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I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 6:34:25 AM   
DamoclesX

 

Posts: 873
Joined: 4/9/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Ya ya, Im sure I'm behind the curve in JUST getting one now, but its freaking awsome.

For a long time I thought they were just a fad that would blow for gamming or art, but after seeing this model at my school I decided to give it a try.

Boy was it worth it, photoshop and max are SO much easyer on my eyes, and I can see details without getting headacks or anything.

And it makes games and text SO much crisper!!

Got to say, I love these new lcds soo much:)




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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 7:18:21 AM   
ravinhood


Posts: 3891
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Status: offline 		Time for the Laff-In award for the "Flying Fickle Finger of Fate". ;)

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 7:49:22 AM   
Fred98


Posts: 4430
Joined: 1/5/2001
From: Wollondilly, Sydney
Status: offline 		Don't run older games on.

Uncommon Valour, circa June 2002 is "too old" and the graphics are terrible on an LCD.


But remain wonderful on a 19" CRT


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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 9:37:08 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		I purchased a 19" LCD two months ago "Samsung Syncmaster 912n". My eyes were suffering with the CRT. It sure is better on the eyes but I don't find the gaming art to be better than on a CRT. My older 17" CRT monitor gave a better look to the games.

I'm not complaining, I had to change fot the sake of my eyes. The graphics are good but not superior. Maybe if I had spent $800.00 instead of the $450.00 I could have gotten a better quality LCD

< Message edited by Zap -- 4/19/2005 9:48:54 AM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 1:44:14 PM   
Fred98


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From: Wollondilly, Sydney
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap
The graphics are good but not superior.



The graphics are a function of your graphics card and the graphics of the game.

A fantastic monitor will not improve technically obsolete graphics. It will instead show up bad graphics.




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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 1:58:42 PM   
Marc von Martial


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe 98

Don't run older games on.

Uncommon Valour, circa June 2002 is "too old" and the graphics are terrible on an LCD.


But remain wonderful on a 19" CRT



Not a problem of the graphics.

Itīs because you most probably run it fullscreen in the LCDs native aspect ratio. Almost every half decent LCD/TFT supports different aspect ratios (if not then you can check your graphic card driver for this feature).

Also itīs a matter of how the LCD interpolates pixels. A mid class LCD bought in the last 1.5 years will not be worse then a CRT.

There are many things that come into play here. Do you connect the LCD to a DVI or VGA port, for example. If connected to a VGA port it will loose image quality, "drastically". If it doesnīt even support DVI then itīs doomend anyway.


On my 21" NEC MultiSync 2180UX UV doesnīt look worse then on my 19" CRT.



< Message edited by Marc Schwanebeck -- 4/19/2005 2:08:22 PM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 2:11:29 PM   
RBWhite


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From: Somerdale, New Jersey, USA
Status: offline 		DamoclesX

Very nice choice.

I enjoy the LCD I have much easier on the eyes, I have a Phillips 19in.

ravinhood, I don't know about you old folk. Whats a Laff-in and a Flying Fickle Finger of Fate is that anything like a Rin Tin Tin or a Sky King, The Flying Crown Ranch or someting like in that order

Rick White

< Message edited by RBWhite -- 4/19/2005 2:13:34 PM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 3:50:38 PM   
Fred98


Posts: 4430
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From: Wollondilly, Sydney
Status: offline 		Marc, I don't know any of those details.

If they are important they ought to be included in the specs of the hardware or even in the game specs.

I installed UV on my office computer to see how it looks on a LCD screen circa June 2002

But for various technical reasons I don't understand it looks terrible.

Of course I deleted it before the boss arrived that day and I currently play on my 19"CRT at home. Still reckon the map is beautiful.





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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 4:44:12 PM   
Marc von Martial


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quote:

If they are important they ought to be included in the specs of the hardware or even in the game specs.


Nothing for the game system specs, rather something to keep in mind when you buy a LCD monitor. Just as you need the check various specs when you buy a CRT. People often forget about some very vital specs and features that monitors have or not. Nobody would buy a car just by looking at it

If your LCd was from 2002 then that explains a lot.

< Message edited by Marc Schwanebeck -- 4/19/2005 4:46:39 PM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 10:21:10 PM   
DamoclesX

 

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From: Canada
Status: offline 		Hey

I guess I should have been clearer, what I mean for graphics, is for my job, building meshes and textures, because its a lot more "crisp" them my 19in it makes working in max a LOT easyer, and it makes it lot cleared inphotoshop when I am looking at small details.

