Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data...

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Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:08:32 AM

Oznoyng

Posts: 818
Joined: 4/16/2004
From: Mars
Status: offline

I have been running tests on the PH attack. The following is some data from 38 runs of the PH attack out of a planned 100. (Will take a while to run em all, then more time to enter into spreadsheet, analyze, etc.).

Methodology
1. Begin H2H game. Set KB to patrol/Do not Retire.
2. Run turn and record Sys/Float and total torpedo hits on Allied turn.
3. Run turn and record Sys/Float and total torpedo hits on Allied turn.
4. Run turn and record Sys/Float and total torpedo hits on Allied turn.

Benchmark for damage:
Scen 16 2xBB sunk, 2x99sys, 3x15sys, 1x75 sys. (318 total sys damage among ships not sunk).

Results:
28 trials where no BB sunk. (will provide avg dmg once I enter into spreadsheet)
10 trials where 1 BB sunk.
2 trials where 2 BB sunk (combined sys damage among remaining ships 231 and 258)

Conclusion:
Thirty-eight trials, none of which even met historical results suggests strongly that teh IJN attack is not strong enough. What is worse, I conducted the same attack for three days running. In most cases, 3 days of attacks did not exceed what transpired historically in a few hours. Draw your own conclusions.

Post #: 1

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:15:13 AM

rogueusmc

Posts: 4583
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Texas...what country are YOU from?
Status: offline

Were you rerunning the turn or were you backing all the way back out and selecting the scenario everytime?

_____________________________

There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.

Gen. William Thornson, U.S. Army

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 2

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:19:33 AM

madmickey

Posts: 1336
Joined: 2/11/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline

On Dec 8 you can run additional CV attack on Pearl. The american have nothing to threaten you with. His CV are no match to your KB, he has no air force on PH and his subs are pretty useless. You can run CV attack for a few days and damage a bunch of CA, CL, DD, AK and AP as well as sinking of a few BB. The Ships in PH can not sneak out at night as they have 1000 op points after each attack.

< Message edited by madmickey -- 5/2/2005 1:24:56 AM >

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 3

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:21:13 AM

Oznoyng

Posts: 818
Joined: 4/16/2004
From: Mars
Status: offline

I have three machines running tests simultaneously. I start the scenario, set KB to patrol, do not retire, run 3 turns, stopping at each allied turn to record BB damage. I then exit the app, and reload the scenario for the next iteration. All turns are different (I am recording damage from each BB and no two the same so far).

(in reply to rogueusmc)

Post #: 4

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:27:27 AM

Oznoyng

Posts: 818
Joined: 4/16/2004
From: Mars
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: madmickey

On Dec 8 you can run additional CV attack on Pearl. The american have noting to threaten you with. His CV are no match to your KB, he has no air force on PH and his subs are pretty useless. You can run CV attack for a few days and damage a bunch of CA, CL, DD, AK and AP as well as sinking of a few BB. The Ships in PH can not sneak out at night as they have 1000 op points after each attack.

Aye, I can. Unfortunately, scen 16 neither allows me to deploy my forces the way I want nor does it grant the VP to the IJN player from sinking the two BB's, an important consideration since each BB is around 190 VP.

(in reply to madmickey)

Post #: 5

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:28:37 AM

madmickey

Posts: 1336
Joined: 2/11/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline

Have you adjusted what the KB airplanes attack each turn after Dec 8.

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 6

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:30:46 AM

rtrapasso

Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline

quote:

Aye, I can. Unfortunately, scen 16 neither allows me to deploy my forces the way I want nor does it grant the VP to the IJN player from sinking the two BB's, an important consideration since each BB is around 190 VP.

Yes, you DO get VP for the BB sunk. They are rolled into the VP value for Tokyo, iirc - you get 500 pts more in scen 16 than 15. Someone pointed out that if they lost Tokyo, they lost the points, but then realized that they would have lost the game anyway.

_____________________________

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Post #: 7

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:31:19 AM

Reverberate

Posts: 57
Joined: 3/24/2005
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 8

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:32:48 AM

Williamb

Posts: 594
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Dayton Ohio
Status: offline

try changing the attack package

DROP the Kates from 5,000 to 1,000 feet. Make sure they are on either Port or Naval attack.

Drop Vals to 5,000 feet. I use most of mine to hit the airfeilds

MOVE Zeros up to 10,000 feet set to escort. No use losing the fighters.

