What about this picture? (Full Version)

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Korpraali V -> What about this picture? (2/4/2006 6:32:33 AM)

What?

When?

Where?

[image]local://upfiles/17362/28053EF9F5D04F859A4EC43515466789.jpg[/image]



FlashfyreSP -> RE: What about this picture? (2/4/2006 6:53:58 AM)

I can tell there are 2 Renault R35 tanks towing another AFV, but I can't quite decipher the make of it.



stevemk1a -> RE: What about this picture? (2/4/2006 6:54:37 AM)

First impression without resorting to any books or Google-fu is that it's two (probably captured or export model) French H-35's towing what looks to be a Soviet BT-series tank of some kind ... [&:]



stevemk1a -> RE: What about this picture? (2/4/2006 8:00:50 AM)

Ok ... so after further reading I'll make another guess. French H-35, 38, and 39 tanks captured by the Germans in 1940 were incorporated into some German units. First to see action was the 211th Panzerabteilung with the new designation Pz35, 38, or 39H. The unit attacked the Soviet Union from Finland (interesting fact considering the nationality of the poster [;)]!) ....

I'll guess it's Pz 38H's in Russia 1941 towing a captured BT tank.



omegaall -> RE: What about this picture? (2/4/2006 4:10:06 PM)

Actually the centre vehicle appears to be an armoured recover/vehicle/tank.

The wheel pattern looks Russian.
The way people are standing it looks more as if the ARC is actually pulling the other 2 vehicles, the chain layout does not look right.

Note the way the chain from the centre vehicle to the right hand vehicle appears to wrap along the centre vehicle from its connection point.
Also the centre vehicle appears more Russian due to the amount of text on the 'turret'

Seems like an ‘evaluation’ test.



Korpraali V -> RE: What about this picture? (2/4/2006 4:58:08 PM)

Some were right, some were not... They are Renault R35 tanks and the third one is BT, yes. It's Russian BT-2. Renaults are towing it. But this is not Finnish front and these are not Germans.

The year is 41 but the area and nationalities are still a mystery...



Korpraali V -> RE: What about this picture? (2/5/2006 5:46:12 AM)

The text under the picture says:
"Two R-35s tow captured BT-2 in Bessarabia 7-41"

So they are Romanian tanks. But it actually may not be BT-2. BT-2s turret was round, and this is not... weird. Perhaps it's some other BT but I could not right now recognize the model.

So this turned out a real question... [:D][:D]



Major Destruction -> RE: What about this picture? (2/5/2006 6:27:41 PM)

Looks like a BT-5




FlashfyreSP -> RE: What about this picture? (2/5/2006 6:37:41 PM)

I'd say it was a BT-7...the turret sides look slightly sloped, which was a feature of the BT-7 series (a conical turret) instead of the cylindrical one of the BT-5 series.



Major Destruction -> RE: What about this picture? (2/6/2006 6:21:42 PM)

I am looking at the turret hatch cover (which is very hard to see) and considering that the turret is not in the 180 degree position, the large round hatch cover of the BT-7 should be much easier to see than in this photo. The BT-5 had a rectangular hatch with a lower height when open.



pyguinard -> RE: What about this picture? (2/17/2006 5:11:27 PM)

I know that I am jumping very late into this discussion but...
Here are some BT-5 Tanks

[image]local://upfiles/17756/A96F7722E38A480E803D501C912E56DA.jpg[/image]



pyguinard -> RE: What about this picture? (2/17/2006 5:28:39 PM)

... and here are the BT-7s. As you can see, both tanks look alike but the most noticeable difference is the turret. It is cylindrical on the BT-5 and conical on the BT-7 thus FlashfyreSP was right! [:)]

[image]local://upfiles/17756/6472066A44684FDA8F2FD3E47EB8166C.jpg[/image]



Korpraali V -> RE: What about this picture? (2/20/2006 9:00:14 AM)

Yes, it may well be so.



264rifle -> RE: What about this picture? (2/20/2006 2:10:13 PM)

I am voting for the BT-2. Notice the slope of the turret roof forward of the man in the hatch or standing behind turret. Note also that turret side/rear apperars vertical . turret appears to be rotated slightly to the right.



FlashfyreSP -> RE: What about this picture? (2/20/2006 5:17:34 PM)

Turret is turned to face the rear left quarter of the tank, gun pointing behind the tank. Standard tow procedure for tanks. What is seen as a sloping front turret roof is in fact the attached stowage bin at the rear of the turret. The BT-2 had no bin and the BT-5's bin had a much flatter top. Both the BT-2 and BT-5 had cylindrical turrets; from the front, there would be no elongation to the turret shape. This elongation is a rear-view and is due to the stowage bin having angled sides to blend into the turret shape.

For plan views of these three vehicles, see:
BT-2: http://www.onwar.com/tanks/ussr/profiles/pbt2m32.htm
BT-5: http://www.onwar.com/tanks/ussr/profiles/pbt5_34.htm
BT-7: http://www.onwar.com/tanks/ussr/profiles/pbt7m37.htm



264rifle -> RE: What about this picture? (2/20/2006 11:43:45 PM)

Still doesn't look like a BT-7 to me. Hull front/glacis plate looks wrong around drivers hatch. There are at least two and maybe three different hull fronts on BT-7s but all had a break in the angle of the hull front on either side of drivers hatch.



pyguinard -> RE: What about this picture? (2/21/2006 6:55:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 264rifle

Still doesn't look like a BT-7 to me. Hull front/glacis plate looks wrong around drivers hatch. There are at least two and maybe three different hull fronts on BT-7s but all had a break in the angle of the hull front on either side of drivers hatch.


You can't see the hull front on Korpraali's picture because the latch is pressed down on top of it. I merely got caught aswell [X(]



264rifle -> RE: What about this picture? (2/22/2006 2:00:51 AM)

Maybe I worded my post badly. Look at the plate the hatch is in. If the plate on each side of the hatch looks like it is in one piece with the plate below the hatch or looks like it is on the same angle as the plate below the hatch then the tank is a BT-5 or earlier. If the plate on each side of the hatch looks like it is on a steeper (more vertical) angle than the plate below the drivers hatch then it is a BT-7.



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