The same hold true for games, everything is to much more defined.

I actually did a lot of reserch on this, this was the best buy I could find in canada for that price range, $300 CAD all said and done

its a 17in with 12ms and a 450:1 contrast ratio.

I have not tryed any older games, I"m gonna boot up falcon 4 later today to see how she looks, what I have tryed so far, starshatter, garys world at war, chronicals of riddik, act of war and swat 4 have all been a LOT better then before.

I also think I"m gonna measure the screen of it and my 19, I swear it must be REALLY close to the same size.


21in Marc?? damn man.... I dont have the coin for that

question tho, all the 19's I looked at had only a dpi of .29, wouldnt a 21 be the same or worst? mine is rated at .26 I Belive, I would think anything over that would be horrible, at least thats what it ment for crts


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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 11:04:27 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
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quote:


21in Marc?? damn man.... I dont have the coin for that


The thing is around 1830 USD (converted from the EUR price tag), thatīs your price range when you do graphics proffesionally . I have a dual monitor setup with a 19" CRT a the second monitor, where I move all the tool pallettes of Photoshop and similiar programms too. When I 3D model thatīs the monitor where all the reference pictures are.

quote:

question tho, all the 19's I looked at had only a dpi of .29, wouldnt a 21 be the same or worst? mine is rated at .26 I Belive, I would think anything over that would be horrible, at least thats what it ment for crts


You mean the dot mask? Thatīs only for CRTs. Or do you mean the Pixel Pitch?

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/19/2005 11:14:02 PM   
Zap


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quote:

you most probably run it fullscreen in the LCDs native aspect ratio


Mark I'm not sure I understand the tech of these things I do try to understand before buying but I am ignorant of what interpolate pixels means.
Does the full screen aspect mean that the whole screen is used?

I have an ATI 9800 pro grafics card. Drivers have been updated as of two weeks ago. My monitor is plugged into that card.

Well maybe its my own way of judging between the two (CRT and LCD) is flawed.


< Message edited by Zap -- 4/19/2005 11:16:58 PM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/20/2005 1:02:18 AM   
DamoclesX

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck

quote:


21in Marc?? damn man.... I dont have the coin for that


The thing is around 1830 USD (converted from the EUR price tag), thatīs your price range when you do graphics proffesionally . I have a dual monitor setup with a 19" CRT a the second monitor, where I move all the tool pallettes of Photoshop and similiar programms too. When I 3D model thatīs the monitor where all the reference pictures are.

quote:

question tho, all the 19's I looked at had only a dpi of .29, wouldnt a 21 be the same or worst? mine is rated at .26 I Belive, I would think anything over that would be horrible, at least thats what it ment for crts


You mean the dot mask? Thatīs only for CRTs. Or do you mean the Pixel Pitch?


Ah I had mixed up what pixel pitch actually ment, never mind lol.


That duel setup sounds like a good idea, I actually was having my server running all the reference pics....

Maby, if I can get some more coin going "Ill invest in a bigger main one and put this one as my secondary mon, it really WOULD be great to drag all those tool pallettes off the main screen to a second monitor, I wonder if I could also do the same to all the tools bars and what not for max..

This lcd stuff rocks:) maby I Didtn have the best quality 19 then, cause, man, I totaly love how much better this thing is over my crt!

Now to get back to max lol!



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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/20/2005 11:11:00 AM   
Marc von Martial


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Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
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quote:

This lcd stuff rocks:) maby I Didtn have the best quality 19 then, cause, man, I totaly love how much better this thing is over my crt!


Yeah, I know the feeling . When I got my NEC and had set it up all I had to say was "Holly ****!". After an hour I was shaking my head and aksing myself how I could ever worked on those CRTs , and those where allready pretty much at the higher end of the ladder.

quote:

I wonder if I could also do the same to all the tools bars and what not for max..


I donīt know of a way to do it. Sadly.



Now, what you need to buy next is a hadware monitor calibration solution, like the "Spyder 2 pro".

< Message edited by Marc Schwanebeck -- 4/20/2005 11:14:32 AM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/21/2005 12:58:53 AM   
DamoclesX

 

Posts: 873
Joined: 4/9/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Interesting
I found one for 300$

So basically, if I read this right, what it does it make sure your monitor is calibrated to some set standards so like, light green on my monitor(and photoshop) wouldnt actually be green or dark green on a calibrated/average monitor?