Will do more damage (but wil lose more planes)

_____________________________

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Post #: 9

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:39:58 AM

madmickey

Posts: 1336
Joined: 2/11/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng

quote:

ORIGINAL: madmickey

On Dec 8 you can run additional CV attack on Pearl. The american have noting to threaten you with. His CV are no match to your KB, he has no air force on PH and his subs are pretty useless. You can run CV attack for a few days and damage a bunch of CA, CL, DD, AK and AP as well as sinking of a few BB. The Ships in PH can not sneak out at night as they have 1000 op points after each attack.

Aye, I can. Unfortunately, scen 16 neither allows me to deploy my forces the way I want nor does it grant the VP to the IJN player from sinking the two BB's, an important consideration since each BB is around 190 VP.

I am talking about doing this in scen 15 after first attack you still have 80% of max sorties available. The only thing is you may not have 800 AP bombs for Vals.

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 10

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 1:56:26 AM

rogueusmc

Posts: 4583
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Texas...what country are YOU from?
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

_____________________________

There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.

Gen. William Thornson, U.S. Army

(in reply to Reverberate)

Post #: 11

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 2:15:43 AM

Tristanjohn

Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

Maybe so, but that's more a matter of perception. Truth is the game gives clear indication of having been given short shrift in terms of design, this accompanied by what appears to a willy-nilly development approach. There is, after all, more than a little to fix.

(in reply to rogueusmc)

Post #: 12

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 2:32:50 AM

Banquet

Posts: 1184
Joined: 8/23/2002
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

Maybe so, but that's more a matter of perception. Truth is the game gives clear indication of having been given short shrift in terms of design, this accompanied by what appears to a willy-nilly development approach. There is, after all, more than a little to fix.

What's perception got to do with it? To say that beta's have never 'caught anything' isn't only rude, it's insulting and totally incorrect.

In a game of such scope there's always going to be things that need fixing. Matrix/2by3's first job is to stay afloat. In doing so they may have released WitP with some flaws.. but they still gave us a simulation of the theatre that's unparelled.

Suggesting improvements is one thing. Throwing stupid insults at beta's shouldn't be dignified.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Tristanjohn)

Post #: 13

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 2:37:48 AM

rogueusmc

Posts: 4583
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Texas...what country are YOU from?
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Banquet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

Maybe so, but that's more a matter of perception. Truth is the game gives clear indication of having been given short shrift in terms of design, this accompanied by what appears to a willy-nilly development approach. There is, after all, more than a little to fix.

What's perception got to do with it? To say that beta's have never 'caught anything' isn't only rude, it's insulting and totally incorrect.

In a game of such scope there's always going to be things that need fixing. Matrix/2by3's first job is to stay afloat. In doing so they may have released WitP with some flaws.. but they still gave us a simulation of the theatre that's unparelled.

Suggesting improvements is one thing. Throwing stupid insults at beta's shouldn't be dignified.

HERE HERE

_____________________________

There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.

Gen. William Thornson, U.S. Army

(in reply to Banquet)

Post #: 14

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 2:46:54 AM

Tristanjohn

Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Banquet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

Maybe so, but that's more a matter of perception. Truth is the game gives clear indication of having been given short shrift in terms of design, this accompanied by what appears to a willy-nilly development approach. There is, after all, more than a little to fix.

What's perception got to do with it? To say that beta's have never 'caught anything' isn't only rude, it's insulting and totally incorrect.

In a game of such scope there's always going to be things that need fixing. Matrix/2by3's first job is to stay afloat. In doing so they may have released WitP with some flaws.. but they still gave us a simulation of the theatre that's unparelled.

Suggesting improvements is one thing. Throwing stupid insults at beta's shouldn't be dignified.

I've been around for awhile and I've read plenty of "insults" on this board, and going both ways, too. Why get upset about that?

Meanwhile, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if v1.5 were no more playable than v1.4, and for all I know more errors yet have been installed. If you read these threads as they mature that would seem to be the case as of now, and we're only a few days into v1.5's release. It could get very well become worse!

Have you forgotten that Allied Sub Doctrine was a "feature" installed by this same support staff based on what I'd consider to be idiotic requests from this very board?

Please, if you're offended by this kind of stuff, that's fine, but at least try to maintain something like a reasonable perspective about what's going on here with regard to the big picture. WitP wasn't released with just a "few glitches" you know. It was released in awful shape. And at a premium price to boot.

