RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s)

RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (Full Version)

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CobraAus -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/20/2006 7:20:04 AM)
tempest mark II Cobra Aus [image]local://upfiles/13770/D3489DB3F90F4C66AEB15610FD4A8A62.jpg[/image]

el cid again -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/20/2006 9:00:46 AM)
I am still confused. Endurance is on the order of six hours - so where does this 54 minutes and an extra 30 minutes come from? If it IS less than 90 minutes, the stated ranges must be very exaggerated. I also wonder why RAF materials say the top speed is 390 mph and ROC 1500 ft/min? The same book gives the D model at 442 mph - which is rather higher than you say. Might it be that there is mixed data here? Say P-51A data and some B data on speed listed for the D? Can you define the B and D data side by side as you think is more or less average for warload situations? Finally, why is the D described as "long range, high altitude" but the B only as "long range"? You seem to be saying there is a turbosupercharger on the B. Is there some OTHER reason it cannot be used at altitude? [Say a lack of oxygen equipment]? Or is it a performance thing? Or are both more or less the same, except for weapons. Right now the big difference in weapons seems to be the addition of rockets (for the D).

keeferon01 -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/20/2006 4:34:18 PM)
For Cobra Tempest II [image]local://upfiles/17042/B961AAC29A3A4198A605B5AD0F5917AD.jpg[/image]

keeferon01 -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/20/2006 4:35:31 PM)
Tempest Mk V [image]local://upfiles/17042/34FC22080C5B420A8AF384F96CAD5945.jpg[/image]

Hipper -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/20/2006 11:09:37 PM)
Posts: 1315 Joined: 10/10/2005 Status: offline I am still confused. Endurance is on the order of six hours - so where does this 54 minutes and an extra 30 minutes come from? If it IS less than 90 minutes, the stated ranges must be very exaggerated. That data is from a flight simulation site I suspect he is talking about flying around at full power rather than cruse speed I also wonder why RAF materials say the top speed is 390 mph and ROC 1500 ft/min? The same book gives the D model at 442 mph - which is rather higher than you say. Might it be that there is mixed data here? The RAF tended to give their max speed using worst case conditions that 390 mph may be with full fuel and ammo load and with drop tanks attached ( on the other hand the quoted figure for the D model may be on internal fuel and in a clean configuration. Say P-51A data and some B data on speed listed for the D? Can you define the B and D data side by side as you think is more or less average for warload situations? Ill work on this Finally, why is the D described as "long range, high altitude" but the B only as "long range"? You seem to be saying there is a turbosupercharger on the B. Is there some OTHER reason it cannot be used at altitude? [Say a lack of oxygen equipment]? Or is it a performance thing? Or are both more or less the same, except for weapons. The main differences between the B & D models were the increase in guns from 4 to 6 and the bubble canopy also I think an extra fuel tank was added in the d to increase range. Cheers Jim Right now the big difference in weapons seems to be the addition of rockets (for the D). [/quote]

Hipper -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/21/2006 12:37:13 AM)
Hi Cid here is some stuff culled from zenoswarbirdvideos.com Basic Data P51 B P51D Max speed 440 437 Climb rate 2770 2400 See the following links for P51D climb data, note that with drop tanks rate of climb drops to 1950 ft/min http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/Images/P-51/P-51MPC.gif you can get other maximum climb rates for the P 51D including 3475 ft/min initial climb I suspect that this is in clean conditions with emergency boost it depends what you mean by maximum climb rate

el cid again -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/21/2006 12:48:46 AM)
quote: The main differences between the B & D models were the increase in guns from 4 to 6 and the bubble canopy also I think an extra fuel tank was added in the d to increase range. Are you saying the B has only four guns? I see the CHS listing has it this way. The RAF book is backwards - so maybe they got a lot of things reversed.

