East Ohio River (Full Version)

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Viking67 -> East Ohio River (12/30/2006 10:34:26 PM)

Why does the East Ohio River not have Blue dots, when the Union controls/owns it?



Sonny -> RE: East Ohio River (12/30/2006 10:41:36 PM)

I've been wondering that myself. Guess it is just a graphics thing.



General Lee -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 12:16:33 AM)

I don't know for sure either, but I noticed that as I made my offensive into ohio from W. Virginia, that was he first city I took, and when i gained control of it, i was able to build in it, even though I hadn't taken columbus yet. my memory is fuzzy though, perhaps someone can try it? see what happens.



Twotribes -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 12:20:05 AM)

Wheeling is IN West Virginia, which means Virginia in the game. The Union should not be able to build in it if I read the rules right, BUT I already posted that in fact the Union can build there, all you need to do is go to the city screen, it allows it there but not on the map screen.



Hard Sarge -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 5:26:32 AM)

you can build in a City you take from the enemy, you can not build troops from a City you take, unless you control the state





Hard Sarge -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 5:27:12 AM)

which at times, there may be a delay in getting the report that the city has been captured



Twotribes -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 9:02:53 AM)

I can not muster or conscript BUT I can buy troops in Wheeling, is that correct?



Hard Sarge -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 11:59:32 AM)

no, you should not be able to buy troops in a City that is owned by the other side (the other side still have the cap for that state)

(Ie if you own Columbus Ohio and then take Cinci, you could build troops in Cinci, but if you did it the other way around, you would not be able to)

you shouldn't be allowed to open the screen, to select a unit to build





chris0827 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 12:59:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

no, you should not be able to buy troops in a City that is owned by the other side (the other side still have the cap for that state)

(Ie if you own Columbus Ohio and then take Cinci, you could build troops in Cinci, but if you did it the other way around, you would not be able to)

you shouldn't be allowed to open the screen, to select a unit to build





You can't raise troops in West Virginia until you capture Richmond? That makes no sense.



Twinkle -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 1:17:02 PM)


quote:

You can't raise troops in West Virginia until you capture Richmond? That makes no sense.

It makes perfect sense that you have to hold the state capital before you can find men who support your “the enemy” cause. Very few regiments were recruited for the Union in the southern states... e.g. 1 independent infantry company in Virginia, 2 companies in Georgia, 2 infantry regiment in Florida, and so on... The only recruiting that would result in a whole game brigade was done in North Carolina and Louisiana, but it was really more like men leaving their states for the Union.

Fact is that it makes little sense to allow recruiting in enemy states, and if this is allowed in the game (I never tried this as I only play pbem) PLEASE remove it now...




chris0827 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 1:23:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Twinkle


quote:

You can't raise troops in West Virginia until you capture Richmond? That makes no sense.

It makes perfect sense that you have to hold the state capital before you can find men who support your “the enemy” cause. Very few regiments were recruited for the Union in the southern states... e.g. 1 independent infantry company in Virginia, 2 companies in Georgia, 2 infantry regiment in Florida, and so on... The only recruiting that would result in a whole game brigade was done in North Carolina and Louisiana, but it was really more like men leaving their states for the Union.

Fact is that it makes little sense to allow recruiting in enemy states, and if this is allowed in the game (I never tried this as I only play pbem) PLEASE remove it now...




West Virginia wasn't an enemy state. They formed a government in June 1861 and officially became a state in june 1863. At least 25,000 West Virginians fought in the Union army.



Twinkle -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 1:58:15 PM)

Do we have West Virginia as a Union state in the game? My games are just now going into 1863...
 