(in reply to Banquet)

Post #: 15

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 2:54:33 AM

Cap Mandrake

Posts: 23184
Joined: 11/15/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline

Set the Kates to 1000-2000 ft, on naval/port, close the range to 60 nm. There will be fireworks. On turn two there will be further damage

BTW...to me, the verb "to bork" means to torpedo a nomination with extreme violence

PS...Picasso sometimes painted pictures of women with lopsided breasts or wtih two eyes on one side of their nose.

< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 5/2/2005 3:03:09 AM >

(in reply to Tristanjohn)

Post #: 16

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:02:30 AM

sadja

Posts: 299
Joined: 8/1/2004
Status: offline

They only problem with PH attack is the torps are so random,The IRL it was about 50/50. The 800kg were for the inboard BB's. In real life only the Arizona was a total loss. The Oklahoma was righted but it was it wasn't cost effective to rebuild it. I have only played 3 PBEM and I sunk 2,0 and 1 BB.The last one was 1.5patch and got 3 kate torp rolls, the one with 0 had no torps show up. The attack was suppose to keep the US fleet from disturbing the move into the SRA. The Italians raised all thier BB's at Tranato. That means the brits didn't sink any BB's by our rules. But the Italians were not as much as a danger for quite awhile. The harbor at both tranato and PH were just to shallow. If the Oklahoma hadn't had all her watertight doors opened for monday inspection she might have just settled to the bottom. The Japanese should have allowed the Nevada to sortie instean trying to sink her in the channel. the could have sunk her in the apporach if they had waited about 15min and she would have never been raised.

Even if both carries were in the harbour they may have been sunk but most likely raised. It would have kept the come back later but the allies would still win. This is a game. If the japanese player sunk every ship in PH and caught both carriers they still lose. The only way Japan wins this game is if you get more points the allies. It is a game play it as a game. This is not statamatic baseball with all the numbers crunched down to the 10 thousands. It is some of the randomness that makes it fun. People put thier ships and troops in harms way that in real life those chances would never and been taken. look at Blackwatch's AAR, Japan is extended and getting wacked, but that is how they want to Play Thier GAME(not yelling just emphising) In real life if Kurtia? continued on at Guadelcanal and sunk all the transports maybe the war had been different(no we still win) just harder. Please enjoy the game and quit trying to make machine code do what people do. I love this game and will feel the ups and downs of playing the japanese.

Sadja

_____________________________

Your never Lost if you don't care where you are.

Tom Massie GPAA

(in reply to rogueusmc)

Post #: 17

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:09:44 AM

Banquet

Posts: 1184
Joined: 8/23/2002
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Please, if you're offended by this kind of stuff, that's fine, but at least try to maintain something like a reasonable perspective about what's going on here with regard to the big picture. WitP wasn't released with just a "few glitches" you know. It was released in awful shape. And at a premium price to boot.

I'm not at all offended, but I likely would be if I was a beta.. having been accused of never catching a bug.. ever..

I'd say it was the original poster of this comment that was unable to maintain a reasonable perspective, along with anyone who tries to justify his position.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Tristanjohn)

Post #: 18

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:14:08 AM

Cap Mandrake

Posts: 23184
Joined: 11/15/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline

If I can quote him correctly, Frag said that the torp-arming rule was an abstaction to allow for the fact that some targets in harbors were moored in too shallow waters (or were moored alongside another ship).

Tritianjohn...I don't think civility need be eschewed (edit: I'm not saying you weren't being civil) just because we are on the web. As for the price of the game..a mere trifle...I sometimes spend that much on a bottle of wine and then cant remember it in the morning

< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 5/2/2005 3:15:16 AM >

(in reply to sadja)

Post #: 19

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:20:24 AM

sadja

Posts: 299
Joined: 8/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

If I can quote him correctly, Frag said that the torp-arming rule was an abstaction to allow for the fact that some targets in harbors were moored in too shallow waters (or were moored alongside another ship).

Tritianjohn...I don't think civility need be eschewed (edit: I'm not saying you weren't being civil) just because we are on the web. As for the price of the game..a mere trifle...I sometimes spend that much on a bottle of wine and then cant remember it in the morning

Amen I've spent thousands of hours on this game playing planing and just thinking about my moves. I enjoy this about as much anyhting that I've done. Quit jumping out of planes don't live near the ocean anymore(can't sail) just love this game.