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/21/2005 2:18:11 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
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From: Bonn, Germany
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DamoclesX

Interesting
I found one for 300$

So basically, if I read this right, what it does it make sure your monitor is calibrated to some set standards so like, light green on my monitor(and photoshop) wouldnt actually be green or dark green on a calibrated/average monitor?


Itīs easy, a not calibrated monitor is not color, gama and contrast proof. Deception of colors etc. is a very subjective thing. You need a hardware calibrated monitor for proffesional work. Otherwise thereīs no way to review graphics on a pro standard. The differences can be very extreme.

Only a hardware calibration tool of the mid class (the low class ones are only good enough for amatuer photographs) is able to calibrate your monitor correctly. There are software solutions too, but theyīre again very subjective.

Depending on how you monitor is set it can be that a light green is a green on a properly calibrated monitor

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/21/2005 3:36:33 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Joe,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe 98
Marc, I don't know any of those details.

If they are important they ought to be included in the specs of the hardware or even in the game specs.

I installed UV on my office computer to see how it looks on a LCD screen circa June 2002

But for various technical reasons I don't understand it looks terrible.

Of course I deleted it before the boss arrived that day and I currently play on my 19"CRT at home. Still reckon the map is beautiful.


Marc is right, the reason is due to the LCD screen doing interpolation because it doesn't have a native resolution that matches UV's. The only option is either a better LCD or trying to run UV in windowed mode, so that it will not go through that interpolation process.

Regards,

- Erik

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/21/2005 5:53:48 PM   
Mr.Frag


Posts: 13410
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From: Purgatory
Status: offline 		Be wary of panels that do not have a normal 4:3 aspect ratio as the interpolation will be painful on the eyes especially with text due to the stretch effects.

Take the vertical and divide by the horizontal ... if it's not .75, walk to the next one or you will be sorry. A lot of 1280 x 1024 were produced, but as you see when you do the math, this is .80, which is the stretch effect.

1024 x 768 or 800 x 600 are both .75

The only spot this doesn't apply is with wide screen displays which are 0.625 instead.

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/22/2005 4:37:50 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		Marc, I went back to the manual and noticed I had 60Hz setting when a 75Hz was recommended at 1024x768 pixels. This helped in the resolution. The other factor is that I have to wear my readindg glasses all the time while I'm on the computer. I was judging by how they compared without them on. Makes all the difference in the world.Da!

The manual did say the brightness/darkness may be off by 1PPM due to limitations in the manufacturing process.

I do have it set up in the DVI port.
I think quality of product is the main issue. You do have the top of the line. I will be willing to shell out a few more bucks next time.
Although, I don't use my machine in a professional capacity for grafics its a personal desire for the best.

< Message edited by Zap -- 4/22/2005 4:41:03 AM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/22/2005 2:33:29 PM   
Marc von Martial


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quote:

You do have the top of the line.

By far not

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/25/2005 6:17:02 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
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From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		I was unaware of a better monitor than a NEC. What the next one up in quality?

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/25/2005 6:17:18 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		mmm


< Message edited by Zap -- 4/25/2005 11:48:08 AM >

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/25/2005 9:25:20 AM   
Dave Ferguson

 

Posts: 302
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From: Kent, United Kingdom
Status: offline 		If you want a TFT panel with a 4:3 aspect ratio you might have difficulty finding one. The 'standard' display resolution for 17 and 19 inch panels is 1280 x 1024 pixels which is not 4:3! Smaller 15 inch panels usually have 1024 x 768 pixels and larger 22 inch panels have 1600 x 1200 pixels, both of which are 4:3 aspect ratio. With notebooks there is even more variability, with wide screen panels etc.

The problem with interpolating pixels for 17 inch screens can be overcome if your graphics card has a 1280 x 960 pixel option, in which case you might be able to get the panel to centre this with unused pixels top and bottom. Apparently most of the CRT monitor manufacturing facilities are going to cease production this summer so the future is TFT.

Game designers need to stop producing games that run in fixed resolutions or they will start losing sales. Of course with older games this is not possible, in which case check out the screen resolution for which the game was designed and buy a TFT panel and graphics card which will support a resolution which is a EXACT multiiple of that, avoiding pixel interpolation. for old VGA 640 x 480 resolutions this will be 1280 x 960.

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RE: I got an LCD today! - 4/26/2005 12:57:48 PM   
Marc von Martial


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap

I was unaware of a better monitor than a NEC. What the next one up in quality?


The high end EIZO line of LCDs. Theyīre double if not more then the price.

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