"What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (Full Version)

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fbastos -> "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/12/2006 12:17:03 PM)

Don't throw the tomatoes yet, for I have seen the Ligh. But my first reaction was "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" - and others may react the same way and will come here looking for a sympathetic fellow. So read on, oh Doubter, for I went to the borders of desillusioment and came back a Believer - and so will you.

First, I had to forget about the "III" on the title; I think that this release would more precisely be "TOAW ACOW Matrix Edition", but the "III" created so much expectative that running the game the first time was a turn down. I also had to ignore the new graphics (I didn't like them at all). Just forget about both of them, dear Doubter, and you will be ready for the good stuff.

For one thing, I loved the new soundtrack - super! Then it took me 20 hours in the Overlord 44 game to recognize that disruption and reorganization are much better done here than previous versions - some nice tuning there. And the unit stats on the right side are really useful too. And there's some additional tweaking here and there that may entertain some, but didn't grab me.

Yet, I'm sure that a resilient Nonbeliever will not find any of that enough to justify spending $40.00 in a refitted an old game, when a brand new game costs about that. Nonbeliever is probably right should Matrix be your regular company, but here comes the kicker: you got to take Matrix as a special relationship case and can't compare such relationship with paying $50 for a box with Civ IV. You can't, because no matter how much you ask, Firaxis will never answer you e-mails, and Sid Meier will never take any of your ideas for Civ V.

Therefore, enlightenment came when I changed my view of the $40, away from a purchase of a boxed game to the price of rewnewing a partnership with Matrix. The results of that partnership have been mixed, and I'm specially pissed off that I'm getting older and older and Steel Panthers IX (=Combat Leader Cross of Iron or whatever) is never released, but Matrix has been good to me with Pacific War and SPWAW, so I (for now) keep my faith and remain a Believer.

F.



FlipTrac_511 -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/13/2006 1:32:58 AM)

Thanks for that info fbastos.  I have bought all the original iterations of the TOAW series but sadly have never played them thoroughly. It seems with each computer upgrade, the current TOAW release would seize to work.  It's sad that I've spent so much money on the series and spent little time with it.  But I was desperate to get a release to work reliably under WinXP and ultimately got a hold of ACOW.  Now, after I heard of TOAW3, I've been wondering what the differences were.  So thanks for posting specific changes in TOAW3.  The FAQs and release info that I've read thusfar do mention the changes and improvements, but it was vague as to whether those changes were exclusive to TOAW3 or a cumulative collection of improvements since the original TOAW.



jungelsj_slith -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/13/2006 1:42:38 AM)

I think a lot of the TAOW vets will notice more changes than I have, but I'm more of a casual wargamer. I can't say that I've thoroughly memorized the system, but have played it before. Here are the changes that I've noticed:

-new map graphics. This is probably the most substantial change for me. They're cleaner/clearer than ACOW, so I actually pay attention to terrain now. I generally didn't think about what terrain I was attacking into or defending from in ACOW because the terrain graphics were a bit more 'realistic' and muddy.

-proficiency/readiness/organization display. Subtle but nice nonetheless. I think there's a lot more that could have been done with the UI, and I hope that more, larger changes are made.

-a better attacking PO. I don't know if I would have noticed this if someone had not told me, but apparently the PO is supposed to be a lot better.

-new anti-armor modeling. Same as above, really. I'm glad that a more realistic algorithim is being used, but can't say that I've noticed a big change. I generally see a very small number of tanks destroyed by fire. The only time I see big 'losses' is when a unit is surrounded and captured.

Read some of the other threads here about the scenario selection. Personally, I can't say that I'm very happy with it - I'm playing the same scenarios that I played in ACOW, but I'm hoping the users will create new scenarios. Bummer that it has to be like that.


So in conclusion, I can't say it was really worth $40, for me, but I'm banking on matrix maintaining their promises for what TAOWIII is/was supposed to be, and continuing to patch the game. It's gotten me back into TAOW, so that's good.



Erik Rutins -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/13/2006 4:52:57 AM)

I definitely recommend reading these interviews as well for an idea of the process and changes behind TOAW III and the plan ahead:

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/articles.php?p=2658&page=1

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/articles.php?p=2649&page=1

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/articles.php?p=2680&page=1

Regards,

- Erik



jbunnelle -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/14/2006 5:23:07 PM)

The new graphics make it much easier to ascertain hexsides. Feels much less cluttered than before, although I suspect many new gamers might be turned off by it. But it just reminds me of "France 1940" and "PanzerBlitz". Ahhh..... [:D]



golden delicious -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/14/2006 6:10:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jbunnelle

The new graphics make it much easier to ascertain hexsides.


You do know you can toggle hexsides on and off- both in TOAW III and in COW?



Dr. Foo -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/14/2006 10:07:20 PM)

Yes, the PO is very agressive, much more then it was in COW. At times the PO would just stop attacking and sit there static while I manuvered to its rear, not so anymore. The PO is more capable of countering your movement and pressing the attack. It makes for much more enjoyable games.



ralphtricky -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/14/2006 11:31:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dr. Foo

Yes, the PO is very agressive, much more then it was in COW. At times the PO would just stop attacking and sit there static while I manuvered to its rear, not so anymore. The PO is more capable of countering your movement and pressing the attack. It makes for much more enjoyable games.

Thanks.

Just wait until people start designing scenarios for the new PO/AI...

Ralph



jbunnelle -> RE: "What the heck!? It seems identical to ACOW!" (6/15/2006 4:12:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious


quote:

ORIGINAL: jbunnelle

The new graphics make it much easier to ascertain hexsides.


You do know you can toggle hexsides on and off- both in TOAW III and in COW?


Yeah, I know, I always leave them turned on. But before, the old graphics would intrude a bit into other hexes in an attempt to make it smoother and more organic. It definitely looked good but sometimes became confusing on certain types of maps.



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