el cid again -> RE: Allied Aircraft (Soviet DC-3s) (2/21/2006 12:52:51 AM)
quote: it depends what you mean by maximum climb rate Yes it does and it is a problem. Whatever definition we use, it should be the same for all machines. But regretfully data is not always recorded the same way for all machines. Usually you get initial rate of climb - and it is usually clean - or you get minutes x to altitude y - and it is usually loaded. But not both. I would love someone to tell me EITHER ONE for ALL 249 slots! But in that case I must sent them my file - since I have a score of new planes.

el cid again -> Allied Air OB (2/21/2006 12:58:55 AM)
This is in mixed condition. Almost no units have upgrades defined (and Joe said "always define upgrades"). That is a chance to help a unit stay historical too. Quite a few have the wrong plane or date or location. And it varies by nation. I have little data on RCAF - except for units that went to Alaska - but the rest of the Commonwealth is lovingly done - and better than US units are. There is also a problem with names - and it is historical. Is a fighter squadron a fighter squadron or a pursuit squadron? CHS SAID (when doing the Japanese) "use the first name if it is in theater" - but that is not what they did with the USAAC! I decided to be strictly historical - so if a unit begins as Pursuit and never changes - it is Pursuit - if it begins as Fighter and never changes it is Fighter - and if it is the majority case, it begins as Pursuit and changes to Fighter - I use Pursuit/Fighter. But a few units don't stay with fighters - they get bombers - or night fighters - and other variations (like mixed types - often transports and bombers or recon and bombers). No matter what choices you make someone will not be happy I am sure!

el cid again -> Any new plane requests? (2/21/2006 3:33:16 PM)
I am about to submit the aircraft files for testing. These include certain device slots, the aircraft file and the air group file. They form a set and about 240 of the 249 slots are filled. Most of the rest of the lines are comments to help modders find planes - and most of the planes are in alphanumeric order by country - so you can find them easily. But in principle something very interesting could be added. If you have any request submit it now. [Sorry - no carrier slots. I tried to kill the Sea Hurricane - only one squadron uses it - but I failed - so there are no slots - unless you have a nomination for a plane to kill.] One more thing - you may thing of a blimp as an aircraft - but I have concluded it isn't in our game. Planes cannot patrol more than 24 hours, and there are other issues - so while we will have two airship stations on the US West Coast (Los Angelus and Tillimook Oregon) - they will be using "airships" that are literally ships - not airplanes! This means adding a blimp class does not require a valuable plane slot. Generally, I have added most of the more interesting planes, and tried to get rid of planes almost duplicated by others in the list. Thus there are heavy transports on both sides, gliders on both sides, and critical function planes are added (a submarine bomber for I-12 and I-400 classes, the G8N1 heavy bomber - because the G5 was really a heavy transport after it failed to develop bomber performance - and the very strange IJA carrier planes! are examples).

m10bob -> RE: Any new plane requests? (2/21/2006 3:51:53 PM)
quote: One more thing - you may thing of a blimp as an aircraft - but I have concluded it isn't in our game. Planes cannot patrol more than 24 hours, and there are other issues - so while we will have two airship stations on the US West Coast (Los Angelus and Tillimook Oregon) - they will be using "airships" that are literally ships - not airplanes! This means adding a blimp class does not require a valuable plane slot. I have always wanted blimps included in the game, but due to the 'time" thing, they were not included as a/c. If used as "ships", they might get "sunk". If they were instead treated as a land unit, exerting a ZOC, it might fill the bill and still give the intended results?(Maybe a zoc extending out a few hexes??) If so, the picture of a blimp could be put on the box for the "land unit". I believe Cobra did a blimp last year? I included a blimp page in that "Research" thread recently, showing several stations.[:)] http://www.bluejacket.com/usn_avi_ww2_blimps.html http://www.lompocrecord.com/articles/2004/05/15/news/news12.txt

el cid again -> RE: Any new plane requests? (2/21/2006 5:18:25 PM)
quote: I have always wanted blimps included in the game, but due to the 'time" thing, they were not included as a/c. If used as "ships", they might get "sunk". Actually, we know from airship accidents and combat that if an airship is shot down at sea it DOES get sunk!