_____________________________

Your never Lost if you don't care where you are.

Tom Massie GPAA

(in reply to Cap Mandrake)

Post #: 20

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:35:55 AM

Onime No Kyo

Posts: 16842
Joined: 4/28/2004
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

Meanwhile, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if v1.5 were no more playable than v1.4, and for all I know more errors yet have been installed. If you read these threads as they mature that would seem to be the case as of now, and we're only a few days into v1.5's release. It could get very well become worse!

It amazes me that someone who spends so much time, energy and considerable verbosity to critisize the game considers it unplayable. It would seem that your choises in the matter are very clear. If you consider this game to be so unplayable then please deprive us of the pleasure of hearing you complain.

There are, as far as I can tell, several types of people on this board. There are those who love the game and refuse to take any bug seriously. There are those who love the game but are willing to offer constructive criticism. Then there are those who seem to be somewhat dissapointed and offer a lot of constructive criticism.

And then there is you. In all the time I have been reading your posts, I do not recall a single instance when your comments were constructive or helpful. You do, however, spend a lot of time being insulting, degrading, dismissive and generally unpleasant. You you're just mad at the world and need to take your frustrations out, it is another reason for you to deprive us of your comments.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Tristanjohn)

Post #: 21

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:37:46 AM

Tristanjohn

Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Banquet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Please, if you're offended by this kind of stuff, that's fine, but at least try to maintain something like a reasonable perspective about what's going on here with regard to the big picture. WitP wasn't released with just a "few glitches" you know. It was released in awful shape. And at a premium price to boot.

I'm not at all offended, but I likely would be if I was a beta.. having been accused of never catching a bug.. ever..

I'd say it was the original poster of this comment that was unable to maintain a reasonable perspective, along with anyone who tries to justify his position.

You're still not looking at the big picture.

Have the testors ever caught a bug? No doubt. Then the original poster must have exaggerated, no? But what shape is the game in? Good shape or bad shape? And what was original poster's overall intent? I don't know, but if it was to suggest that the game still needs a lot of work he couldn't have been far off his mark.

I can't speak for him, of course, but that's the big picture. The game needs lots of work, and frankly, I doubt it will receive the attention it needs. In fact, if you read what Matrix has written about this that's about guaranteed.

(in reply to Banquet)

Post #: 22

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:39:51 AM

Tristanjohn

Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

If I can quote him correctly, Frag said that the torp-arming rule was an abstaction to allow for the fact that some targets in harbors were moored in too shallow waters (or were moored alongside another ship).

Tritianjohn...I don't think civility need be eschewed (edit: I'm not saying you weren't being civil) just because we are on the web. As for the price of the game..a mere trifle...I sometimes spend that much on a bottle of wine and then cant remember it in the morning

I find that true, too. The more I spend the less I remember the next day.

(in reply to Cap Mandrake)

Post #: 23

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:42:31 AM

freeboy

Posts: 9088
Joined: 5/16/2004
From: Colorado
Status: offline

quote:

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

Really 24 hours .. you certainly are the onme IN THE KNOW... I am sure no really cares, the testers, Mike Wood, MAtrix staff .. Gary Grigsby.. and all .. its a damdable conspiricy designed around you.. we dopn't really even play the game.. we only post to see if you'll respond.. this one goes out to YOU..

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)

Post #: 24

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:51:56 AM

Tristanjohn

Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

Meanwhile, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if v1.5 were no more playable than v1.4, and for all I know more errors yet have been installed. If you read these threads as they mature that would seem to be the case as of now, and we're only a few days into v1.5's release. It could get very well become worse!

It amazes me that someone who spends so much time, energy and considerable verbosity to critisize the game considers it unplayable. It would seem that your choises in the matter are very clear. If you consider this game to be so unplayable then please deprive us of the pleasure of hearing you complain.

Now you see, this is what the other fellow was referring to. What you just wrote is 1) not only rude but 2) ignorant of my belief and perspective on top of that, 3) puts words in my mouth, 4) is arrogant because it (wrongly) presumes everyone reading this thread agrees with your demonstrably limited point of view and 5) just for good measure, stands in diametric opposition to the ideal of "free speech."

Where I come from they call that a mouthful. Good show, guy.

quote:

There are, as far as I can tell, several types of people on this board. There are those who love the game and refuse to take any bug seriously. There are those who love the game but are willing to offer constructive criticism. Then there are those who seem to be somewhat dissapointed and offer a lot of constructive criticism.

