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RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 4:37:34 PM

JMS2

Posts: 357
Joined: 10/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lava
Yep a little,

But you have to admire these guys for keeping the torch lite.

Absolutely... But these games are now Matrix games. So those guys, "development managers", "beta test leaders", "scenario compilers" or whatever they are called, are working for Matrix right now.

It would be nice and civil if they would post their announcements, recruit beta testers and whatnot, here, not elsewhere, or at least here first.

I think Matrix bosses oughta make them do so.

I know communities like SZO did a lot to keep the flame alive, but to find crucial announcements being posted on SZO board and NOT here, by a guy Matrix chose as "team leader" or whatever, seems very unprofessional and rude. Just my opinion.

O.

Let me check the NDA... no, no clause forcing us to post exclusively on Matrix forums, too bad, it's called Freedom of speech...

_____________________________

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 31

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 4:58:52 PM

Oleg Mastruko

Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JMS2
Odd, you apparently confuse yourself with this unnamed developers we are supposedly bullying, but in the meantime here's Oleg proposing that the people developing this should be forced to post only here, guess that's not bullying, and we have you, arrogantly deciding what's a bug and what isn't and trying to muzzle people that have more experience than you (both individually and collectively) on the system.

Apparently I do have the balls, since I am here indeed, yet you nor Oleg are anywhere to be seen in those other sites, you know, the ones that kept the game alive, while you hid in your hole. What, afraid that they aren't your mates and may disagree with you? the horror!, but then, that's why the forums exist in the first place.

If you have Company A, developing Product X, and there are some people who work on that Product, either as volunteers, outside beta testers, or paid professionals, then I have every right to expect info about Product X to appear FIRST and foremost on Company A's website and forums. That for me is basic netiquette and business culture if you will. Yes they should be "forced" to post here by their bosses from Matrix, because it's Matrix professionalism and goodwill that's at stake.

I never said they should "post only here" I said post here first. If they want to discuss at length whatever they please, with their old buddies elsewhere they are of course free to do so. But Matrix web is the only official place for Matrix products.

It pissed me off to see important TOAW related posts posted more than week ago on SZO, by a guy that Matrix picked as "team leader" (or whatever) for this game. Why should Matrix customers have to go to other sites to get info about Matrix games, by Matrix people? So yes, this guy, "team leader" for one of Matrix products, should be politely asked to post important, informative stuff here first, and read this forum (after that he can post whatever he wants wherever he wants for all I care).

Now to address your ridicolous "where were you when we true revolutionaries/crusaders kept the flame alive" argument...

I was there too. I lurked, and even occassionally posted on SZO board, but, frankly, after playing TOAW for 3-4 years every day for hours on end, and after I played thru every scenario worth playing, and after reading every whiney post worth reading on SZO, decided to move on, and play any of the half dozen excellent other wargames on the market (80% of them published by Matrix BTW). So? If I proclaim my guilt and apologize before Grand Court Of Supreme Soviet of TOAW flame keepers, or Grand Inquisitor for TOAW Heretics, will I be forgiven?

Oleg

< Message edited by Oleg Mastruko -- 10/27/2005 5:07:58 PM >

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Post #: 32

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 5:08:28 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko
If you have Company A, developing Product X, and there are some people who work on that Product, either as volunteers, outside beta testers, or paid professionals, then I have every right to expect info about Product X to appear FIRST and foremost on Company A's website and forums.

You have every right to expect whatever you like. You can expect Matrix to provide you with a six figure salary if you like. However, it is unlikely to happen. Matrix can and will do what they want.

quote:

Why should Matrix customers have to go to other sites to get info about Matrix games, by Matrix people?

Because the vast majority of the interested parties are not regular posters on this forum? Of those who've posted more than once or twice here, I can only think of three (yourself, Lava and Capitaine) who aren't regulars at either TDG or WHQ. As I recall you three are no longer TOAW players anyway.

quote:

So? If I proclaim my guilt and apologize before Grand Court Of Supreme Soviet of TOAW flame keepers, or Grand Inquisitor for TOAW Heretics, will I be forgiven?

You don't need to feel guilty for not playing TOAW lately. However, the fact you'd given up on the game does make it a bit rich for you to be demanding this or that from the developers, and even worse for you to tell us that the game can't be improved.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 33

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 5:29:19 PM

Oleg Mastruko

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Joined: 10/21/2000
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quote:

You have every right to expect whatever you like. You can expect Matrix to provide you with a six figure salary if you like. However, it is unlikely to happen. Matrix can and will do what they want.

