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Infantry toughness - 9/2/2005 6:05:57 AM   
soldier

 

Posts: 199
Joined: 5/24/2005
Status: offline 		Is there any way to make troops hang in there just a bit tougher against armour ?
I tried boosting infantry toughness but it doesnt seem to have any effect on combat against other units types, so while a steroid popping troop might wipe out his opposite number easily he still cant hold position against one tank attack.
Not mentioning a much increased chance of tank panic and the spotting advantages of armour in 8.4, my poor troops easily take casualties, break and run or do nothing when confronted by tanks (even crapp ones). I'm guessing the experience drop has affected troops in many more ways than it has against tanks in 8.4 (when calculating checks for assaulting or panic etc).
My own personal preferance is to have troops which can stand up against some weak attacks especially when in defences like they used too in H2H. Is there a way to increase morale for foot units in the game with the editor or boost their effectiveness in other ways ?

< Message edited by soldier -- 9/2/2005 6:07:33 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/2/2005 6:12:08 AM   
Twotribes


Posts: 6929
Joined: 2/15/2002
From: Jacksonville NC
Status: offline 		Give them effective tank killing device. Of course that isnt historical depending on time and country.

(in reply to soldier)
Post #: 2
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/2/2005 11:10:26 AM   
Puukkoo


Posts: 472
Joined: 7/19/2005
From: Seinäjoki, Finland
Status: offline 		I depends much which countries you're playing. Assaulting tanks may be too much asked from Italians and even early Americans.

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Post #: 3
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/2/2005 2:43:49 PM   
Twotribes


Posts: 6929
Joined: 2/15/2002
From: Jacksonville NC
Status: offline 		From experience the crews of bailed out vehicles and weapons can and do assault tanks and can win, even though all they have is misc. small arms. Just as a sniper can and does.

Moving forward with armor before scouting is a sure fire way to give infantry a free hand and blowing up tanks.

(in reply to soldier)
Post #: 4
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/2/2005 4:52:59 PM   
Korpraali V


Posts: 659
Joined: 7/11/2005
From: Finland
Status: offline 		Crews can't anymore assault vechiles in newer versions. And soon snipers are in the same situation - see what's soon coming: "SPWAW version 8.41 Changes" lower in this forum.

To make tanks feel little more distressed drop "searching" value in preference -screen. Affects also infantry but they surely still can see tanks. And you can make it affect troops in both sides so that the enemy will not be in better situation.



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RE: Infantry toughness - 9/3/2005 2:39:04 AM   
Svennemir

 

Posts: 542
Joined: 11/2/2001
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		You wanted to make infantry tougher against armour? I presume that means taking less casualties. I'm rather surprised that the infantry toughness slider doesn't seem to work at all. Changing artillery effectiveness, the other slider, may have a part to play in this equation since a large amount of the infantry casualties actually stem from splash damage. This would of course have immeasurable side effects, and primarily affect the effectiveness of large caliber guns. I think the splash damage is greatly increased at short ranges, and will - compared to the "direct hit" part of the casualties - play the largest role when the target infantry units are well entrenched.

(in reply to Korpraali V)
Post #: 6
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/3/2005 6:58:37 AM   
Major Destruction


Posts: 881
Joined: 8/10/2000
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Do like the Germans did. Have a halftrack manned by SS patrolling in the rear behind the infantry with orders to shoot anyone who retreats. That will work. Or did.

_____________________________

They struggled with a ferocity that was to be expected of brave men fighting with forlorn hope against an enemy who had the advantage of position......knowing that courage was the one thing that would save them.

Julius Caesar, 57 BC

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Post #: 7
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/3/2005 6:08:35 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		I think TWOTRIBES had part of the answer in having effective tank busting squads, and whats been mentioned about the experience gap or historical prefs, are all suitable in explaining cumulative observations but none of us can give any revilations without getting more details. What nations are u playin?. How big is your force?? Have u set the prefs at default or have u been messin around?? Give us more of the actual picture and we can probably help. WHAT CRAPPY TANKS?? RT

< Message edited by Riun T -- 9/3/2005 6:11:28 PM >

(in reply to Major Destruction)
Post #: 8
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/4/2005 5:59:16 AM   
soldier

 

Posts: 199
Joined: 5/24/2005
Status: offline 		I usually play eastern front battles both against AI and human opponents. I also play with infantry toughness to 120. This helps infantry in goodpositions hold against other troops but it has no effect if a tank attacks them (they still takes casualties very easily against armour). Even a whole line of experienced germans dug in and entrenched will abandon their good positions and run if a T34 gets close enough ? . They also run if shot at by tanks. To be honest i don't think it matters which country you play the effect is pretty widespread if troops don't have bazookas. I basically want troops that can hold onto good positions occaisionally.
This is a personal preferance that i can't seem to get right with adjustments not a historically based discussion, though i think it has some merits.


< Message edited by soldier -- 9/4/2005 6:00:18 AM >

(in reply to Riun T)
Post #: 9
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/4/2005 7:34:01 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		The soon-to-be-released 8.4 patch will address some of the issues. Snipers can no longer close-assault, which is proper.

However, consider this-- close assaults by infantry will consider the best AT weapon the unit has. This is how the combat routine works.

Use common sense, guys. A satchel-charge armed unit has a better chance of knocking out that enemy tank than a squad armed with only rifles and grenades.

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Post #: 10
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/5/2005 8:25:55 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		You can make infantry units tougher against armor also by opening each unit in the scenario editor. Then click on leader. Then go to the list of the leader's values. You'll see one for armor. If you make the number bigger that will give the unit greater ability against armor. It works for me. You must save, and you can't do that in generated campaigns or player designed campaigns (unless you know how to use the campaign editor and rename campaigns scenarios to regular scenarios).

WB

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 11
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/5/2005 1:30:11 PM   
Puukkoo


Posts: 472
Joined: 7/19/2005
From: Seinäjoki, Finland
Status: offline 		Remembering again the 'golden' SP3 where German Panzerpionieren could destroy anything on and above the map and in great numbers. Flamethrowers are great tank destroyers.

Hitting "TTC#" will usually work fine with infantry at teams. They will not 'assault' tank, but 'fire' their specific weapon and induce more harm to the tank.

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Don't be shocked, I AM funny.

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Post #: 12
RE: Infantry toughness - 9/7/2005 5:24:23 AM   
Major Destruction


Posts: 881
Joined: 8/10/2000
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Thank you Bill,

That was one valuable snippet of info that I never considered. Am I slow on the uptake or what?

Brilliant piece of advice!

Scenario designers take note!

_____________________________

They struggled with a ferocity that was to be expected of brave men fighting with forlorn hope against an enemy who had the advantage of position......knowing that courage was the one thing that would save them.

Julius Caesar, 57 BC

(in reply to Puukkoo)
Post #: 13
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