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Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 2:35:33 AM   
Huskalator

 

Posts: 212
Joined: 5/17/2002
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		Hey,

I love the savagery and brutality of the Eatern Front(WWII) and I am looking for a good book about it. I was hoping the good folks of this forum would be so kind as to make some recomendations.

I am looking for something that covers the entire war period but certain operations I don't mind. The most important things to me are an unbiased author, maps and picures(I don't want to look up a map of Russia every five pages), and some good first-hand accounts of the front line mixed in with the strategic info.

My favorite WWII book that I have right now is The Pacific Campaign by Dan van der Vat. Its exactly the things I have listed. I would recommend it to anyone looking to get a good Pacific theatre book. Its got great info on the battles and the people behind them, maps, and some great frontline soldier testimonial like a Japenese soldier in New Guinea bemoaning the fact that they have to search for potatoes all day because their supply situation is so bad.

Anyway, your help would be appreciated.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 3:44:27 AM   
SemperAugustus

 

Posts: 257
Joined: 1/9/2005
Status: offline 		David Glantz is good e.g. "When Titans Clashed" and John Erickson's "The Road to Stalingrad" and "The Road to Berlin" isn't bad either

< Message edited by SemperAugustus -- 2/3/2005 2:16:02 AM >

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Post #: 2
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 4:52:48 AM   
EricGuitarJames

 

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From: Not far enough away for some!
Status: offline 		I have Van der Vat's book and I too would recommend it.

For an Eastern Front book, there is no such thing as an 'unbiased author' (each brings their own 'spin' to a subject no matter how noble their intentions) but 'Russia's War' by Richard Overy is my personal favourite on the subject.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 5:05:51 AM   
Warfare1


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Status: offline 		Another great book about the Pacific War is:

"The Rising Sun" by John Toland

The Eastern Front:

"Barbarossa" by Alan Clark

"Stalingrad" by Antony Beever (This book is a real page-turner and includes lots of info about the initial German invasion of the USSR, etc as well as other events leading up to Stalingrad.)

< Message edited by Warfare1 -- 2/3/2005 3:07:15 AM >

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 7:39:13 AM   
Heliotic

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Warfare1
"Barbarossa" by Alan Clark


I found this book quite good!

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 2:43:44 PM   
Speedysteve

 

Posts: 15998
Joined: 9/11/2001
From: Reading, England
Status: offline 		I too found Beavor's book 'Stalingrad' very good. Very readable and with detailed accounts of the horror of the battle.

I've also ready Erickson's books. Also well written and detailed.

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Post #: 6
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 4:14:17 PM   
Salient

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 8/4/2003
From: Belgium
Status: offline 		"In Deadly Combat : A German Soldier's Memoir of the Eastern Front"

by Gottlob Herbert Bidermann

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 5:11:24 PM   
pzgndr

 

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Status: offline 		Albert Seaton's "Russo German War, 1941-45," is a very good reference. I also recommend Glantz's "When Titans Clashed," since this uses some historical archive information released after the Soviet Union collapsed - information that wasn't entirely available for Seaton's study published in 1993.

And besides reading about the Eastern Front, be sure to check out Schwerpunkt's Russo-German War.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/3/2005 7:58:03 PM   
Maliki


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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 2:11:28 AM   
wodin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Salient

"In Deadly Combat : A German Soldier's Memoir of the Eastern Front"

by Gottlob Herbert Bidermann


Good call.

Panzer Battles by Mellenthin. Covers all theaters and a good portion of the book is eastern front. Nearly finished it and its a good read.

Stalingrad: Memories and Reassessment (Cassell Military Paperbacks S.)
Heinrich Graf Von Einsiedel, Joachim Wieder.

Havent read it but have it on order and it looks a good read.

Theres a new fiction book thats superb, based on the siege of CHolm and Velikiye Luki. Excellent read I finished it last week and couldnt put it down. its called......

Siege: A novel of the Eastern Front 1942 by Russ Schneider

Some more

Tigers in the Mud: The Combat Career of German Panzer Commander by Otto Carius

Blood Red Snow: The Memoirs of a German Soldier on the Eastern Front by Gunter K. Koschorrek

Iron Horsemen: The Memoirs of Obergefreiter Ernst Panse, 24 Panzer Division, Stalingrad, 1942-1943 by Ernst Panse

Fighting in Hell: the German Ordeal on the Eastern Front by Peter G. Tsouras

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Post #: 10
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 2:48:54 AM   
IronDuke_slith

 

Posts: 1595
Joined: 6/30/2002
From: Manchester, UK
Status: offline 		I'd recommend "When Titans clashed" as well. I'd avoid Erickson if I were you, if only because it can be a difficult read. Exceptionally well detailed, but hard work.

On individual campaigns, Glant and House's "The Battle of Kursk" stands out, as does Glantz's "Before Stalingrad", although anything by Glantz can be safely recommended. Alan Clark is fine but 40 years old if memory serves so it will not take account of the post cold war archive work in Russia.

