of anything BUT Cap/Lcrap/Sweep.

Seems like an "issue" to me. But what's good for the goose, is good for the gander, so I don't complain.

-F-

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 3:05:06 AM   
String


Posts: 2661
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Estonia
Status: offline 		LRCAP intercepts transport missions

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Post #: 15
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 3:10:38 AM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, Air transport is like bombing missions. You can't always stop it but you can interfere with it.

To stop enemy transports over one of your bases just put up CAP.
To stop enemy transport over one of his bases send LRCAP.
CAP is over the assigned hex the entire turn including air transport phase.

To clear the way for your transports over enemy hex send in a sweep.
To provide protection over a hex assign CAP.

The fighting against transports does not have a combat animation. Instead in the lower left had corner you will see Blue and Yellow text messages.

The Sweep will not be over the target when your transports arrive however it will have arrived and fought the CAP reducing it in number.

CAP in a hex where friendly transports are conducting a mission acts as escorts.
CAP in a hex where enemy transports are conducting a mission act as intercepters (same they do against enemy bombers or fighter sweeps)

There is nothing complex in what you need to do and I hope I have helped clear up any confusion.

Air transport missions are sheldom the type that can be completed in a single day. If you are trying to stop the enemy you'll need to measure success over time. Do enough paras arrive to capture the base? Does supply arrive in quanity enough to allow the enemy to keep fighting?
You measure success of your transport operations the same way. Before you assign transport mission to a hex send a sweep of fighters to find out what is protecting the hex.
While you are conducting the operation send both CAP and Sweep missions.

CAP does not engage CAP. Sweeps engage CAP

< Message edited by Mogami -- 1/9/2005 8:12:48 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 4:53:44 AM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		So which mission will intercept LRCAP interdicting incoming transports?
Shouldn't a Sweep attack the LRCAP?

< Message edited by Halsey -- 1/9/2005 8:54:25 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 5:33:24 AM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, Yes. Is it not workig?

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Post #: 18
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 8:21:14 AM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		I haven't seen it. It didn't work in UV either.

Here's how I initialize it.
Example: Akyab is isolated and I am flying Dakota's from Chandpur in a supply lift.
Oscar's flying LRCAP from Mandalay are flying LRCAP over Akyab. With a HurricaneII's on Sweep mission stationed at Akyab flying the mission. I have yet to see an interception of the LRCAP.

I had the same thing happen in UV while flying transports to Moresby. Tried both CAP and Sweep missions from Moresby. No cigar. The transports were always intercepted by LRCAP.

So, does the Sweep mission have to been flown from another base to get the interception? Sweep missions from a squadron stationed at the destination of the supply lift should be flying against the LRCAP, but they don't.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 9:10:20 AM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: alek2004xx

I wonder if it is possible??? I just blocked Pearl Harbour - I captured Hilo and Lathinia (or something like that),my bombers attack any ship that come in close range - but I suppose that US may transport some supplies by air (I'm not sure - but sometimes even that I cut off any water routes some of airplanes start to fight (for example in previous turn 12 vidicators from Pearl Harbour attacked my supply ships and sunk one of them).Because I blocked Pearl Harbour and there is no chance to reach it by sea I suppose that they must deliver some supplies by air - if there weren't new supplies bombers wouldn't be able to attack my ships)


If you´re playing against AI they will bomb you no matter if there´s supply or not. Couldn´t believe it but I´ve been sieging (is this spelling correct?) Calcutta for several months with all adjacent hexes under my control and have LRCAP over the base and no supplies arrive there. After a few month I wondered why AI has so many planes stationed there which are getting bombed all the time by my Sallies. And I wondered too, how could up to 50-60 Liberators bomb me out of Calcutta everv two or three days. So I started as Allies and what did I see?!?!? About 1000 supplies in Calcutta ALL LCUs are completly out of supplies, but AI is still bombing me in a massiv way! So how can that be? AI is bringing in squadron after squadron attacks me, but the LCUs are starving! About 110.000 ground units trapped in Calcutta without supplies but AI bombs me!

Are there any restrictions to the AI?

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Post #: 20
RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 9:11:32 AM   
tabpub


Posts: 1019
Joined: 8/10/2003
From: The Greater Chicagoland Area
Status: offline 		I don't think that you can "sweep" your base that you are originating from. Sweep would be considered an offensive mission, and I don't think that it would even fly if targeted at a friendly base. Reccomend that you find some longer legged fighters, base them at Chandpur with the C47's and fly the sweep mission from there and see if that has any success.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 11:11:22 AM   
testarossa


Posts: 952
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Vancouver, Canada
Status: offline 		Playing on hard, aren't you? AI doesn't need supplies on hard.

< Message edited by testarossa -- 1/10/2005 1:12:31 AM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 5:15:47 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: testarossa

Playing on hard, aren't you? AI doesn't need supplies on hard.


Yeah playing on hard! What a sh.., I thought this would be at very hard. If I have known that I wouldn´t have played on hard. That´s too unrealistic for me. So why should I then go after enemy cargo-TFs? Just to get some VP?

< Message edited by castor troy -- 1/10/2005 4:16:04 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 5:48:10 PM   
Mr.Frag


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From: Purgatory
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quote:

AI doesn't need supplies on hard.


AI *does* need supplies on Hard. Don't know where you got that from.

It's a little lax on fuel requirements, not supplies

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/10/2005 10:37:19 PM   
testarossa


Posts: 952
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Vancouver, Canada
Status: offline 		I keep messing up hard and very hard, sorry.

I had Japs cut off in Burma for 8 months. Japs were able to fly bombing missions from Mandalay all that time. I’ve switched to Jap side and checked their supply level, it was 0 for the base, ground troops had around 30-50% of required supply. So I was checking them from time to time and ground troops didn’t incur any losses from starvation.

May be I am wrong with this but on hard AI acts like it doesn’t need any supplies at all.

< Message edited by testarossa -- 1/10/2005 3:49:55 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/11/2005 12:09:47 AM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		Deleted - read the post wrong.

< Message edited by witpqs -- 1/10/2005 2:13:01 PM >

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/11/2005 9:23:12 AM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		This is what doesn't make a lick of sense. Why should the HQ at my forward airbase call back to a rear area airbase for Sweep protection. When there are fighter assets already there. I fail to understand the reason for this.

I take that back. This was designed that way to keep fighters from gaining experience flying offensive sweep missions over their own base. I know this is the answer.

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RE: How can we stop enemy supply air transport??? - 1/11/2005 9:58:35 AM   
2ndACR


Posts: 5665
Joined: 8/31/2003
From: Irving,Tx
Status: offline 		LRCAP will rip apart supply transports. There will be no animation when they do, but if you watch the messages down in the corner you will see them occur.

I just wish that you could send escorts with them.

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Post #: 28
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