How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (Full Version)

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KG Erwin -> How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 12:22:55 AM)

When I first bought the game, this was the most difficult concept for me to get a handle on. Some of the more veteran players have helped in explaining how these interact, but there's "hidden" ratings, too, and an element of randomness which means that a historical season will never repeat itself in exactly the same way.

Apart from reading the manual, and experimenting with the game itself, I really don't know how to properly explain the ratings to a new player.

Amaroq did a nice job in the article he posted in "The Locker", but this only scratches the surface.

Quite frankly, I think a book would be needed to fully explore this sim's intracacies. The only thing I can compare it to is in learning how to play a musical instrument (I'm a musician, BTW) : easy to learn, but difficult to master.

It'd be nice to have all the "old" and present forum articles concerning the interrelationships of ratings collected in one area.

Don't everyone jump forward at the same time to attempt this [:D]. I'm just offering up some food for thought.



PadresFan104 -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 12:50:37 AM)

Yeah, it's all voodo booga as far as I am concerned.  In order to get around it, I'd like an in-game utilty that allows you to enter a players real stats (or projected stats) including everything that's included in the Lahman DB.  Then you just press a button and the game "imports" the player, applying the necessary calculations that end up being reflected in the players ratings.



KG Erwin -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 1:06:48 AM)

Al, that surprises me.  You're looking for a "sure thing" in this sim?   Real life doesn't offer any guarantees.  It may turn out different than you expected, and that's how it usually happens. 

Yeah, man, there's some "voodoo booga" always present, and you can't control it, no matter how carefully you plot your course.   I think you're close to my age, so you know how it works. [X(]



PadresFan104 -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 3:19:26 AM)

I kinda misunderstood your original post.  I thought you were talking about how ratings were derived in the game for imported players.

Recently, I posted the 2006 Association file.  To do this, I had to create some rookies.  When creating new players in PureSim, you are asked for their "ratings" (including potential) and not their stats.  How am I supposed to apply ratings to a player I know little about?  Even if I did know something about them, there's no way to know if the ratings I assign will lead to an appropriate possibility of outcomes for the players career.

I am proposing that instead of having us assign ratings to a new player, let us enter the info we do know (or at least could estimate).  Things that are tracked in the Lahman DB like batting average, HRs, SB's etc.  Then, when you click the create button, PureSim does the work of translating these tangible stats into ratings.

Make sense?



KG Erwin -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 3:32:31 AM)

Al, I DID mean that, but I get what you're saying, too.  Yes.   Having the engine automatically generate ratings based on player input could allow for each new season to be recreated without the need for a Lahman update.  Yes -- that would be great.  

Now, going back to importing historical players -- I've tried both historical rosters and draft rosters, and set up templates for both. I think what you're saying is, each time I import Jackie Robinson from 1947 his ratings should always be the same.

Is that what you're saying?

I disagree, but it depends on the scale you use -- I kinda like the 1-100 scale. However, each time one imports the 1947 players, the ratings differ each time. I DO like this aspect -- Pure Sim isn't like the movie "Groundhog Day". Each time you repeat a given season, the ratings change.

However, ALL players for a given season are rated relevant to each other, NOT some universal constant. That's the thing that's throws many players off. This is where it starts getting deep.

If one throws together a league of all-time geat players, the ratings will start getting really skewed.

I frankly don't think the game was meant for that. The original intent, in using all fictional players, was an exercise in judging talent and tailoring teams to your style of play.

That still holds true, BUT, with the import of the Lahman database these criteria could be applied to actual players. This is how the big picture really got confused.

In one 1946 draft, Red Schoendienst might get a speed rating of 85. In another, it might be 76. He's still a good runner, but a random element is applied to determine how good he was in that particular year against every other runner in the league. The tendency is still there, but his exact stats are based on the given number for that year.

This model WILL smetimes give ahistorical numbers for individual players, but overall team BAs and ERAs will retain a close resemblance to history.



PadresFan104 -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 5:20:14 AM)

Don't fret, that's not what I was saying. As a matter of fact, I used the phrase "appropriate possibility of outcomes for the players career." Here's what I envision. When importing a player, or when entering a player with the stat model I want, Puresim will assign generally the same ratings +/- some percentage every time. HOWEVER, the hidden ratings that turn studs into duds and vice versa would still be at work in the background.



motnahp -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (6/28/2006 12:06:14 PM)

Being able to enter actual stats when creating a player or pitcher would be ideal, and a great addition for a future release.



renojedi -> RE: How to Explain the Ratings System's Subtleties? (7/1/2006 7:01:42 AM)

I agree totally that how ratings are determined needs to be better explained. I am creating the 2006 season slowly by making the roster of my current opponent match the real life MLB roster. I have found there are a lot of rookies in the league and I am not sure how to rate them. Some guys are doing really well but I hesitate to rate them over a 35 or so because I would hate for them to improve to 80s or so after a couple of years.

I too wish there was a way to simply input stats and based on that have the stats be automatically produced with probaly some common sense still being required to lower guys who had one monster season. Better yet, I wish I knew the process by which rookies in the game (who have real stats from a 2004 SEP call up) are rated.



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