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IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 4:20:20 AM   
CushVA

 

Posts: 152
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Status: offline 		8/10: http://pc.ign.com/articles/632/632721p1.html
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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 4:28:23 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Status: offline 		Pretty good review, though it has the first comments I've seen saying that the game is nothing special graphically and with the low score of the review in the graphics category.

Compared to many mainstream titles, sure, but compared to wargames I would have to disagree (as many in this forum have noted, the graphics are quite excellent for a non-3D wargame). The comment "looks like a boardgame" to me is actually a compliment but I can see how gamers used to Rome Total War's 3D strategy map would not be overawed (yet I personally like Crown of Glory's better than that used in Medieval or Shogun Total War, for example).

Regards,

- Erik

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 4:30:20 AM   
Reiryc

 

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Status: offline 		Decent review although I think the bias against graphics is a bit strong.

I think that when judging graphics as with other areas of a game, reviewers should consider what the intent of the graphic set is and whether or not the game achieved that goal. Were the graphics meant to increase the enjoyment of the game as say in an RPG? Or were they designed more to represent information as opposed to immersion?

I think the marks on gameplay were about right but I'd have probably given it a 9. Sound is where I think the game should have gotten a bit of a lower score. The violin music is nice and provides a good background soundtrack, but a few more pieces for variety would have been nice. I'd be happy if even the opening music could have been alternated with the violin music during map movement.

Lasting appeal would have also been about a 9.5 as opposed to the 8.5 due not only to the number of nations but also due to the ability to play tcp/ip and pbem thus giving a person many different avenues to play.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 5:45:02 AM   
ericbabe


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Status: offline 		A pretty fair review, though I am quite happy with the period look of the strategic map as it is now.


There are 40 violin pieces, which is a pretty fair selection. The real music problem is that the violin score doesn't work well in the detailed battle.


Eric



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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 5:54:47 AM   
Uncle_Joe


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Status: offline 		Does the game alternate playing the violin pieces? I seem to here the same few over and over. I honestly dont mind it, but it would nice to hear the full 'soundtrack' be worked through.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 6:21:15 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Status: offline 		It does alternate between all of them, at least on my installation.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 6:35:13 AM   
Uncle_Joe


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Status: offline 		Hmm, does it work through it every turn? I always seem to have it 'reset' to the first track every turn. Perhaps I go through my turns too quickly and never let it have time to work through all the tracks?

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 6:37:43 AM   
pixelpusher


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
Pretty good review, though it has the first comments I've seen saying that the game is nothing special graphically and with the low score of the review in the graphics category.


Yeah, I thought that was a pretty heavy penalty on the GFX. My thought on this are:
A) It's supposed to look like a boardgame, or maybe a map Napoleon would have moved pieces around on.
B) A 'boardgame' IS the metaphor people use to understand these type of games, and lots of people who like this type of game also like boardgames. Honestly, I really don't know what a better graphic concept could be (satellite photo?), or why it's a problem to look like a boardgame.
Anyway, we've got some good improvements for the next project... I think our next thing will be much cooler graphically.

Worth pointing out: Doom3 got an 8.3 at IGN ...

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 6:59:32 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: pixelpusher
Yeah, I thought that was a pretty heavy penalty on the GFX. My thought on this are:
A) It's supposed to look like a boardgame, or maybe a map Napoleon would have moved pieces around on.
B) A 'boardgame' IS the metaphor people use to understand these type of games, and lots of people who like this type of game also like boardgames. Honestly, I really don't know what a better graphic concept could be (satellite photo?), or why it's a problem to look like a boardgame.


Agreed, while the reviewer commented that he wanted more colors, I think the map does a great job of conveying the period feel. With that said, I think that unfortunately there is a certain level above which you can't get without 3D graphics, regardless of whether they actually serve any purpose. Overall a fair review though.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 7:12:41 AM   
mogami


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Status: offline 		Hi, I wonder if he even finished a scenario. It appears he has problems counting (thinks there are only 6 nations for players to choose from)
Clearly the game is supposed to look like a board game, how else could it be presented?
You have a map. You have military units. You divide the map for movement and economic control duh result is a board game.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 12:24:10 PM   
Reg Pither


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Status: offline 		Yes, I think that's not a bad review, all in all.

Two things in particular struck a chord with me - the word 'clunky' which is how I described some of the processes and lack of tactile feedback; and the maps could do with some bolder colours to help define provinces and seas.