Correct. However, I think this is actually very likely to happen. Matrix people take care to appear professional before their customers, and I think guys working as volunteers (or whatever) on "Ex-Talonsoft" titles recently acquired by MG will be politely asked to post here by Erik or some other MG employee. Just my educated guess

quote:

Because the vast majority of the interested parties are not regular posters on this forum? Of those who've posted more than once or twice here, I can only think of three (yourself, Lava and Capitaine) who aren't regulars at either TDG or WHQ. As I recall you three are no longer TOAW players anyway.

Correct again but so what? I don't have time, will nor energy to visit 6 wargaming forums daily, so I picked one, this one, and that's it. Guess what? As of couple weeks ago company that owns this forum also owns rights to Game X, so I think I have every right to see stuff about Game X here. Whether I play Game X or not has no relevance. I may play it one day again (after buying it from Company that owns it).

quote:

You don't need to feel guilty for not playing TOAW lately. However, the fact you'd given up on the game does make it a bit rich for you to be demanding this or that from the developers, and even worse for you to tell us that the game can't be improved.

I am not feeling guilty at all, I am being sarcastic - surely you noticed that...

I have more TOAW-hours under my belt than most, either here or on SZO, WHQ etc. although using this as argument is very childish.

I stopped playing the game because I felt there are no new quality scenarios to keep my interest alive. And there were other games on the horizon. Frankly, I feel sorry for anyone who missed on half dozen excellent, very innovative and new wargaming titles (mostly, but not all, published by Matrix) because he was stuck with TOAW for all those years.

I may go back to TOAW after all, but unlike many daydreamers, revolutionaries and flame keepers, I keep my expectations and wishes for TOAW ME realistic.

O.

_____________________________

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 34

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 5:39:39 PM

Siberian HEAT

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Joined: 6/20/2003
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Gentlemen,

Before this spirals out of control, let's just all relax a bit. First of all, NOTHING has happened. Exactly what news are we supposed to be posting here? I guess I could post a nice update which says "...and this week in TOAW ME News, nothing has happened." If that is what is expected, I am sorry for not being on top of things.

Why post at SZO instead of on Matrix TOAW Forum? David selected a group of TOAW players based on their experience and positive work over the past many years in supporting this game. He had the good sense not to demand that we gut the SZO forums (and others) and force people to post at Matrix games to do feature requests and list bugs. There is no evil plot to exclude Matrix regulars, and screaming bloody murder and demanding that community volunteers should be force marched to Matrix Games is going to be lose-lose for everyone involved. Trying to dump on SZO and paint them as the bad guy here is going to do nothing but further alienate many of the veterans of the TOAW scene.

Most people have been very supportive, including many long timers from Matrix who have kept this all in a positive light and contacted us with emails and PM's. It would be much more productive to take the time to go to SZO (or Rugged Defense, or TDG, or the Blitz) and just introduce yourself as a prospective new player or returning regular and say hello. Even if you do nothing else, it shows that the whole community is united on TOAW. I can tell you (with some experience in how to build a community) that this will result in people trickling in to Matrix's TOAW forum much faster than kicking them in the nuts and then expecting them to call this home. I really can't state it any plainer than that.

Thanks again to the Matrix regulars who have been supportive of our efforts. And let's not forget that I am also a registered Matrix Games Forum member, and while I can't yet call this my home, the natives have been very hospitable and I'm thinking about purchasing a summer condo here.

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 35

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 5:44:14 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

I stopped playing the game because I felt there are no new quality scenarios to keep my interest alive.

When did you decide this? There are fewer scenarios being released now than a few years ago- but the average quality has soared.

quote:

Frankly, I feel sorry for anyone who missed on half dozen excellent, very innovative and new wargaming titles (mostly, but not all, published by Matrix) because he was stuck with TOAW for all those years.

None of them have the same scope as TOAW. Since TOAW covers the scope I'm interested in, I don't see why I should change.

quote:

I keep my expectations and wishes for TOAW ME realistic.

...and demand that everyone else be pessimistic, too.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 36

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 5:49:57 PM

Oleg Mastruko

Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

I stopped playing the game because I felt there are no new quality scenarios to keep my interest alive.

When did you decide this?

I think it was late summer 2002. Around the time I discovered UV I think (but am not sure). I'll have to check with my official biographers about this

quote:

None of them have the same scope as TOAW. Since TOAW covers the scope I'm interested in, I don't see why I should change.