el cid again -> RE: Any new plane requests? (2/21/2006 5:21:49 PM)
quote: If they were instead treated as a land unit, exerting a ZOC, it might fill the bill and still give the intended results?(Maybe a zoc extending out a few hexes??) If so, the picture of a blimp could be put on the box for the "land unit". I do not think you understand the nature of an airship on this scale: at 90 knots it moves 18 hexes every 12 hours! Also - how can we put a "land unit" at sea? Finally, how can we influence the "zone of control" size of a land unit? Or change what it means so it affects things naval - things like reporting or even attacking them? I don't see any way to go down this road, technically speaking. Unless your vision is clearer than mine. [Got any code?]

el cid again -> RE: Any new plane requests? (2/21/2006 5:23:25 PM)
quote: I believe Cobra did a blimp last year? Yes he did - and he gratiously has shared his art. As he has for many planes and ships I have added. Cobra is the fastest art creater I know - but never faster than when he did it even before I asked!

m10bob -> RE: Any new plane requests? (2/22/2006 3:43:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: el cid again quote: I have always wanted blimps included in the game, but due to the 'time" thing, they were not included as a/c. If used as "ships", they might get "sunk". Actually, we know from airship accidents and combat that if an airship is shot down at sea it DOES get sunk! LMAO[sm=bow.gif][sm=Christo_pull_hair.gif][sm=00000280.gif]

el cid again -> Plane List Postings (2/23/2006 4:14:07 AM)
I have just posted the Japanese plane list as it is. Every slot in used - 75 out of 75 permitted. However, there are some low usage types. I will presently post a larger list for Allied planes. There are a few unused slots - and again there are some low usage types. If any significant type is missing, please say so. For example, it appears there may have been a Naval torpedo version of the IL-2 not in the present OB. Investingting.

