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RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/21/2005 12:07:10 AM

medicff
Matrix Hero

Posts: 710
Joined: 9/11/2004
From: WPB, Florida
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Wood

Hello...

Please be advised that code changes made since the release of version 1.0 were not based on "play balance". There were a number of players who felt one side or the other was to weak and when ever changes were made, some players on the other side always complained that the game was being balanced away from their side.

Issues, such as air search, surface anti-submarine warfare, zones of control, enhanced leadership characteristics usage, bombing effectiveness, air-to-air combat between fighters and fighters and between fighters and bombers were not addressed because of player complaint. They were addressed because I felt they needed to be. Seldom use the term 'I', as like being and feeling part of a team, but will, in this case, because feel need to accept responsibility for code changes.

I play the game, and in some cases felt the mood achieved in game was not quite right. Made list of needed changes and after release of game, began to work on them. Took a while, as bugs and many, many user interface changes and orders options requests were also addressed. Also, added a goodly bit of combat descriptive text, to help players understand what was happening in battles.

Although I worked with player testers and usually consulted with Joel and Gary on changes, I made all decisions concerning code changes through out patching (except for nerfing night bombing effectiveness, which Joel instigated, Gary implemented and with which I agreed).

I therefore accept responsibility for all changes since the initial release of the game. If you disagree with any, please do not blame the testers, Matrix, 2By3, the Allied or Axis protagonists. Just me.

Eric told me he is posting build 1.795 today or tomorrow and I feel it is the cleanest, most realistic and playable build to date.

Hope You have fun...

Michael Wood

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard III
That`s what those of us who only want to play a Realistc Historical Campaign VS the AI are afraid of considering what the many past " Enhancements" to help the PBEM boys get " Play Balance " have done to the Game.

I have to agree it has helped tremendously to get things "right", even when it took several tries. Thanks very much for the continued support. I have been following the beta posts and it sounds like it takes a great game and makes it better.

Can't wait to implement it on my two ongoing PBEM.

(in reply to Mike Wood)

Post #: 31

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/21/2005 12:14:37 AM

steveh11Matrix
Matrix Hero

Posts: 944
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

WitP is one of those games which I was at first reluctant to jump into, and now so very, very glad that I did.

Mike: a very sincere "Thank You" from me. You've ruined my social life, of course, but I've still enjoyed it!

Steve.

_____________________________

"Nature always obeys Her own laws" - Leonardo da Vinci

(in reply to medicff)

Post #: 32

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/27/2005 6:56:31 PM

saj42
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 1125
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Somerset, England
Status: offline

Just wanted to add my thanks to 'the team' for the best computer wargame i can ever hope to play

- EXCEPT THE NEXT ENHANCED VERSION OF WitP

- heck i'll even pay for the priviledge.

My top three things to improve would be
1. curtail bloody air combat
2. stacking limits
3. toggles for repairing airfield and port

If Mike Wood could fix these i'd be in heaven

(in reply to steveh11Matrix)

Post #: 33

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/27/2005 7:57:34 PM

Graccus
Matrix Recruit

Posts: 12
Joined: 8/2/2002
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline

Hi Mike,

As a relative newbie compared to the WitP "Pros"

that post here, I've only played against the AI. My question regarding your statement below;

quote:

Eric told me he is posting build 1.795 today or tomorrow and I feel it is the cleanest, most realistic and playable build to date

Does this mean PBEM or against the AI?

Thanks
Joe

_____________________________

I don't know what the hell this logistics is that Marshall is always talking about, but I want some of it.

Admiral King

(in reply to Mike Wood)

Post #: 34

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/27/2005 9:05:15 PM

ctangus
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline

quote:

Does this mean PBEM or against the AI?

I'm a relative newbie myself, but from the list of fixes, it looks like it will improve both. See below link:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=993049

OT - where in Mass are you? I'm in Boston.

(in reply to Graccus)

Post #: 35

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/27/2005 11:34:46 PM

Graccus
Matrix Recruit

Posts: 12
Joined: 8/2/2002
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline

Ctangas,

I'm down in Mansfield, just a few minutes away from the Tweeter Ctr. Over 6 yrs now. Used to live in Back Bay and Camb.

Where are you in Boston?

I've not attemped a PBEM yet, if your interested let me know.

Thanks for the link. Good info.

Joe

_____________________________

I don't know what the hell this logistics is that Marshall is always talking about, but I want some of it.

Admiral King

(in reply to ctangus)

Post #: 36

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 12:18:02 AM

ctangus
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline

I'm in Back Bay - Beacon St. Used to live in Cambridge too.

I would be interested in a PBEM - I'll PM you with suggestions.

You're welcome.

(in reply to Graccus)

Post #: 37

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 2:52:55 AM

Tom Hunter
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/14/2004
Status: offline

Though I enjoy the game immensly there are some changes I would dealy love to see.