You don't have to. However, I'd suggest you to check out games like HTTR ot WITP. You might be surprised...

O.

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Post #: 37

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/27/2005 7:56:10 PM

*Lava*

Posts: 1924
Joined: 2/9/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Siberian HEAT

Before this spirals out of control, let's just all relax a bit.

Totally agree.

Looking forward to the fruits of your labors.

And BTW, I never quit playing TOAW. I have two computers, and the disc has a permanent home in one of them.

Ray (alias Lava)

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Post #: 38

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 2:26:13 AM

macgregor

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Sorry to all you anti-huge scenario guys. No surprise I'd like to see a comprehensive WW2 scenario. Either in one scenario or two connected by TOs. While I'm at it, how about a comprehensive 'War on Terror' scenario starting on 9/11 that would encompass the entire middle east and southern asia that would allow several options(and consequences).(Hmmm...Indonesia?) Maybe a series of scenarios is in order. A working naval representation would make scens like 'Malvinas' much better.

BTW- I'm dying to help an experienced scenario designer with any scenario. This way I could learn scenario design more gradually. Send me a message if you're interested.

< Message edited by macgregor -- 10/28/2005 2:27:46 AM >

(in reply to *Lava*)

Post #: 39

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 2:28:38 AM

Siberian HEAT

Posts: 140
Joined: 6/20/2003
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lava

Totally agree.

Looking forward to the fruits of your labors.

And BTW, I never quit playing TOAW. I have two computers, and the disc has a permanent home in one of them.

Ray (alias Lava)

Thanks Ray. I can say with certainty that you will no longer need to have your CD-ROM permanently occupied by the TOAW CD. The new version will not have that Safedisc code on it. At one point I even considered buying an extra drive so that I wouldn't ever have to take the disc out...so I know how you must feel.

(in reply to *Lava*)

Post #: 40

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 3:41:24 AM

Hellen_slith

Posts: 1990
Joined: 10/10/2005
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That's nice to hear....I never could get the no-cd patch to work, and I've always worried that my CD would someday no longer work.

I also hope there are more small-to-medium sized scenes, 10 to 20 movers, possibly there could be some sort of mechanism where multiple scenes could be "linked" into a larger campaign, that is, the next scene in a "series" startup depends on the last scenes' outcome.....

Well, looking forward to the "ME" edition!

(in reply to Siberian HEAT)

Post #: 41

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 8:21:43 AM

L`zard

Posts: 362
Joined: 6/3/2005
From: Oregon, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hellen

That's nice to hear....I never could get the no-cd patch to work, and I've always worried that my CD would someday no longer work.

I also hope there are more small-to-medium sized scenes, 10 to 20 movers, possibly there could be some sort of mechanism where multiple scenes could be "linked" into a larger campaign, that is, the next scene in a "series" startup depends on the last scenes' outcome.....

Well, looking forward to the "ME" edition!

WHAT HE SAID..... !!!!!

HELLEN's (cough) idea of being able to (LINK) game scenarios thru the 'editor', using some sort of 'attach' file..........

Can you imagine all of a designers' tactical scenarios linked so as to be played one-after-the-other in order to achieve victory?

SWEET!

_____________________________

"I have the brain of a genius, and the heart of a little child! I keep them in a jar under my bed."

(in reply to Hellen_slith)

Post #: 42

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 12:41:08 PM

steveh11Matrix

Posts: 944
Joined: 7/30/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

Sorry to all you anti-huge scenario guys. No surprise I'd like to see a comprehensive WW2 scenario. Either in one scenario or two connected by TOs. While I'm at it, how about a comprehensive 'War on Terror' scenario starting on 9/11 that would encompass the entire middle east and southern asia that would allow several options(and consequences).(Hmmm...Indonesia?) Maybe a series of scenarios is in order. A working naval representation would make scens like 'Malvinas' much better.

BTW- I'm dying to help an experienced scenario designer with any scenario. This way I could learn scenario design more gradually. Send me a message if you're interested.

Oh, I'm not anti-huge... although I can see how it could have been read that way. I actually enjoy the CNA scenario quite a lot. That one is, however 'large', manageable due to it's relatively small front. But I'd just like to see more emphasis (read: >none) on the smaller to medium size ones! Diversity is the key.

Steve.