el cid again -> RE: Allied List (Rev 0.05) (3/1/2006 12:13:34 AM)
This is the list of Allied Planes: Anything we don't need? Anything vital missing? Designation Type Maneuverability Durability FerryRange NormRange ExtRange OpCeiling FwdFirepower RearFirepower Payload [=Bombload+Rockets+Droptanks or Cargo] RN CARRIER AIRCRAFT Albacore Torpedo-Bomber 10 6 34 13 13 16560 1 1 2000 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo Avenger I/II Torpedo-Bomber 16 6 20 8 8 17920 1 2 1600 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo; 8xRockets = 304 Barracuda Torpedo-Bomber 13 7 20 8 8 17707 0 1 1800 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo Corsair III/IV Fighter 26 7 16 6 6 28587 12 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft Firefly I Fighter 20 7 22 8 8 22560 28 0 2480 Carrier Aircraft; 8xRockets = 304 Fulmar Fighter 16 7 14 5 5 27733 16 0 500 Carrier Aircraft Hellcat II Fighter 25 8 11 4 4 29840 12 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft; 6xRockets = 228 Martlet I/II/III Fighter 20 6 14 5 5 24640 8 0 200 Carrier Aircraft Seafire I/II Fighter 26 6 8 3 3 34133 18 0 500 Carrier Aircraft Seafire III/XV Fighter 27 6 12 4 4 35200 18 0 500 Carrier Aircraft; 1xDrop Tank Sea Hurricane Fighter 20 6 17 6 6 26160 8 0 660 Carrier Aircraft; 1xDrop Tank Swordfish II/III Torpedo-Bomber 8 5 9 3 3 8560 1 1 1500 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo; 8xRockets = 304 Wildcat/Martlet IV+ Fighter 20 7 14 5 5 27200 12 0 200 Carrier Aircraft; 6xRockets = 228 USN CARRIER AIRCRAFT F2A-3 Buffalo Fighter 21 6 16 6 6 26560 8 0 200 Carrier Aircraft F4F-3 Wildcat Fighter 21 5 14 5 5 24640 8 0 200 Carrier Aircraft F4F-4 Wildcat Fighter 20 6 13 5 5 27920 12 0 200 Carrier Aircraft F4U-1D Corsair Fighter 26 7 16 6 6 28587 12 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft F4U-2 Corsair (NF) Night Fighter 26 7 16 6 6 28800 8 0 100 Carrier Aircraft F4U-4 Corsair Fighter 30 7 17 6 6 39840 12 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft F6F-5 Hellcat Fighter 25 7 17 6 6 29840 12 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft F6F-5N Hellcat [NF] Night Fighter 24 7 14 5 5 29000 22 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft F7F Tigercat Fighter-Bomber 28 9 26 10 10 41600 36 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo F8F-1 Bearcat Fighter 29 7 23 9 9 40832 8 0 2000 Carrier Aircraft SB2C Helldiver Dive-Bomber 18 7 20 8 7 31040 14 4 2000 Carrier Aircraft US LAND AIRCRAFT A-20B Boston Level-Bomber 11 8 38 15 15 22880 4 4 2600 A-20G Havoc Level-Bomber 10 9 45 18 18 20640 12 6 4000 A-24 Dauntless Dive-Bomber 14 7 19 7 7 21680 4 2 1200 A-26B Invader Level-Bomber 10 10 30 12 12 25040 12 8 6000 A-36A Apache Fighter-Bomber 23 7 23 9 9 25600 12 0 1000 B-17D Fortress Level-Bomber 4 16 57 22 22 33300 6 4 10496 B-17E/F Fortress Level-Bomber 5 16 57 22 22 32400 6 8 17600 B-17G Fortress Level-Bomber 4 16 57 22 22 32040 10 8 17600 1xH2X Navigation Radar B-18A Bolo/B-23 Level-Bomber 6 10 20 8 8 19120 1 1 6500 B-24D Liberator Level-Bomber 4 16 77 30 30 25600 6 8 8800 B-24J Liberator Level-Bomber 4 16 63 25 25 25200 8 8 16200 1xH2X Navigation Radar; 1xASV Radar B-25C/D Mitchell Level-Bomber 8 11 50 20 20 16900 4 4 3000 B-25H Mitchell Level-Bomber 8 10 45 18 18 19040 166 8 5200 1x75mm Gun; 8xRockets = 192 B-25J Mitchell Level-Bomber 8 10 45 18 18 19100 20 8 5200 8xRockets = 192 B-26A Marauder Level-Bomber 9 11 19 7 7 18800 6 6 5200 1xTorpedo B-26G Marauder Level-Bomber 8 11 18 7 7 15840 14 8 5200 B-29 Superfortress Level-Bomber 5 18 93 37 37 31850 8 12 20000 1xAPQ-13 Radar; 1xH2X Navigation Radar