I would love to see the bugs that make LCUs dissapear fixed. I would also love to see the bugs that make LCUs reset their movement to zero after going 59 miles fixed, the bugs that caused my units in Akyab harbor to unload into the jungle of New Ireland and the bugs that cause LCUs to act as if there are enemy units in friendly territory fixed. These bugs are beginning to affect my ability to enjoy the game and they are a major reason why I will not buy War Plan Orange.

I would like to see air combat in game produce the same sort of casualties that were produced by air combat in real life. I would be willing to crunch some data to show graphs of historical results that could be compared with graphs of game engine results. Right now there is little connection between game results and real life unless players act a certain very specific way. If they use the mechanics the game makes available then aircombat produces statistically anomalous results too often.

I would like to see naval combat revised slightly. It is pretty clear that manuever counts for too much in naval combat. Basically in real life to hit a target a WWII era ship had to steam in a straight line. That means ships that are firing and hitting cannot doge enemy shells. So a captain had to choose which he wanted to do, dodge or hit back.

This is not what happens in WitP and it gives a very nice bonus to lighter forces, particularly CLs Vs heavy ships like BBs. It would be really nice if this were fixed.

I would like to see gunnery looked at as well. We did some analysis a while back and it seems there is no relationship between rate of fire, shells in ammo magazines and time in action. In fact if I recall there was an inverse relationship, larger shells like 15" or 16" give a player fewer opportunities to fire before running out of ammo than smaller shells like 6" even though the number of shells in the magazine is the same and the rate of fire of the bigger guns is slower.

Just my two cents

(in reply to ctangus)

Post #: 38

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 2:58:48 AM

Tom Hunter
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/14/2004
Status: offline

As an afterthought it occurs to me that BB Ammo may have been reduced to curtail shore bombardment missions. If that is true it is kind of sad because it creates a unit that is very dangerous to land units and less dangerous to shipping in the game, but BBs were historically very dangerous to shipping and somewhat less dangerous to land units.

Another fix to naval combat, if a single (or more than one) surface warship encounters a single merchant ship the merchant should sunk. There is no case in history of a merchant ship escaping a surface raider with more speed. Convoy scatter is different, of course some get away, but if a CA sights an 8 knot AK and wants the kill the chance is 100% in real life, but much less than that in game.

Both the Naval examples above and the air combat make me think that relatively little mathmatical analysis of the war was done during the game design which is unfortunate.

(in reply to Tom Hunter)

Post #: 39

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 5:53:43 AM

Mynok
Matrix Legion of Merit

Posts: 12108
Joined: 11/30/2002
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Let me add my gratitude to Matrix and 2by3 for their continued support of this very fun game. It will never satisfy everyone's desires, but it's still dern fun.

Thanks to all, and especially those who, despite their issues, continue to be involved with the game and provide suggestions to make it a better game. If they didn't think it was worth it, I don't believe they would do it. That says alot about the game.

(in reply to captskillet)

Post #: 40

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 6:29:43 AM

scout1
Matrix Legion of Merit

Posts: 2899
Joined: 8/24/2004
From: South Bend, In
Status: offline

Yes, the support given has been greatly appreciated

Now where I agree with many of the above selections, I'd also add in a change to the UI that permits mass/multi ship lcu loading rather than the current build a tf and try. frankly, i should be able to click on a lcu and the game engine tell me the size of tf needed.

(in reply to Mynok)

Post #: 41

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 7:11:19 AM

GaryChildress
Matrix Legion of Merit

Posts: 6830
Joined: 7/17/2005
From: The Divided Nations of Earth
Status: offline

Me? I'd just as soon pay Matrix for a comprehensive patch. Who wouldn't pay for the opportunity to play an almost flawless game? Perhaps the original $70+ price tag was relatively cheap compared to what we want out of the game. I mean just think how much it would cost the DoD to get Lockheed Martin to creat a simulation of WW2 which gave historically accurate results (jokes about $1000 toilet seats aside).

Matrix has gone above and beyond the call of duty in supporting this game. Obviously free patches don't pay salaries nor keep doors open. Perhaps its time to call in some outside technical expertise to try to solve some of the issues in game mechanics etc. That cost's money so why not sell a comprehensive patch. As an incentive to the designers give it a money back guarantee only on condition that said issues were not resolved.

Gary

(in reply to scout1)

Post #: 42

RE: A thought on WitP in general... - 11/28/2005 5:01:30 PM

madmickey
Matrix Elite Guard

Posts: 1336
Joined: 2/11/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline

Mr. Frag in one of his appearances in Mogami bar and grill admitted that there was no way to fix all the computer bug problem because it was an upsized version of Uncommon valor written in a computer language that would have difficulty in handling this size of game. I think he mentioned it was written in C plus. This still does not solve all the unrealism problem in the game.

(in reply to GaryChildress)

Post #: 43

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