But 8 out of 10 for such an esoteric game on a mainstream site is pretty good in my book.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 2:18:12 PM   
GreenDestiny


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Status: offline 		I think he wanted the colors on the tiny map of Europe (on the bottom right) to be on the main map. And I could see were you could have a problem with it if your somewhat color blind. Even with me, it sometimes hard to tell in the territories with the different strips in it. Because of the faded pigment colors that are saturated. Also the map does look like it could be 200 years old. But also during Napoleon's time would they be really looking at a faded map of Europe?
Overall I think it was a good review.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 2:56:50 PM   
jchastain


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Status: offline 		I notice that there is a section at the bottom right of the page where gamers can rate or review the game as well. It requires registration (which is free).

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 3:52:34 PM   
ericbabe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Uncle_Joe
Does the game alternate playing the violin pieces? I seem to here the same few over and over. I honestly dont mind it, but it would nice to hear the full 'soundtrack' be worked through.


If your national morale is <0 then it only cycles through the "sad" pieces of music, which somewhat limits the selection. The pieces of music are otherwise played purely in a random order (with the caveat that the same piece isn't supposed to be played twice in a row).


Eric

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 3:57:59 PM   
Reg Pither


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Status: offline 		On the subject of the music, I wish there were separate volume controls for it and the sound effects. As I really like the music but don't want it overpoweringly loud, but I do want the battle sound effects to be a decent volume, I end up just turning the music off as I cannot achieve what I want. I either get too loud music or feeble sound effects.

Separate volume controls would be great.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 4:31:06 PM   
Mr. Z


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Status: offline 		Yeah, 8.0 is pretty good, IMO. That's about what I expected. He just wanted to see something like the RTW "strategic" map. Was generally uninterested in comparing it to board games. A pretty sharp hit to the rating, though--looks like it would have had maybe an 8.5 otherwise, which would have been nice. Note that he did say the game mechanics were very solid.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 4:33:04 PM   
jchastain


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I added a user review for CoG. You can find it at : LINK

For those who agree, please add to the stars/trust rating at the bottom of the numbers section (hopefully by click on the star at the far right ).



< Message edited by jchastain -- 7/12/2005 5:58:35 PM >

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Post #: 17
RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/12/2005 5:26:13 PM   
tiredoftryingnames


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Status: offline 		I've noticed that all reviewers these days don't really look at a game in it's genre and what it needs to be successful so to speak. Just because one type of game can have 3D graphics as eye candy doesn't mean all games need it to function. A first person shooter needs great graphics to have a realistic world but the visual feedback is different than a wargame. If someone can see the map, their units and tell what's going on then the graphics are fine. I'll take gameplay over pretty graphics in a wargame any day.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/14/2005 4:38:08 PM   
GreenDestiny


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Status: offline 		Most strategy games work with the imagination. That’s why they appeal with people with higher intellect.

I'm not saying that I am smart…I'm just proving a fact.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/14/2005 7:16:09 PM   
bluemonday

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreenDestiny

Most strategy games work with the imagination. That’s why they appeal with people with higher intellect.

I'm not saying that I am smart…I'm just proving a fact.

Actually, by your reasoning the most intelligent people should be those who like those text role-playing games, MUDs wor whatever you call them, because they have to use the most imagination.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 3:09:59 AM   
jchastain


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Status: offline 		There is now a second reader review of CoG at IGN. This time, it is decidedly less enthusiastic: LINK

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Post #: 21
RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 6:25:05 AM   
GreenDestiny


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday


quote:

ORIGINAL: GreenDestiny

Most strategy games work with the imagination. That’s why they appeal with people with higher intellect.

I'm not saying that I am smart…I'm just proving a fact.

Actually, by your reasoning the most intelligent people should be those who like those text role-playing games, MUDs wor whatever you call them, because they have to use the most imagination.


You miss this

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 7:44:07 AM   
bluemonday

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr. Z

Yeah, 8.0 is pretty good, IMO. That's about what I expected.

You "expected" an 8/10? You're pretty confident!

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 7:49:19 AM   
bluemonday

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jchastain

I added a user review for CoG. You can find it at : LINK

For those who agree, please add to the stars/trust rating at the bottom of the numbers section (hopefully by click on the star at the far right ).

You gave it a 9.5? That would make it one of the best games I've ever played. Is that how you feel - it's one of the best games you've ever played?

No offense intended here - you've made a ton of super-helpful, very intelligent and insightful posts on this board, so I respect your opinion. I just feel that for my part, I'm closer in opinion to the other reader review. There is too much here that is broken or doesn't work, and I am starting to have real questions about the utility of all the detail in the economic system. If you can get past all this and really love the game enough to give it a 9.5, then I actually kind of envy you because I'd love to be able to like it for what it is, too.

I'm still enjoying it in PBEM play, but m/p is always better.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 9:22:35 AM   
jchastain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

You gave it a 9.5? That would make it one of the best games I've ever played. Is that how you feel - it's one of the best games you've ever played?

