Indoor Sack Cause? (Full Version)

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lotr13 -> Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 4:00:32 AM)

I have noticed this in all version of the game, but I am currently using 1.0.0.101, so I will put this here.

While playing with the PDS I began to notice that the sack problem on indoor plays seems to be caused by the "Move to: Next Point" command. With that command the OL will get bowled over by the DL and the QB will be sacked almost every time. However, if you change that one command to "Drop Back to Point" the OL suddenly is capable of blocking and the QB can get his pass off. I tried several defenses and the absolute biggest determination of the success of the play was this one command.

Can this be looked at?



Breeze -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 7:10:22 AM)

The problem exists outdoors as well; does this change help there also?



Marauders -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 9:45:18 AM)

quote:

While playing with the PDS I began to notice that the sack problem on indoor plays seems to be caused by the "Move to: Next Point" command. With that command the OL will get bowled over by the DL and the QB will be sacked almost every time.


The Move to: Next Point command has a final command attribute associated with it. One cannot use it with a blocking command at the same point. It cannot be used prior to a pass or look for pass command either.

quote:

However, if you change that one command to "Drop Back to Point" the OL suddenly is capable of blocking and the QB can get his pass off. I tried several defenses and the absolute biggest determination of the success of the play was this one command.


I assume you mean the quarterback using the Drop Back to Point command. Yes, you want the quarterback to do a drop. The Move to command is available once the quarterback has already dropped back or is in shotgun.

By the way, the center should block a bit better when the next patch comes out.



Magnum357 -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 11:25:53 AM)

Hey Marauders, so you are saying that if you want a Play were the QB will roll out of the pocket on a Pass play, be sure to first Give him some ""Drop Back to Point" logic", then give him "Move to point" logic to help the roll out? Am I correct on this?



Marauders -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 11:32:35 AM)

quote:

Hey Marauders, so you are saying that if you want a Play were the QB will roll out of the pocket on a Pass play, be sure to first Give him some ""Drop Back to Point" logic", then give him "Move to point" logic to help the roll out? Am I correct on this?


Yes, just as in the real world, the quarterback has to get off the line before he can roll out.



lotr13 -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 8:47:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marauders

quote:

While playing with the PDS I began to notice that the sack problem on indoor plays seems to be caused by the "Move to: Next Point" command. With that command the OL will get bowled over by the DL and the QB will be sacked almost every time.


The Move to: Next Point command has a final command attribute associated with it. One cannot use it with a blocking command at the same point. It cannot be used prior to a pass or look for pass command either.

quote:

However, if you change that one command to "Drop Back to Point" the OL suddenly is capable of blocking and the QB can get his pass off. I tried several defenses and the absolute biggest determination of the success of the play was this one command.


I assume you mean the quarterback using the Drop Back to Point command. Yes, you want the quarterback to do a drop. The Move to command is available once the quarterback has already dropped back or is in shotgun.

By the way, the center should block a bit better when the next patch comes out.



I believe I did not make myself clear. I am only talking about the QBs logic, no one elses.

In several of the stock plays the Move to Next Point command is used to simulate a rollout type play. On these plays the QB will inevitably end up getting sacked as the OL takes a coffee break.

With that in mind I took a straight drop back play and changed Dropback to Point to Move to Next Point. The QB is creamed again. Doing Dropback to Point then Move to Next Point is the same also. Dropback to Point by itself works just fine.

So, it seems to me this logic has something to do with how the OL blocks.



Marauders -> RE: Indoor Sack Cause? (3/22/2006 9:14:05 PM)

quote:

I believe I did not make myself clear. I am only talking about the QBs logic, no one elses.


Note that that is the assumption I made in the second paragraph. Thank you for the clarification.

quote:

In several of the stock plays the Move to Next Point command is used to simulate a rollout type play. On these plays the QB will inevitably end up getting sacked as the OL takes a coffee break.


That is likely the case. Which plays are they? I'll take a look at them.

quote:

With that in mind I took a straight drop back play and changed Dropback to Point to Move to Next Point. The QB is creamed again.


Dropping back is better in a pass.

quote:

Doing Dropback to Point then Move to Next Point is the same also. Dropback to Point by itself works just fine.


I went in and modified some plays having the QB drop back and then move to next point on a roll out. The line blocked fine, and the QB rolled out as I had wished.

quote:

So, it seems to me this logic has something to do with how the OL blocks.


I'll have to look at the plays. If you can post the stock names of one or two them, it would help.

If you could post the logic commands used at each point and in each order - including what the linemen logic commands are, it may also help.



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