Might as well get this off my chest. (Full Version)

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Canuck_jp -> Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 10:00:44 AM)

Looks like there are lots of people picking up CC3 and I'm happy it's making a comeback but I have to say I'm a little shocked by the price. When I first heard the announcement for CC3 I was excited. Then I saw the screenshots and lost interest. Then I saw the CC3 preview and got excited again. Sure the graphics are terrible I thought, but there have been a couple of important additions to the game, not to mention a game supported multiplayer lobby that should ensure lots of people to play against! And it's a ten year old game so it'll probably be a lot less than MG's standard $50 prices. Maybe I'll be able to pick it up for 25 bucks, I thought.
So you can imagine my shock when I found out that the game costs $40 smackers. $40 for a brand new game makes me pause and think. $40 for an expansion is a complete non-starter. And CC3 doesn't even qualify as an expansion in my opinion. It's basically a 10 year old game with a few extras.

Yesterday I was totally ready to break out the credit card and pick this up. I still might buy it sometime. But right now if I'm going to pay $40 for a game then I'll be picking up Battlefront and AACW first and then I'll consider picking up CC3.
Not trying to be too negative here. I know the CC series is fantastic and I hope it does extremely well because I'd like to get CC5 with all the extras if it is re-released again. I suppose I'm just a little surprised/disappointed.



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 10:54:31 AM)

I don't know how you Americans faired years back with PC games (seems to me you always get things cheaper, whether they are made, boxed and shipped over there or over here, but when I first got into the PC game scene in 1993 (late starter), games were between £34.99 and £39.99 - that, in current exchange rates, is $70-$80.

Generally, prices of games seem to have reduced. Most new titles I can get from Play.com for half the price (GTR2 - £17.99 - EUIII - £17.99). I take your point about the game and the price tag...but $40 (£20) to support a company which will not be taking your money and running, isn't a bad investment.

I personally won't be buying this one because I didn't like the 3rd installment (loved the first one and blown away by the second one), but I just wanted to pipe up about the price issue.

This has been said loads of times before...by more educated men than myself...but it is absolutely true...Matrix provides a niche market with niche products. Some new, some old...others rehashed. But it's up to the individual to put a price on the future of gaming.

There is a limit to what people will pay, for new games and reworked games, and I guess you've found your limit. If this had been CC2, I'd be downloading right now.



Canuck_jp -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 11:14:31 AM)

I'm not complaining about the price per se-I just said that I will be purchasing Battlefront when it's out on CD and that will cost $10 more.  I'm complaining about the fact that it's the same game with (admittedly) some nice add-ons.

And my nick is Canuck-what country do you think I hail from? [:)]



jukofyork -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 1:52:56 PM)

Yep, I have to agree with JudgeDredd that the price seems pretty good compaired to what us brits pay normally.

BUT: I personally would have paid perhaps up to 400USD (£200) for a chance to play CC again (and thats coming from a guy who can't remeber that last time they actaully bought a game!). Even if CC:COI was the biggest pile of crap ever made (which it certainly isn't), then I'd still pay the £200 just for the chance that the developers would make CC6! [:)]

Of all games, from all time, then CC is BY FAR my favorite and the fact that it's been re-released after all these years is like a dream come true!

Thanks to all who made it happen!

Juk :)



Kung Karl -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 2:52:28 PM)

Us Europeans also have to pay VAT so the price for us is 47$ wich is very expensive for Close combat 3.

The bad thing about matrix store is the VAT. In europe a new game cost 40€ or less and that is INCLUDING VAT. When I buy a game from Matrix I pay 40€ + VAT. So, compared to a retail store matrix games are 17.5% more expensive. In a retail box I get a maual and box. If I want that from Matrix I will have to pay an additional 10€. In effect, to get the same thing from matrix as I would have from a retail store I will have to pay 17€ more when buying from Matrix games.

Matrix games is very expensive for us europeans compared to retail stores. It is as simle as that. 



Beeblebrox -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 2:56:45 PM)

I respect your opinions.  It's hard to please everyone itsn't it?



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 4:16:34 PM)

quote:

ORGINAL: JudgeDredd
I don't know how you Americans faired years back with PC games...


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canuck35
And my nick is Canuck-what country do you think I hail from? [:)]


My apologies. I do understand that being referred to as an American when you are Canadian is in fact almost as annoying as myself being referred to as English when I am, in fact, Scottish.

I of all people should know this...so I apologise. I didn't take the time to see where you were from. I just took the fact that you were talking about $ and not mentioning Canadian $ made me automatically assume you were American.



SlapBone -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 6:13:13 PM)

quote:

I do understand that being referred to as an American when you are Canadian is in fact almost as annoying as myself being referred to as English when I am, in fact, Scottish.

I of all people should know this...so I apologise. I didn't take the time to see where you were from. I just took the fact that you were talking about $ and not mentioning Canadian $ made me automatically assume you were American.