And then there is you. In all the time I have been reading your posts, I do not recall a single instance when your comments were constructive or helpful. You do, however, spend a lot of time being insulting, degrading, dismissive and generally unpleasant. You you're just mad at the world and need to take your frustrations out, it is another reason for you to deprive us of your comments.

You, sir, appear to be a man given to statements which are what I'd call more "convenient" than accurate. But go ahead, make an ass of yourself. It won't affect me or the work I do around here one whit.

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)

Post #: 25

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:54:51 AM

Oznoyng

Posts: 818
Joined: 4/16/2004
From: Mars
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

quote:

Aye, I can. Unfortunately, scen 16 neither allows me to deploy my forces the way I want nor does it grant the VP to the IJN player from sinking the two BB's, an important consideration since each BB is around 190 VP.

Yes, you DO get VP for the BB sunk. They are rolled into the VP value for Tokyo, iirc - you get 500 pts more in scen 16 than 15. Someone pointed out that if they lost Tokyo, they lost the points, but then realized that they would have lost the game anyway.

Hmm...I see now that you do get VP for the sunk ships. I missed that. Sorry.

(in reply to rtrapasso)

Post #: 26

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 3:57:10 AM

Oznoyng

Posts: 818
Joined: 4/16/2004
From: Mars
Status: offline

To those not debating the merits of the PH attack, can you please take it to PM's? This is my soap box, and I'd prefer to whine about the underpowered IJN PH attack. :p

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 27

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 4:39:08 AM

pompack

Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: Banquet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reverberate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
Yes, PH attack is borked.

Borking seems to be the one thing that WITP support is good at. Unfortunately, the only thing.

I knew there was going to be trouble when the last 1.5 build was sent to the beta-testers, and then released to public less than 24 hours later. Not that the beta-testers have ever caught anything before..........ever.

how rude

Maybe so, but that's more a matter of perception. Truth is the game gives clear indication of having been given short shrift in terms of design, this accompanied by what appears to a willy-nilly development approach. There is, after all, more than a little to fix.

What's perception got to do with it? To say that beta's have never 'caught anything' isn't only rude, it's insulting and totally incorrect.

In a game of such scope there's always going to be things that need fixing. Matrix/2by3's first job is to stay afloat. In doing so they may have released WitP with some flaws.. but they still gave us a simulation of the theatre that's unparelled.

Suggesting improvements is one thing. Throwing stupid insults at beta's shouldn't be dignified.

I've been around for awhile and I've read plenty of "insults" on this board, and going both ways, too. Why get upset about that?

Meanwhile, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if v1.5 were no more playable than v1.4, and for all I know more errors yet have been installed. If you read these threads as they mature that would seem to be the case as of now, and we're only a few days into v1.5's release. It could get very well become worse!

Have you forgotten that Allied Sub Doctrine was a "feature" installed by this same support staff based on what I'd consider to be idiotic requests from this very board?

Please, if you're offended by this kind of stuff, that's fine, but at least try to maintain something like a reasonable perspective about what's going on here with regard to the big picture. WitP wasn't released with just a "few glitches" you know. It was released in awful shape. And at a premium price to boot.

TJ:
I do try to keep a reasonable perspective. I think it is rude.

As to the rest:
1. WITP was released after I waited for it for over 10 years; I'm glad I didn't have to wait longer
2. lf another publisher (which shall remain nameless but should be recognizable) had released it, it would have cost 20% less, would have had twice as many glitches, and we would have been charged full price for 1.5 under the title WITP II, except WITP II would also have been full of glitches until the second patch was released.

And going back to the original post, do you really believe that 1.5 was released only 24 hours after the Beta people got it?

(in reply to Tristanjohn)

Post #: 28

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 4:40:36 AM

pompack

Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng

To those not debating the merits of the PH attack, can you please take it to PM's? This is my soap box, and I'd prefer to whine about the underpowered IJN PH attack. :p

Sorry, you are right (as usual).

(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 29

RE: Yes, PH attack is borked. Some test data... - 5/2/2005 4:41:48 AM

rtrapasso

Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline

quote:

To those not debating the merits of the PH attack, can you please take it to PM's? This is my soap box, and I'd prefer to whine about the underpowered IJN PH attack. :p

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(in reply to Oznoyng)

Post #: 30

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