C-46A/R5C Commando Transport 8 10 20 8 8 22080 0 0 10000 C-47/C-53 Skytrain Transport 7 9 25 10 10 18560 0 0 10000 C-54A Skymaster Transport 4 13 65 26 26 17600 0 0 10000 1xH2X Navigation Radar C-60A Lodestar Transport 8 8 28 11 11 21040 0 0 5726 C-87/LB-30 Liberator Transport 4 14 48 19 19 27900 0 0 8800 1xH2X Navigation Radar 2xCG-4 Glider & C-47 Transport 4 18 29 11 11 18000 0 0 17600 F-4 Lightning Recon 12 9 24 9 9 35100 0 0 0 1xDrop Tank F4U-1 Corsair Fighter 27 7 17 6 6 29520 6 0 200 F-5C Lightning Recon 13 9 38 15 15 39600 0 0 3200 1xDrop Tank F-6A Mustang Recon 24 7 37 14 14 28800 0 0 1000 2xDrop Tanks F-6D Mustang Recon 29 7 39 15 15 38300 0 0 1500 2xDrop Tanks OS2U-3 Kingfisher Float-Plane 9 4 19 7 7 10400 1 1 650 P-26A Fighter 16 4 6 2 2 21920 2 0 200 P-35A Hawk Fighter 19 5 19 7 7 24480 3 0 350 P-36A Mohawk Fighter 22 5 14 5 5 26400 3 0 400 P-38G Lightning Fighter-Bomber 14 9 24 9 9 31200 15 0 2000 P-38J Lightning Fighter-Bomber 14 9 38 15 15 35200 15 0 3200 10xRockets = 240 P-38L Lightning Fighter-Bomber 15 9 38 15 15 37594 15 0 4000 10xRockets = 240 P-39D Airacobra Fighter 22 6 10 4 4 23200 18 0 500 1x37mm Gun P-39Q Airacobra Fighter 26 6 11 4 4 27733 20 0 500 1x37mm Gun P-40B Tomahawk Fighter 22 6 16 6 6 26027 8 0 100 P-40E Warhawk Fighter 22 7 15 6 6 30933 12 0 250 P-40N Warhawk Fighter 22 6 23 9 9 32000 12 0 500 P-43A Lancer Fighter 23 5 24 9 9 28800 6 0 200 P-47C Thunderbolt Fighter 27 7 21 8 8 44800 16 0 500 P-47D Thunderbolt Fighter 28 7 30 12 12 44800 16 0 2000 10xRockets = 240 P-47N Thunderbolt Fighter 28 7 38 15 15 44800 16 0 2000 10xRockets = 240 P-400 Airacobra Fighter 22 6 13 5 5 14933 15 0 500 P-51B Mustang Fighter 28 7 37 14 14 37800 8 0 2000 2xDrop Tanks P-51D Mustang Fighter 27 7 38 15 15 38250 12 0 2000 2xDrop Tanks; 6xRockets = 144 P-61A Black Widow Night Fighter 11 10 50 20 20 26480 36 0 6404 1xMark X AI Radar P-63A Kingcobra Fighter 27 7 37 14 14 34400 15 0 2500 1x37mm Gun P-66 Vanguard Fighter 22 5 14 5 5 22560 8 0 0 P-70A Havoc (NF) Night Fighter 10 9 45 18 18 20640 16 0 4000 1xAI Mk VII Radar P-80A Shooting Star Fighter 18 8 10 4 4 42750 12 0 0 PBM Mariner Patrol 5 11 36 14 14 13520 8 5 2100 1xASV Radar PBN Nomad/GST Patrol 6 9 43 17 17 17280 2 0 4000 PBY-5 Catalina Patrol 6 9 50 20 19 17280 1 0 4000 PB2Y-3 Coronado Patrol 3 16 25 10 9 16720 8 8 8000 1xASV Radar PB4Y-1 Liberator Patrol 4 16 49 19 19 25440 6 8 12800 1xASV Radar PBJ-1J Mitchell Patrol 8 10 45 18 18 19100 20 8 5200 1xASV Radar PV-1 Ventura Level-Bomber 10 9 28 11 11 21040 8 4 3500 1xTorpedo; 1xASV Radar PV-1 Ventura (NF) Night Fighter 10 9 28 11 11 21040 16 4 3000 1xAI Mk VII Radar R4D-5 Skytrain Transport 7 9 33 13 13 18000 0 0 6000 R5D-1 Skymaster Transport 4 13 65 26 26 17600 0 0 10000 1xH2X Navigation Radar SOC/SO3C Seagull Float-Plane 10 5 16 6 6 11920 1 1 650 UK LAND AIRCRAFT Beaufighter VIF (NF) Night Fighter 10 9 25 10 10 23120 34 0 500 Beaufighter Mk X Fighter-Bomber 9 9 25 9 9 12000 32 0 2127 1xTorpedo Beaufort VII Torpedo-Bomber 8 10 27 10 10 13200 8 4 1548 1xTorpedo Blenheim I Level-Bomber 8 7 19 7 7 21824 2 1 2000 Blenheim IF (NF) Night Fighter 8 8 18 7 7 21500 6 1 1000 1xAI Mk IV Radar Blenheim IV Level-Bomber 8 8 24 9 9 19680 4 2 1320 Boomerang II Fighter 21 6 27 10 10 27200 18 0 66 Brewster 339D Fighter 21 5 16 6 6 26560 8 0 200 Buffalo Fighter 20 6 11 4 4 24400 8 0 0 Catalina I Patrol 6 9 50 20 19 17280 1 0 4000 2xTorpedo; 1xASV Radar CIXV-W Float-Plane 9 4 10 3 3 14176 2 2 200 Corsair I Fighter 27 7 17 6 6 29520 8 0 200 CW-21B Demon Fighter 22 5 10 4 4 27440 3 0 0 Dakota I (C-47) Transport 7 9 25 10 10 18560 0 0 10000 Cargo Do 24K-2 Patrol 5 11 14 