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Post #: 43

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 6:32:08 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
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From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

You don't have to. However, I'd suggest you to check out games like HTTR ot WITP. You might be surprised...

I did look at the latter. Looks like a good game- but not as interesting as TOAW, and if I got a new game I would end up wasting lots of time on it rather than working. Does it have an editor?

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 44

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 6:35:24 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
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From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

While I'm at it, how about a comprehensive 'War on Terror' scenario starting on 9/11 that would encompass the entire middle east and southern asia that would allow several options(and consequences).(Hmmm...Indonesia?)

I don't think TOAW's really an appropriate model for this.

quote:

BTW- I'm dying to help an experienced scenario designer with any scenario. This way I could learn scenario design more gradually. Send me a message if you're interested.

Scenario designers usually need help with two things; research and playtest. The former probably won't help you learn, but the latter might. You'll get to see the design process in action.

Really, though, the best way is to learn by doing. Take some small battle which you can get some good information on, and make a scenario. It'll be very sketchy, but you'll improve fast.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to macgregor)

Post #: 45

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 6:40:32 PM

Oleg Mastruko

Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

You don't have to. However, I'd suggest you to check out games like HTTR ot WITP. You might be surprised...

I did look at the latter. Looks like a good game- but not as interesting as TOAW, and if I got a new game I would end up wasting lots of time on it rather than working.

LOL isn't that the whole idea of gaming?

Speaking for myself, WITP is the only game, ever, that might out-do TOAW in how many hours I burned playing it. HTTR game system is the best operational level simulation ever made. It's better than TOAW hands down, although TOAW has special place in my heart no matter what.

Both games have editors. But compared to TOAW editors are too specialized and relatively rarely used.

In WITP people use the editor mostly to correct what they perceive as historical inaccuracies (like, "F6F's maneuvrability should be 32 NOT 31!!"), rather smallish in the "big picture".

Similarly in HTTR, you get practically all scenarios covering all historical and "what if" possibilities of Market Garned so the area potential scenario makers could cover is rather limited.

HTTR is evolving to become a proper "serial" of games. Next one is COTA (Conquest for the Aegean) should be out any day. New games are planned to cover North Africa, East Front, Bulge, Pacific jungles, the usual stuff... as I said - the best operational level system ever made. It's not turn based so old grogs need to adapt...

Oleg

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Post #: 46

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/28/2005 6:41:09 PM

JMS2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

Sorry to all you anti-huge scenario guys. No surprise I'd like to see a comprehensive WW2 scenario. Either in one scenario or two connected by TOs. While I'm at it, how about a comprehensive 'War on Terror' scenario starting on 9/11 that would encompass the entire middle east and southern asia that would allow several options(and consequences).(Hmmm...Indonesia?) Maybe a series of scenarios is in order. A working naval representation would make scens like 'Malvinas' much better.

BTW- I'm dying to help an experienced scenario designer with any scenario. This way I could learn scenario design more gradually. Send me a message if you're interested.

See here, this is the opportunity of your life:

http://www.tdg.nu/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1130230303

Check the resources link for ODD for the mapping program if you need it.
TO&Es can be found here:

US: http://orbat.com/site/ww2/drleo/013_usa/__usa.htm
Japan: http://orbat.com/site/ww2/drleo/014_japan/__ighq.htm

This should be enough research to get the map, OOB and TOE info, which are the basics, and from there, start playing with the different levels and events.

_____________________________

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Post #: 47

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 9:22:00 PM

macgregor

Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
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quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

While I'm at it, how about a comprehensive 'War on Terror' scenario starting on 9/11 that would encompass the entire middle east and southern asia that would allow several options(and consequences).(Hmmm...Indonesia?)

I don't think TOAW's really an appropriate model for this.

I think I'm going to be sick. TOAW is probably the MOST appropriate model for this. I suppose we should just continue to imagine fighting the damn commies!(Hell! Grab a couple liberals -they're close enough!) Of course there's always the Jerries! "The two best wars this country ever fought were against the Jerries. I say get them on the other side of the fence where they belong...". Just where do you get off telling me (or anyone else) what's 'appropriate'?

< Message edited by macgregor -- 10/29/2005 9:27:24 PM >

(in reply to JMS2)

Post #: 48

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 10:04:32 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
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From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko
HTTR is evolving to become a proper "serial" of games. Next one is COTA (Conquest for the Aegean) should be out any day. New games are planned to cover North Africa, East Front, Bulge, Pacific jungles, the usual stuff... as I said - the best operational level system ever made.