Amongst the memoirs, I'd echo the poster who suggested Von Mellenthin. He seems to have served in several critical places during the war, and mixes in good interesting opinion with his narrative. Guderian and Manstein's memoirs are also fascinating.

Brian Taylor's new two volume day by day narrative is also a useful reference but maybe a bit dry for what you are after.

Beevor is also good, I haven't read Berlin yet, but will do eventually having enjoyed Stalingrad.

Regards,
IronDuke

< Message edited by IronDuke -- 2/4/2005 12:49:24 AM >

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 2:51:37 AM   
freeboy

 

Posts: 9088
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From: Colorado
Status: offline 		I rememberreading, "The Tiger s are Burning" anyone else ever read that.. I got it as a youth through the Military Book Club, it wasn't strategic in nature, more a studay, as best I recall in Kursk and why heavy tanks faired poorly against Russian troops, not tanks

< Message edited by freeboy -- 2/4/2005 8:51:53 AM >

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 3:19:47 AM   
wodin


Posts: 10762
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: England
Status: offline 		No machine gun on the new Tiger "Porsche". Bit of a problem that.

New Panthar tanks went up in flames due to poor armour around the gas pipes!!

Stalingrad By A Beevor is an excellent read as others have mentioned. I lent it to some one who isnt really ino warfare and when he'd finished he said its the best book he has ever read, he has read many books aswell!

< Message edited by wodin -- 2/4/2005 1:21:17 AM >

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 7:32:39 AM   
SemperAugustus

 

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Joined: 1/9/2005
Status: offline 		Anyone read Ziemke's books, e.g. Moscow to Stalingrad, Stalingrad to Berlin?

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Post #: 14
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/4/2005 9:59:40 PM   
SeaMonkey

 

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Status: offline 		Try "The Forgotten Soldier", by Guy Sajer, an autobiography of a Franco-German kid of 17 in the Grossdeutschland.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/5/2005 11:02:31 AM   
Marc von Martial


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeaMonkey

Try "The Forgotten Soldier", by Guy Sajer, an autobiography of a Franco-German kid of 17 in the Grossdeutschland.


He asked for a good book, not a fairy tale

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/5/2005 4:36:00 PM   
IronDuke_slith

 

Posts: 1595
Joined: 6/30/2002
From: Manchester, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck

quote:

ORIGINAL: SeaMonkey

Try "The Forgotten Soldier", by Guy Sajer, an autobiography of a Franco-German kid of 17 in the Grossdeutschland.


He asked for a good book, not a fairy tale


I too have seen heated debate over whether it is really autobiographical. I've never read it, though. Is it his description of the Heer and combat that don't convince, or his attempts to convince us that he was a member of the GD?

Regards,
IronDuke

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Post #: 17
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/5/2005 5:34:24 PM   
Warfare1


Posts: 658
Joined: 10/20/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronDuke

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck

quote:

ORIGINAL: SeaMonkey

Try "The Forgotten Soldier", by Guy Sajer, an autobiography of a Franco-German kid of 17 in the Grossdeutschland.


He asked for a good book, not a fairy tale


I too have seen heated debate over whether it is really autobiographical. I've never read it, though. Is it his description of the Heer and combat that don't convince, or his attempts to convince us that he was a member of the GD?

Regards,
IronDuke


Here's some information about the controversial nature of the book:

http://members.shaw.ca/grossdeutschland/sajer.htm

(in reply to IronDuke_slith)
Post #: 18
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/5/2005 7:56:12 PM   
Salient

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 8/4/2003
From: Belgium
Status: offline 		Well it might be fake, I did enjoy reading it though.

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Post #: 19
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/5/2005 8:28:44 PM   
Charles2222


Posts: 3993
Joined: 3/12/2001
Status: offline 		Try Russia at War: 1941-1945 by Alexander Werth (close to 1100 pages from a Russian perspective).

Also a favorite around here is Panzer Commander by Hans Von Luck.

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Post #: 20
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/6/2005 3:37:49 AM   
rhondabrwn


Posts: 2570
Joined: 9/29/2004
From: Snowflake, Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Heliotic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Warfare1
"Barbarossa" by Alan Clark


I found this book quite good!


Definitely! The maps are excellent and well placed for easy reference as you read the book. I also found the book to be an even-handed analysis of the war.

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Post #: 21
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/6/2005 3:42:12 AM   
rhondabrwn


Posts: 2570
Joined: 9/29/2004
From: Snowflake, Arizona
Status: offline 		Though obviously influenced by his personal viewpoint, I always found Von Manstein's "Lost Victories" to be a fascinating read. I discovered that one when I was in high school (1960's) and experimenting with my own game designs.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/6/2005 3:48:40 AM   
rhondabrwn


Posts: 2570
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From: Snowflake, Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles_22

Try Russia at War: 1941-1945 by Alexander Werth (close to 1100 pages from a Russian perspective).

Also a favorite around here is Panzer Commander by Hans Von Luck.