5 5 14439 8 8 2642 Empire Patrol 5 12 25 7 10 16000 4 8 6429 Cargo F.K.51 Recon 9 4 8 3 3 14696 1 1 0 4xDC Hawk 75A Fighter 20 5 10 4 4 23012 4 0 400 Hudson IV Level-Bomber 9 8 36 14 14 19600 4 2 1000 Hurricane I Fighter 21 6 9 3 3 26560 8 0 0 Hurricane IIc Fighter 22 6 16 6 6 28480 28 0 1660 1xDrop Tank Hurricane IV Fighter 19 6 14 5 5 26200 2 0 1660 1xDrop Tank; 8xRockets = 388 Kittyhawk I Fighter 22 7 15 6 6 29867 12 0 200 Kittyhawk III Fighter 22 7 24 9 9 32000 12 0 500 Lancer Fighter 23 5 24 9 9 28800 8 0 200 Lancaster VII(FE) Level-Bomber 4 16 45 18 18 19600 8 8 18000 Liberator VI Level-Bomber 4 16 55 22 24 28800 29 5 12800 1xASV Radar Lockheed 212 Transport 7 6 13 5 5 17840 0 0 1326 Lysander I Recon 14 5 11 4 4 27733 1 1 400 Martin 139 (B-10) Level-Bomber 7 7 19 7 7 20160 1 1 2260 Mitchell III Level-Bomber 8 10 45 18 18 19100 20 8 5200 8xRockets = 192 Mohawk IV Fighter 22 6 11 4 4 35947 4 0 400 Mosquito B.XVI Level-Bomber 12 7 76 22 30 36000 0 0 4760 2xDrop Tank Mosquito FB.VI Fighter-Bomber 12 7 28 11 11 31200 32 0 2140 1xDrop Tank; 8xRockets = 192 Mosquito PR.XVI Recon 12 7 77 23 31 36000 0 0 660 2xDrop Tank Spitfire VB Fighter 24 7 19 7 7 31680 18 0 830 1xDrop Tank Spitfire VIII Fighter 26 7 20 7 7 38700 18 0 1330 1xDrop Tank Spitfire XIVE Fighter 28 7 14 5 5 39150 18 0 1000 Sunderland III Patrol 3 16 50 19 19 14320 8 8 4960 3xDC; 1xASV Radar Tempest V Fighter 31 7 26 10 10 32400 28 0 2000 1xDrop Tank; 8xRockets = 388 T-IVa Torpedo-Bomber 10 6 19 7 7 20651 2 1 1764 1xTorpedo Thunderbolt II Fighter 25 7 33 13 13 36416 16 0 2000 1xDrop Tank Vengeance I Dive-Bomber 17 6 38 15 15 17840 4 2 2000 Ventura V Level-Bomber 10 9 18 7 7 27520 8 4 3500 1xTorpedo; 1xASD Radar Vildebeest IV Torpedo-Bomber 9 5 11 4 4 13600 1 1 1000 1xTorpedo Walrus Float-Plane 9 5 10 4 4 14800 2 1 760 3xDC Wellington IC Level-Bomber 7 11 67 26 11 14400 2 4 4500 Wirraway CA-1 Fighter 14 5 12 4 4 18400 2 1 1000 Spitfire PR.XI Recon 27 7 33 10 13 36000 0 0 0 USSR LAND AIRCRAFT I-153c Fighter 20 4 9 3 3 28084 4 0 220 I-16 Type 4 Fighter 17 5 8 3 3 19614 16 0 100 I-16 Type 24 Fighter 23 6 11 4 4 27900 16 0 660 6xRockets = 144 KOR-1 Float-Plane 11 5 5 2 2 18373 2 1 221 IL-2 Shturmovik Dive-Bomber 15 8 8 3 3 15704 16 0 1321 2x23mm Guns IL-2M Shturmovik Dive-Bomber 15 9 7 2 2 15753 16 4 1321 2x23mm Guns IL-4C/DB-3F Level-Bomber 9 9 39 15 15 25459 4 2 5512 1xTorpedo LaGG-3 Fighter 23 5 10 4 4 25200 11 0 590 6xRockets = 144 La-5FN Fighter 27 6 12 4 4 24893 14 0 662 6xRockets = 144 La-7 Fighter 28 6 7 2 2 31005 21 0 441 Li-2VP (C-47) Cub Transport 6 9 26 10 10 14696 8 8 6504 Cargo MiG-3 Fighter 26 6 13 5 5 35433 4 0 440 Pe-2 Dive-Bomber 11 9 16 6 6 32882 3 2 2645 Pe-2R Recon 11 9 16 6 6 33000 2 1 2645 R-12 [Yak-4] Recon 11 5 13 5 5 23096 1 1 1323 SB-2 Level-Bomber 8 8 24 9 9 20000 2 1 2205 SB-2C Level-Bomber 9 8 24 9 9 20472 2 1 2205 Tu-2S Level-Bomber 10 10 21 8 8 24936 14 4 6614 Yak-1 Fighter-Bomber 25 6 10 4 4 26248 9 0 440 Yak-3 Fighter 28 6 9 3 3 31887 11 0 0 Yak-9D Fighter 24 5 15 5 5 27820 9 0 0 Yak-9UF Recon 26 5 15 6 6 31500 0 0 0 USN CARRIER AIRCRAFT 0 0 0 0 SB2U-2 Vindicator Dive-Bomber 15 6 19 7 7 18880 1 1 1000 Carrier Aircraft SBD-3 Dauntless Dive-Bomber 14 7 19 7 7 23125 4 2 1200 Carrier Aircraft SBD-5 Dauntless Dive-Bomber 15 7 18 7 7 20736 4 2 2250 Carrier Aircraft TBD Devastator Torpedo-Bomber 12 6 12 4 4 16640 1 2 1000 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo TBF/TBM-1 Avenger Torpedo-Bomber 16 7 20 8 8 19115 1 2 1600 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo TBF/TBM-3 Avenger Torpedo-Bomber 18 7 17 6 6 25685 4 2 2000 Carrier Aircraft; 1xTorpedo