Mm. The problem is they could release a dozen of these packages and still not really approach the scope of TOAW.

quote:

It's not turn based so old grogs need to adapt...

Well I've played real time games from Paradox... so long as it has a 'pause' button I'll be OK.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 49

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 10:08:03 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
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From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor
I think I'm going to be sick. TOAW is probably the MOST appropriate model for this.

I don't think so. The War on Terror, while it contains military elements, isn't really decided by warfare. It might well be decided by where troops are deployed- but I think you'd be better off coming up with a pen and paper (read: notepad and MS Paint) game. That way you can have more than 500 events.

quote:

Just where do you get off telling me (or anyone else) what's 'appropriate'?

I was just trying to save you a lot of heartache. Feel free to make your War on Terror scenario. I just think you would be a lot better of making up the system for yourself. If you like, you can use TOAW for whichever walkover of an invasion the American player wants to make.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to macgregor)

Post #: 50

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 10:19:08 PM

Oleg Mastruko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko
HTTR is evolving to become a proper "serial" of games. Next one is COTA (Conquest for the Aegean) should be out any day. New games are planned to cover North Africa, East Front, Bulge, Pacific jungles, the usual stuff... as I said - the best operational level system ever made.

Mm. The problem is they could release a dozen of these packages and still not really approach the scope of TOAW.

Depends. HTTR/COTA series provide rich, very well researched, high quality scenarios. TOAW, despite being perhaps my favorite game of all times, IMO suffers terribly from very bad scenarios, on average. Unlike TOAW with its many quirks (just take a look at this thread

) HTTR/COTA engine is very stable, in a sense that when you enter basic values (TOE & OOB) game usually works "on its own" after that.

In TOAW, getting TOE and OOB right is just the beginning of work for scenario designer. Many don't realise it but that's how it is.

Maps in HTTR/COTA are simply beautiful - no hexes... most realistic maps in any commercialy available wargame, bar none.

I haven't played a single scenario in HTTR/COTA that I would say was "bad" or "filler" or "sub par" - they were all very good or excellent, or at least good. With TOAW I've seen so much garbage I get dizzy just thinking of it (not trying to be confrontational or start a flame war just telling it like it is

)

So, by the time Panther games release dozen or so of these "packages" HTTR/COTA will get very close to TOAW in terms of how many hours I burned playing them.

O.

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Post #: 51

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 10:28:42 PM

Oleg Mastruko

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Joined: 10/21/2000
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I feel sorta bad for this last post, where I discuss game that is not TOAW on this board... not very nice, but I really do hope you check out HTTR/COTA for yourself

Now to post something on-topic, ie. "what scenarios would I like to see in TOAW". In fact I'll continue in the same vein, and say I prefer quality scenarios, regardless of the battle they are depicting. Both COTA and TOAW are good examples of this. In fact, finding well done scenario about some battle I know very little about, stirred my interest for that battle, so it worked in reverse of usual wargaming logic.

Wargaming logic is usually: I am interested in battle A therefore I want my favorite gaming engine to cover battle A.

My logic, that applies to both TOAW and COTA: if the scenario is very good, it will motivate me to learn about the historic battle and thus perhaps learn something new.

There are many cases when excellent TOAW scenario made me do my own research to learn more... Unfortunatelly, there are much more numerous cases when bad scenario about the battle I know well made me sick

LOL

O.

_____________________________

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Post #: 52

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 10:51:37 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
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From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

Depends. HTTR/COTA series provide rich, very well researched, high quality scenarios. TOAW, despite being perhaps my favorite game of all times, IMO suffers terribly from very bad scenarios, on average.

That's a good point. For me, though, the main interest is in the designing itself. Playing other people's scenarios comes in second.

This is reflected by what I'm looking for from an updated TOAW; a sophisticated tool for designing wargames.

As to your concern over discussing a game which isn't TOAW, I wouldn't worry about it. It's all comparative and quite relevant.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)

Post #: 53

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/29/2005 11:57:03 PM

macgregor

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quote:

I don't think so. The War on Terror, while it contains military elements, isn't really decided by warfare. It might well be decided by where troops are deployed- but I think you'd be better off coming up with a pen and paper (read: notepad and MS Paint) game. That way you can have more than 500 events.

quote:

Just where do you get off telling me (or anyone else) what's 'appropriate'?