West Virgina... 32068 men, forming 7 cav regiments, 2 cav companies, 8 art batteries, 17 inf regiments, 2 inf companies



christof139 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 4:16:03 PM)

Texas had 2 Union Cav. regiments under Gov. Jeff Davis, but I think they were later consolidated into 1 regiment, and one was very understrength. There were quite a few Arkansas and Tennessee Regiments and other units formed for the Union. The only State that didn't form a white unit for the Union was South Carolina, but there was plenty of Union activity in the western mountains of SC. There was one county in Mississippi where Confed. recruiters and conscriptors were afraid to go, and several Texas counties were pro Union, and those had high German immigrant populations.

Versions of the game exist with WV as Union or Confed at the start. I prefer Union, maybe not, I don't know. How does this affect play??

Chris



christof139 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 4:19:57 PM)

Union and Confederacy both should maybe be allowed to raise troops in WV and both without owning the State capital and both simultaneously in any province they fully control, and that would solve the problem and be historical.

Make a special rule/set-up for WV.

Chris



Twotribes -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 5:25:14 PM)

The Union CAN raise troops in Wheeling. I have done it more than once in my game.

What is confusing is it will also allow you to click the muster and or conscript buttons BUT when the turn runs it tells you your not allowed that action because you dont control the State. This only happens in the city screen, if you click on the function in the map screen it tells you you cant do it.



General Quarters -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 6:03:29 PM)


quote:

It makes perfect sense that you have to hold the state capital before you can find men who support your “the enemy” cause. Very few regiments were recruited for the Union in the southern states... e.g. 1 independent infantry company in Virginia, 2 companies in Georgia, 2 infantry regiment in Florida, and so on... The only recruiting that would result in a whole game brigade was done in North Carolina and Louisiana, but it was really more like men leaving their states for the Union.


ACW board games often gave you a free militia unit in the state capital the first time the enemy entered a particular state. I always liked that. It was helpful to the sometimes surprised defender and it seemed historically realistic and people would rally around the home state flag.

It would also add flavor and perhaps historical accuracy if the Union got a west virginia unit once it conquered east ohio or another province or two. West Virginia experts would have to say what should be controlled that would simulate the new state of W.V.



chris0827 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/1/2007 6:06:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: General Quarters


quote:

It makes perfect sense that you have to hold the state capital before you can find men who support your “the enemy” cause. Very few regiments were recruited for the Union in the southern states... e.g. 1 independent infantry company in Virginia, 2 companies in Georgia, 2 infantry regiment in Florida, and so on... The only recruiting that would result in a whole game brigade was done in North Carolina and Louisiana, but it was really more like men leaving their states for the Union.


ACW board games often gave you a free militia unit in the state capital the first time the enemy entered a particular state. I always liked that. It was helpful to the sometimes surprised defender and it seemed historically realistic and people would rally around the home state flag.

It would also add flavor and perhaps historical accuracy if the Union got a west virginia unit once it conquered east ohio or another province or two. West Virginia experts would have to say what should be controlled that would simulate the new state of W.V.



The confederacy never had much control over what became West Virginia. Most of it was in Union hands by the end of june 1861.



Viking67 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/2/2007 3:16:35 PM)

Gil,

What is the story with the "East Ohio River"?



christof139 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/2/2007 8:33:57 PM)

Confeds raised only 3, 4, or 5 Inf. regiments etc. from the West Virginia area. There is a nice website about this. And there were also some Confed guerillas.

KENAWHA should = KANAWHA, no ifs, ands and doubts about it. It is also pronounced Can-aw by those that live in the area, per my pople that still live in West Virginie. Yes, they speak with a pronounced drawl, and that drawl starts just south of Toledo, Ohio ya'll or yawl or y'all. No biggie but a mystery to me as the official name of both the division in Biurnside's IX Corps and the river is spelt Kanawha.

Now on to Bridget Bardot etc. and the Can-can.

Goodnight again, Chris [>:]



regularbird -> RE: East Ohio River (1/2/2007 9:36:20 PM)

I currently live in the Kanawha Valley and I assure you it is pronounced KA-NA-WHA.

I guess in some of the hollows it may be pronounced Kan-aw, or if spoken quickly.