Iron Duke -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/1/2006 5:30:42 PM)
Hi, Beaufighter Vif as far as i can find never carried or was equipped to carry a torpedo. Beaufighter VIF's in FE/Burma used as NightFighters or Night Interdiction role. 60 Beaufighter VIC's were modified to carry torpedoes and designated MK VIC [ ITF ] 'Interim torpedo fighters ' to make beau's more suitable for low altitute work new engines were fitted , with these engines fitted they were designated Beaufighter TF.MK X [or 'Torbeau'] Why no Beaufighter Ic 's for RAAF why no Beaufighter MK 21's for RAAF Why so many Transports when missing or incorrect combat aircraft? cheers

Black Mamba 1942 -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/1/2006 10:27:42 PM)
The torp carrying Beaufighter never served in the PTO. It was originally included in UV, but too many Fanboys cried foul. So it was removed from UV, and discluded from WITP.

el cid again -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 12:07:55 AM)
quote: Beaufighter Vif as far as i can find never carried or was equipped to carry a torpedo. Beaufighter VIF's in FE/Burma used as NightFighters or Night Interdiction role. 60 Beaufighter VIC's were modified to carry torpedoes and designated MK VIC [ ITF ] 'Interim torpedo fighters ' to make beau's more suitable for low altitute work new engines were fitted , with these engines fitted they were designated Beaufighter TF.MK X [or 'Torbeau'] Why no Beaufighter Ic 's for RAAF why no Beaufighter MK 21's for RAAF Why so many Transports when missing or incorrect combat aircraft? OK - I know most gamers are more Japanese in attitude than American (that is, sexy combat planes are chic, but mere logistics is for bean counters). But I am somewhat logistic oriented. My several additions of transports (there were NO heavy transports on EITHER side - I added C-54 and C-83 for the allies and G5M1 as a transport and H8K2-L for the Japanese; I also added another Japanese less than heavy transport because of range issues - it could not be represented by any other type and was used in real airborne ops; and I added gliders to both sides) are due to that. They will radically change the game (according to Joe) - and I am about to convert the Empire flying boat to a transport too (neatly balancing the Japanese flying boat transports I think, although that isn't why). It will greatly improve flexability of strategic movement and - combined with airborne which we have studied in great detail - also change some minor ops (airborne won't take anything but lightly defended hexes or undefended ones). As for combat types, my philosophy is that one type can represent several similar ones. I would rather have a whole new plane than two similar ones of the same name. That said, I have just freed up several slots: if you have a request now is the time to post it. I am not particularly interested in one squadron/group planes - but if many units used it I am very interested. This thread is for that purpose. Note I have one available Allied carrier slot and NO requests to fill it, but quite a few non-carrier slots.