I was just trying to save you a lot of heartache. Feel free to make your War on Terror scenario. I just think you would be a lot better of making up the system for yourself. If you like, you can use TOAW for whichever walkover of an invasion the American player wants to make.

Alright. In that case I understand. Certainly not in TOAW's present state would it do a scen like this justice. If however, there was better representation of naval and strategic warfare it could work. BTW I think that the options should be more than just military, or invasions for that matter, and that the consequences of military action should make no invasion a 'walkover'. They certainly haven't in Iraq. With enough events, terrorism could be portrayed, as well as waning political support. Portraying this war in TOAW could at least be informative of the present situation, if not the future.

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Post #: 54

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 12:50:43 AM

golden delicious

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quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor
BTW I think that the options should be more than just military, or invasions for that matter, and that the consequences of military action should make no invasion a 'walkover'. They certainly haven't in Iraq.

Sure, but the current situation in Iraq can't really be modelled in TOAW. The invasion can be done quite well, but that's largely a foregone conclusion. That's the walkover I was referring to.

quote:

With enough events, terrorism could be portrayed, as well as waning political support.

TOAW has an excellent and flexible operational model; any campaign or conflict which was decided by operational warfare can be done very well in TOAW. Politics and terrorism, however, could be done just as well by rules you come up with yourself.

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Post #: 55

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 2:57:20 AM

L`zard

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From: Oregon, USA
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pst deleted

< Message edited by L`zard -- 10/30/2005 3:00:06 AM >

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Post #: 56

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 4:39:42 AM

David Heath

Posts: 3274
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From: Staten Island NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JMS2

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lava
Yep a little,

But you have to admire these guys for keeping the torch lite.

Absolutely... But these games are now Matrix games. So those guys, "development managers", "beta test leaders", "scenario compilers" or whatever they are called, are working for Matrix right now.

It would be nice and civil if they would post their announcements, recruit beta testers and whatnot, here, not elsewhere, or at least here first.

I think Matrix bosses oughta make them do so.

I know communities like SZO did a lot to keep the flame alive, but to find crucial announcements being posted on SZO board and NOT here, by a guy Matrix chose as "team leader" or whatever, seems very unprofessional and rude. Just my opinion.

O.

Let me check the NDA... no, no clause forcing us to post exclusively on Matrix forums, too bad, it's called Freedom of speech...

Come on guys lets calm this down here and now. Look there not now nor will there be a clause forcing anyone to post here first or for that matter at all. The team the has been put together to work with us not under us. At the same time I would find it very helpful if you guys would also please post the information here at the same time anywhere else. Thanks guys.

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Post #: 57

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 5:27:18 AM

L`zard

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From: Oregon, USA
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"work with us not under us. At the same time I would find it very helpful if you guys would also please post the information here at the same time anywhere else. Thanks guys. - David Heath"

Oleg;

I'm pretty sure that 'EVERYONE CONCERNED' wants this game to come to fruition, eh?

"All we need is Love..." or at least some space to work it out.

To the best of my understanding, 'other board' members are NOT official, excepting Brian King.....others, Daniel McBride inclusive, are semi-official and working with Matrix out of love of the game.

A little time, a little space, and an inclination to pay for the ToaW: ME version will make any 'reasonable individual' happy in the end, eh?

Cliques are the last thing neccesary to see all our hopes materialized.

As far as I can tell from watching ALL the pertinant forums, as soon as anything that looks like 'new info' is developed, it is posted here.

Research and comment there to, is being requested in other places. This does NOT mean that Matrix execs are not in the loop, eh?

Relax, it will all be well in the end..........

< Message edited by L`zard -- 10/30/2005 5:30:14 AM >

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Post #: 58

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 6:37:10 AM

nelmsm1

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Not to get back on topic but I would like to see a hypothetical scenario where Germany achieves it's goal during the Battle of the Bulge and the American/British make a separate peace with Germany and Germany devotes it's entire army to stop the Russians in 1945.

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Post #: 59

RE: What new scenarios would you like to see? - 10/30/2005 1:27:13 PM

steveh11Matrix

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quote:

ORIGINAL: nelmsm

Not to get back on topic but I would like to see a hypothetical scenario where Germany achieves it's goal during the Battle of the Bulge and the American/British make a separate peace with Germany and Germany devotes it's entire army to stop the Russians in 1945.

I think what would be more interesting would be to take the operational-level game of the Bulge, presume a German victory there, shift the map NW and game out the ensuing battle for Antwerp.

Steve.

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