Actually if you put the Queen on your money, you're English...both of you [;)]



general billy -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 7:28:59 PM)

Juadgedread,

What didnt u like about Close combat 3? Close combat 2/3 was my favorite out of all the series. What was so good about 1?



Marc von Martial -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 8:10:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kung Karl

Us Europeans also have to pay VAT so the price for us is 47$ wich is very expensive for Close combat 3.

The bad thing about matrix store is the VAT. In europe a new game cost 40€ or less and that is INCLUDING VAT. When I buy a game from Matrix I pay 40€ + VAT. So, compared to a retail store matrix games are 17.5% more expensive. In a retail box I get a maual and box. If I want that from Matrix I will have to pay an additional 10€. In effect, to get the same thing from matrix as I would have from a retail store I will have to pay 17€ more when buying from Matrix games.

Matrix games is very expensive for us europeans compared to retail stores. It is as simle as that.



Well excuse me but games prices vary from 39€ (cheap) to 69€ (expensive) in "Europe", including VAT of course. Less then 39€ you will have to be pretty lucky to get a new game for, unless it is used.



Hertston -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 8:36:21 PM)

I think pricing must have been particularly tricky on this one. Factors to be considered;

1. Most buyers will have owned at least one CC title, and many CC3. The latter have already paid for the game, so additional cash is for updates.

2. The original game is (almost) ten years old.

3. It's well worth more than 'budget' pricing for those who don't have CC3, at least.

4. Matrix and everybody else concerned need to make enough profit to make it worth doing.

5. Although an old game, try buying CC3 elsewhere. Didn't someone see it on e-bay for $150, or something ridiculous?

I think they got it about right, overall.



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 8:51:32 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SlapBone

quote:

I do understand that being referred to as an American when you are Canadian is in fact almost as annoying as myself being referred to as English when I am, in fact, Scottish.

I of all people should know this...so I apologise. I didn't take the time to see where you were from. I just took the fact that you were talking about $ and not mentioning Canadian $ made me automatically assume you were American.


Actually if you put the Queen on your money, you're English...both of you [;)]


I won't even justify this....you...you Mexican![;)]



Erik Rutins -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 8:54:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd
I won't even justify this....you...you Mexican![;)]


ROFL!



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 8:57:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: general billy

Juadgedread,

What didnt u like about Close combat 3? Close combat 2/3 was my favorite out of all the series. What was so good about 1?


One was so good because, iirc, it was the first of it's kind. If it wasn't, then it was the first of it's kind I had. I'm sure if I revisited it, the 1st one wouldn't be all that...

2nd was my love. Played it constantly. I loved moving my piats through the buildins, covering with arcs of fire from my MGs and then dropping a pathetic little PIAT charge on a Panther and seeing it go up. I loved it.

I don't know why I didn't like the 3rd one. Perhaps it was my, and maybe still is, my lack of interest in the eastern front (and I don't know why I have a lack of interest in that front, but I am more likely to buy a book on the Western Front than I am the Eastern Front...and yet the greatest war book I ever read was Stalingrad!! Go figure).

But I'm not overly interested in the episode...so I'll wait until I see what else comes along...but then...you never know [;)]



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 9:17:01 PM)

You know...after posting here, I went to have a look at the screenies and the strangest thing...one of the battles I loved is used in the first 3 screen shots in the shop page! Brought back some fond memories of the series....

I was put off 4 and 5 by reviews and my apparent dislike for the 3rd episode (but maybe I'm calling it wrong, after seeing those screen shots)...so I never followed the series up.

Maybe I will buy it...maybe



Reiryc -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 9:30:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: general billy

Juadgedread,

What didnt u like about Close combat 3? Close combat 2/3 was my favorite out of all the series. What was so good about 1?


I think 1 was the best of the series because it modeled morale the best imo. Leaders were very important and when they went down, the squad would become much more fragile morale-wise.

I also liked that winning didn't just have to occur with taking territory/vls but rather one could and often did win through morale. I think this is more reflective of combat situations that I read about than the 'to the last man' type combat that occurred in later versions.



Zap -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 9:30:36 PM)

good to see you around JudgeDredd



Kung Karl -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/13/2007 10:12:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kung Karl

Us Europeans also have to pay VAT so the price for us is 47$ wich is very expensive for Close combat 3.

The bad thing about matrix store is the VAT. In europe a new game cost 40€ or less and that is INCLUDING VAT. When I buy a game from Matrix I pay 40€ + VAT. So, compared to a retail store matrix games are 17.5% more expensive. In a retail box I get a maual and box. If I want that from Matrix I will have to pay an additional 10€. In effect, to get the same thing from matrix as I would have from a retail store I will have to pay 17€ more when buying from Matrix games.

Matrix games is very expensive for us europeans compared to retail stores. It is as simle as that.



Well excuse me but games prices vary from 39€ (cheap) to 69€ (expensive) in "Europe", including VAT of course. Less then 39€ you will have to be pretty lucky to get a new game for, unless it is used.


I have PM you with a link to a store wich sells new games for under 30€ even and that is including shipping, no extre fees at all.