Iron Duke -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 12:38:44 AM)
Hi, your right if you are excluding India/Burma but as these areas are in the game then a torp. carrying Beaufighter did serve,the TF.MK X was used by RAF sqdns as an upgrade from the VIF and the Mosquito [ due to problems with the glue used in the manufacture of the mossy- did not like the humidity]

Iron Duke -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 12:43:30 AM)
Hi , Ok you like logistics no problem ,your mod , but are you creating a Historical mod? a Beaufighter VIF carring a torpedo is fantasy.

Black Mamba 1942 -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 12:48:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Iron Duke Hi, your right if you are excluding India/Burma but as these areas are in the game then a torp. carrying Beaufighter did serve,the TF.MK X was used by RAF sqdns as an upgrade from the VIF and the Mosquito [ due to problems with the glue used in the manufacture of the mossy- did not like the humidity] Jap Fanboys didn't think it was fair for the Allies to have them. So they were left out on purpose.[;)] Sorry, it wasn't me who made that decision.[:D]

el cid again -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 12:54:12 AM)
quote: Ok you like logistics no problem ,your mod , but are you creating a Historical mod? a Beaufighter VIF carring a torpedo is fantasy. In my database the VIF is a night fighter without a torpedo. Did I post something different? If so it is an error. Possibly you have skipped lines and confused it with the next one below - a X model.

Hipper -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 4:08:20 AM)
quote: Beaufighter VIF (NF) Night Fighter 10 9 25 10 10 23120 34 0 500 1xTorpedo sorry Cid the nightfighter seems to have a torpedo ! Great work btw I'm very impressed with you working out the maneuver formula have you given any thought to making the Fulmar a fighterbomber rather than a fighter ! Dunno how much difference that makes but thats as close as we can get using the rules to its role Cheers Hipper

el cid again -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 4:16:43 AM)
quote: have you given any thought to making the Fulmar a fighterbomber rather than a fighter ! A fighter bomber is not very effective (in game code according to the manual and experienced players). I do this for twin engine planes UNLESS like P-38 they are exceptionally maneuverable - and I do NOT do it for single engine planes - UNLESS very ineffective (there are a few of these).

el cid again -> RE: Plane List Postings/Beaufighters (3/2/2006 4:20:15 AM)
quote: sorry Cid the nightfighter seems to have a torpedo ! You are right - in the report it is a typo - but it is right in the database and I corrected the report above. Thanks.

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