No offense intended here - you've made a ton of super-helpful, very intelligent and insightful posts on this board, so I respect your opinion. I just feel that for my part, I'm closer in opinion to the other reader review. There is too much here that is broken or doesn't work, and I am starting to have real questions about the utility of all the detail in the economic system. If you can get past all this and really love the game enough to give it a 9.5, then I actually kind of envy you because I'd love to be able to like it for what it is, too.

I'm still enjoying it in PBEM play, but m/p is always better.


Since this game came out, I've spent several hours each and every day playing it. Very VERY few games hook me in that way. So, in a way, yeah it is one of the best games I've played - without a doubt within the top 5%. Maybe I'm an unusual soul because I don't mind the ambiguities. In fact, I enjoy trying to decipher how things work. The economy is almost like a puzzle to be solved to me. I'd do several things differently, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying the game now.

As for the quality level and bugs, sure there are a few problems but they are really pretty minor and the game is still quite playable in its current state. Let's just say that it is far ahead of where EU was at its initial release and I consider EU and the subsequent EU2 to be an all-time classic.

I suspect the people who enjoy this game least are those who dive right in and play France. To me, it is perhaps the worst nation to play. Try Prussia if you want to experience the game at its best. Play for at least 10 years with highest glory as the winner. If you still don't enjoy it, perhaps this isn't the game for you. But I'm really enjoying it.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 9:50:02 AM   
nukkxx5058


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreenDestiny

I think he wanted the colors on the tiny map of Europe (on the bottom right) to be on the main map. And I could see were you could have a problem with it if your somewhat color blind. Even with me, it sometimes hard to tell in the territories with the different strips in it. Because of the faded pigment colors that are saturated. Also the map does look like it could be 200 years old. But also during Napoleon's time would they be really looking at a faded map of Europe?
Overall I think it was a good review.


I would also have prefered a more colourfull map even if this look less like an acyual napoleonic map. We all know it's a game
Colors are confusing and to pale. If colours were modifiable, it would be perfect.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 11:30:50 AM   
Reg Pither


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jchastain

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

You gave it a 9.5? That would make it one of the best games I've ever played. Is that how you feel - it's one of the best games you've ever played?



Since this game came out, I've spent several hours each and every day playing it. Very VERY few games hook me in that way. So, in a way, yeah it is one of the best games I've played - without a doubt within the top 5%. Maybe I'm an unusual soul because I don't mind the ambiguities. In fact, I enjoy trying to decipher how things work. The economy is almost like a puzzle to be solved to me. I'd do several things differently, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying the game now.

I suspect the people who enjoy this game least are those who dive right in and play France. To me, it is perhaps the worst nation to play.


Yes, I thought 9.5 was rather high. That would put it up there with the likes of Age of Empires, Civilization and Doom as one of the greatest games ever made! Still, each to their own, and it's all just personal opinion, anyway.

Having said that, I'm still enjoying it despite the bugs and that's because... I've dived straight in and played France! Being able to control La Grande Armee is the number one attraction for me, so I reckon it will be a looong time before I play any other country. Plus the simple fact that as I'm a Napoleonic nut and this is the only game of its type around, I'm something of a captive audience. Last night was the first day I can remember when I haven't played it since the day it came out...

I think I'd probably give it slightly better marks than IGN - maybe 8.2/8.3 - with the potential to be a 9.0 or above with patches and add-ons.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 5:57:18 PM   
Mr. Z


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr. Z

Yeah, 8.0 is pretty good, IMO. That's about what I expected.

You "expected" an 8/10? You're pretty confident!

Heh, well, I just mean based on their reviews of other games

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Post #: 28
RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 9:40:44 PM   
jchastain


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Status: offline 		Thinking through it a bit more, if you assume an even distribution of game where the top 10% gets in the 90's, the next 10% gets in the 80's, etc, then my review score is right on target. However, that really isn't the way that it is done. Assuming a 10 is an ideallic state that no game will ever really hit, then the score I gave this game is slightly high. I'd still give it a 90 though. I really do think it is that engrossing. And I'm not a routinely easy grader; as a comparison I gave GGWaW a 69 and I thought that was a gift.

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RE: IGN Reviews CoG - 7/15/2005 10:11:18 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
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From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, I think it is some what amusing that I using a machine that is not supported (Win ME) have few problems with the game and enjoy it greatly.
I like the economy, diplomacy and combat systems.
Where I part company is I think none of these come into full flower unless you are playing online with at least 4 human players.

COG requires a skillful French player. The others don't have to be as expert as the French
I'd rate the player skill require
1. French
2. Austria
3 Russia
4. Prussia
5. Britain
6. Spain
7. Turkey
8. Sweden

To learn the game in solo mode play the nations in reverse order. By the time you get to playing France you will understand the system.


< Message edited by Mogami -- 7/15/2005 10:12:05 PM >

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