Marc gto -> RE: East Ohio River (1/2/2007 11:14:35 PM)

thats funny regular bird...:) having lived there myself for a short time im sure its pronounced kan-aw in most hollers :)



Gray_Lensman -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 2:42:32 AM)

Kanawha Valley pronunciation conflict above reminds me of Missouri pronunciation conflict. Here we have residents who say it's Missour"i", and other residents who say it's Missour"ah"... Rather amusing, since the Indians probably had there own inflection, which would be the real "correct" pronunciation.



elmo3 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 3:45:56 AM)

I kanawah see what the big deal is...



General Quarters -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 5:00:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: elmo3

I kanawah see what the big deal is...


Clever



christof139 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 7:29:42 AM)

quote:

I currently live in the Kanawha Valley and I assure you it is pronounced KA-NA-WHA.

I guess in some of the hollows it may be pronounced Kan-aw, or if spoken quickly.

< Message edited by regularbird -- 1/2/2007 3:05:44 PM >


Hi,

I could indeed have misheard it, but my people live in do not live in the hollows, and it did sound more of a 'Can-aw', but I may have missed a soft 'ah', very probable I did.

I say it Can-ah-wha, but my cousin corrected me with a different pronunciation.

So, there are local dialects as you point out, and that could very well be the case. Very interesting.

NY City had 5 official dialects according to linguists, one for each burrough, and all just slightly differnet thus them dialects.

Where do you live in WV?? That is such a beautiful State. Our people originally worked in the coal mines of PA and the WV. Times are tough there and elsewhere in the old Rustbelt now. We have 15% unemployment in Detroit including Police Officers and Teachers.

Thanx for the info., Chris



christof139 -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 7:38:40 AM)

Hi again,

"thats funny regular bird...:) having lived there myself for a short time im sure its pronounced kan-aw in most hollers :) "

That's what I thought my cousin said. now I am confused a bit more. Ha ha ha!!! it may be a local dialect thing. [8|]

Chris

PS: Many people here in Detroit have a very, very, very slight drawl, mostly and nearly unoticeable, but some people catch it every now and then, especially if they are foreigners. many Canadians speak in the Canadian-English dialect, I have visited there frequnetly.




regularbird -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 4:05:28 PM)

Hey Chris I live in a suberb town of Charleston called Saint Albans sometimes reffered to as Snalbans. It is a great place to live, here in the Valley unemployment is not to bad and cost of living is quite reasonable. I agree it is a beautiful state especially if you know where to look. I guess the more I think about it to the untrained ear it would sound like can-aw but if you listen closely most people drag the ah part along which is hardly audible. Wher did you live when you were here?



bountyhunter -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 7:18:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: chris0827

West Virginia wasn't an enemy state. They formed a government in June 1861 and officially became a state in june 1863. At least 25,000 West Virginians fought in the Union army.




Techinically it never was a state - it was formed unconstitutionally... you can't form a state from the territiory of the other... Lincoln, who declared that the states could'nt and didn't actually secede, rushed the vote through the two "state" governments. I guess the same argument should go for Maryland (in reverse) since they were kept in the Union by force.



Twotribes -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 7:42:52 PM)

Yes, it was unconstitutional to form West Virginia As it was, BUT you can form a State from another, with the permission of the Government of the losing State. As to maryland it was not "Constitutional" to secede but more to the point, as I recall the State voted and voted to remain IN the Union.

As to West Virginia, it IS a State, it doesnt magically vanish cause it was made the way it was. Can someone do a search? I wonder if the reconstruction Government of Virginia accepted formally the creation of West Virginia. Failing that I guess an enterprising Virginia could sue to have West Virginia returned to Virginia. )




regularbird -> RE: East Ohio River (1/3/2007 8:18:36 PM)

The federal court, forget the date, ruled that WV owed Virginia x amount million dollars. I think it took until 1924 to pay it off.



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