AN interesting and comprehensive work, but I found "Russia at War" to be a bit of a "dense" read... more of a research source than casual reading. Panzer Command was suitable for getting a tactical viewpoint from the German perspective.

I used to have a two volume set by... Paul Carel (???) which I'm thinking was called "Fire in the East"... can anyone refresh my memory?

I donated most of my book collection to the local high school a few years back... how I wish I had them all back now! At the time, I had no idea I would become a social studies teacher as I built a new life after my divorce. Ah well....

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/7/2005 3:26:37 AM   
Charles2222


Posts: 3993
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles_22

Try Russia at War: 1941-1945 by Alexander Werth (close to 1100 pages from a Russian perspective).

Also a favorite around here is Panzer Commander by Hans Von Luck.


AN interesting and comprehensive work, but I found "Russia at War" to be a bit of a "dense" read... more of a research source than casual reading. Panzer Command was suitable for getting a tactical viewpoint from the German perspective.

I used to have a two volume set by... Paul Carel (???) which I'm thinking was called "Fire in the East"... can anyone refresh my memory?

I donated most of my book collection to the local high school a few years back... how I wish I had them all back now! At the time, I had no idea I would become a social studies teacher as I built a new life after my divorce. Ah well....


Well Russia at War is something unique, irrespective of the ease of reading it. I don't know many books that even slightly got into the head of the Kremlin. If for nothing else, it at least at one time gave me ammunition to counter the idea that the USSR always had a 8-to-1 advantage against the Germans in what ever category might come up (I believe it's tanks that is mythically believed for them to have that advantage). The book detailed those tank armies drive for Berlin, and what you would expect would have been the most lopsided tank battles for the USSR, those, they didn't even match 8-to-1 there. IIRC it wasn't even 4-to-1 for those battles.

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Other Sources - 2/7/2005 8:01:16 AM   
rhondabrwn


Posts: 2570
Joined: 9/29/2004
From: Snowflake, Arizona
Status: offline 		Don't overlook some of the old wargaming magazines like Strategy & Tactics, Moves, Fire & Movement, and others. Lots of great articles on WWII - Eastern Front in those mags. Generally very concise information presentation by some pretty good gamers and military historians.

You can find these for sale on E-bay and other sites.

Oh, and I don't know how easy these are to come by, but years ago there was a 96 issue magazine that was sold on the newstands entitled: "History of the Second World War"

It was edited by Sir Basil Liddell Hart (one of the great military historians and strategists) and published by Marshall Cavendish, USA Ltd 1973

I've got the entire set and wouldn't part with them for anything. Great detail, fantastic photos and drawings, and fully indexed. Lots of coverage of the Russian Front included. I've got Part 32 sitting in front of me right now with articles on the First Burma Campaign, Air War in the Far East, and Battle of the Coral Sea. each issue runs about 30 pages, but with very small type so the amount of information in an issue is huge. Each article is written by different historians.

Just think... this was actually sold in grocery store newstands in 1973... imagine trying to do that today with our current illiterate masses of consumers! Still, this would be a fantastic resource to be republished or even combined into a hard bound six volume set.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/7/2005 7:55:53 PM   
KG Erwin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn



I used to have a two volume set by... Paul Carel (???) which I'm thinking was called "Fire in the East"... can anyone refresh my memory?



Rhonda, the two books by Paul Carell (pseudonym for Paul Karl Schmidt) are "Hitler Moves East 1941-43" and "Scorched Earth 1943-44". These are classics for the detail on the German side.

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/8/2005 12:22:51 AM   
Warfare1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Warfare1

Another great book about the Pacific War is:

"The Rising Sun" by John Toland



I would also recommend "The Pacific War" by John Costello.

Both books are great reads when playing UV or WiTP...

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Post #: 27
RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/9/2005 12:11:38 AM   
rhondabrwn


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From: Snowflake, Arizona
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quote:

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn



I used to have a two volume set by... Paul Carel (???) which I'm thinking was called "Fire in the East"... can anyone refresh my memory?



Rhonda, the two books by Paul Carell (pseudonym for Paul Karl Schmidt) are "Hitler Moves East 1941-43" and "Scorched Earth 1943-44". These are classics for the detail on the German side.


Those are the ones! Thanks!

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/9/2005 12:13:06 AM   
rhondabrwn


Posts: 2570
Joined: 9/29/2004
From: Snowflake, Arizona
Status: offline 		Perhaps we should start a thread to discuss the "ultimate Military History bookshelf collection"?

Anyone up for that mental exercise?

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RE: Need a good Eastern Front book - 2/9/2005 12:21:46 AM   
KG Erwin


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From: Cross Lanes WV USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn

Perhaps we should start a thread to discuss the "ultimate Military History bookshelf collection"?

Anyone up for that mental exercise?


A list like this exists over at the Depot, but I'd be happy to help put one together over here. It's times like this that I regret giving up mod status, as it would be a great sticky thread. I've got several titles that I'd suggest for the Pacific Theater. If you want to start it, Rhonda, be my guest.

< Message edited by KG Erwin -- 2/8/2005 5:23:05 PM >

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