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 12:04:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap

good to see you around JudgeDredd

Hey Zap.

Well...I thought my self imposed exile was cutting the nose to spite the face...I've been about and reading...couldn't help but jump in again!

Such is the power of conversation, be it digital or verbal!



Cossack_13 -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 12:39:06 AM)

I'm so glad to have this title updated for play that the $40 price tag was no big deal to me.

Of course, I don't buy a lot of games. I have a collection of my favorites that I play until I lose interest and then I start looking for another. Not the way most gamers to it, for sure.



Titanwarrior89 -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 1:27:47 AM)

I myself had no problem with the price. I want the Gang at Matrix to stay in business. I don't think they are making a killing off the price of the game.


Besides they are "Gamers for Gamers, and you can't beat that in my book.[:D]



Boar -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 4:36:09 AM)

To me this is not just the same game reloaded, it's an extra-value, feature-packed game with the added (very valuable) bonus of a reworking of the AI,
the whole range of values, from armor to cover, and all of it done by some of the very folks who've provided mods and insight over all these years
to keeping this game in circulation. I just installed and played a bit of an operation. Worked like a charm and battles against the AI feel quite different. I'm sure it
will be fun to play with live opponents, and connectivity is improved and even built into the game "HQ" so that opponents can be readily found.

Excellent job, and well worth the $40 in my humble opinion. To compare another recent game (don't throw rocks, please), I bought "Titan Quest" and had lots of
fun with the pretty scenery and objects and after one campaign put it down and haven't picked it back up. That was a disposable $50 or so. I'm sure I'll be coming back
time and again to play COI.



FeurerKrieg -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 7:48:34 AM)

No problem on price for me. Easy to say these days, but 15 years ago I would have been complaining since I didn't have $40 to spend on a game.

If I'm driving a nice car, got two Ipods, and cable internet - I think I can spring a $40 one-time-cost for a game to help encourage the the Matrix/CSO guys to doa rework of CC2 and beyond.

Just like I'd pay $100 to pre-order a copy of WITP 2, if it meant the game would actually be created.



Marc von Martial -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 9:34:25 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kung Karl


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kung Karl

......

Matrix games is very expensive for us europeans compared to retail stores. It is as simle as that.


Well excuse me but games prices vary from 39€ (cheap) to 69€ (expensive) in "Europe", including VAT of course. Less then 39€ you will have to be pretty lucky to get a new game for, unless it is used.


I have PM you with a link to a store wich sells new games for under 30€ even and that is including shipping, no extre fees at all.




Of course you can always dig up online shops that run specials for games, my fav games shop here in my town does that also. However, this (and also on the site you PMed) are not the suggested retail prices by the publishers. That is all what counts when you want to compare prices. You can hardly use a "bargain price" for comparison.

With specials there is hardly any money the developers or publisher make from the sale. And it might surprise people, we guys have to pay bills too. Think of your employer coming to you and tell you that next month will be feature an "employee special price". All employees will work for 50% of their regular income.

If certain retail outlets drop prices, then they have a plan. The either want clearance of the product or they gather for cross sales, or want to drag in new customers. If I look at the prices on the website you PMed then I see several games / products I can get elsewhere cheaper [;)]

With your example, please take the time to compare the special price on EUIII they have and compare the suggested retail price at the Paradox webshop.

On top of this, we offer niche market games. So we hardly make money with massive sales, like mainstream titles would do. This needs to be considered too when you compare prices. Check the price for a GMT board wargame and compare it to what a copy of Monopoly costs [;)]



Kung Karl -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 6:31:51 PM)

I wont argue your logic that recomended retailprices are higher than what games actually sells for in stores.

But, as far as EU3 goes, if I buy the game at recommended price I will pay 40€ and for that I will get a box and manual. That includes all taxes. From matrix I would have had to pay 40€ plus VAT wich make it a 17% more expensive. And that is often a digital download too so I will have to add an extra 10€ to get the box.

I do not say that Matrix does anything wrong with their prices. But it is a simple fact that the store is very expensive, for us europeans at least, compared to retail or other online stores.



jbunnelle -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 8:27:57 PM)

I used to love this game and am currently downloading the new version. I have no problem paying the $39 to support Matrix, although I'd make it more if this were East Front. [:D] But oh well....



JudgeDredd -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 9:07:44 PM)

It is East front, isn't it? [&:]



Marc von Martial -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 9:14:50 PM)

Yes, East Front



Beeblebrox -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/14/2007 10:15:42 PM)

quote:

although I'd make it more if this were East Front. [:D]
Perhaps you may want to modify this statement in hindsight? On the other hand, here are my Swiss Bank Account details... [8D]



Corporal_Remains -> RE: Might as well get this off my chest. (2/15/2007 1:03:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Beeblebrox

quote:

although I'd make it more if this were East Front. [:D]
Perhaps you may want to modify this statement in hindsight? On the other hand, here are my Swiss Bank Account details... [8D]


Might mean Talonsoft East Front?

...also on the Matrix redo list.



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