Mods ? which to choose ? (Full Version)

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Rob Brennan UK -> Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 5:43:41 PM)

OK flogging a dead horse here i know , sorry ..[:(]

Aztez and myself are going to start a new PBEM and i've decided to grow a backbone and play the evil
japanese empire .. cue star wars music [:D]

Stock we are both familiar with BUT it has some serious flaws regarding japanese radar and US
naval pilot pools etc.

As we are planning on this game going to the bitter end i dont want to have to nurse a broken
engine in 44/5 , so the question is .. which mods 'fix' some of the more glaring data base errors
but arent too off the wall (nemos mod fun but not realisitic enough) or really historically
restricting.

CHS is a option but i'm completely unfamiliar with it , and japan turn one with an unfamiliar map
brings on nightmares [;)].

What i'd like is

AB's excellent map (if possible) (with stock units and setup)
Fixed DB issues
better a2a (not massively important as we have house rules on CV's/hex. ) is there a RHS mod the only adresses the air model but not the additional japanse ships etc.

Lemurs mod looks interesting , but is it compatible with later patches ?, README is back in
1.4 days , before the ASW fix.

BigB's mod i cant find at spookys .. is there a readme for that one as i seem to recall BigB did
a really good job on it [&o]

Nik , i did try version 5 but hated the flak to be honest. whats the lowdown on version 9 ?
( i know about the industry stuff, its the flak and a2a that interests me).

So in a nutshell i want the ability to get a cake and eat it too .. also world peace and the
end to religious fanaticism .. and be the 1st man on mars just to top it all off [:D]

thanks guys and apologies for starting yet another mod thread .. stupid search engine is to blame [;)]




Sardaukar -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 6:03:44 PM)

BigB's mod is very good if not wanting to fiddle too much with map (he does have a version for AB's map too). Both stock and AB map versions can be found on Andrew Brown's web site.

EDIT: They are on Spooky's site. Click on Files & Scenarios and scroll down.

"Big B Scenario

*
Scen 190 B Mod ver1.31 (scen 15 for Stock Map)
*
Scen 190 art file (scenario start photos)

*
Scen 191 B Mod ver1.31(scen 16 for Stock Map)
*
Scen 191 art file (scenario start photos)

*
Scen 192 B Mod ver1.31 (scen 15 for Andrew Brown's Extended Map)
*
Scen 192 art file (scenario start photos)

*
Scen 193 B Mod ver1.31 (scen 16 for Andrew Brown's Extended Map)
*
Scen 193 art file (scenario start photos)"

I did find that his A2A model is very good. Readme-file is included in all scenarios, listing the changes.




castor troy -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 6:15:44 PM)

Here´s the readme of BigB mod, latest version. Hope I´m allowed to post it! [:D]

Design Notes version 1.3

For those new to any of the four scenario variants of this mod, no
graphics are required - just download the scenario of choice and it will
play as any other stock 'War in the Pacific' scenario (except for the
Andrew Brown - Extended Map scenarios - which require the map installation).

Version 1.3 is basically a more "matured" version with a lot of detail
cleanup.

The major changes in Ver.1.3 are as follows;

Aircraft:
----------
All aircraft MG/Cannon armament has been reduced to either range 2 or 3
(in game terms this a maximum range of 1000 or 1500 yards respectively).
The criteria for determining range were caliber and Muzzle Velocity.

All elite squadrons starting over 55 experience have been proportionately
brought down to less than 80 experience (i.e. in the 70 range) - with the
exception of the KB squadrons of Akagi, Kaga, Hiryu, and Soryu, each of
which will start at 80 experience.
The Historical Pilot file has not been touched, and all pilots remain with
their units.

The Japanese and (some)Allied trained pilot replacements pools have been
increased.

The KI-43 1b Oscar has been given the 'Zero Bonus'.
[NOTE: The Japanese player should NEVER - EVER take advantage of this
and operate Oscars from CVs ...NEVER.]

Further aircraft changes include:
P-26's are gone at PH (using P-36’s a by that time).
The P-400 has been re-introduced and given back to the 347th FG (the
only unit to start with that aircraft). (the P-400 was done away with
in Ver.1.2)

The P-40B has been re-introduced, and is used by units of the 18th FG
in Hawaii and the 3rd FS in the Philippines. The other AT START P-40
units are equipped with either the P-40C or P-40E-1-CU (the major
P-40E production variant).

The Hurricane IIb has been added, for the Hurricane squadrons arriving
before 6/42,

The Spitfire Vb is not available until Sep 42 (when the first group in
the Far East equipped with them at Darwin).

The F6F, P-47D, and P-51D types have had their monthly production
increased to match the numbers available in the period in which they
operated. The P-51D is no longer available before 12/44.

The following Allied aircraft types are now on map production and will
auto-upgrade to the next model (ceasing production of obsolete types):
B-17, B-24, B-25, P-40, P-38, P47, P-51, F4F, & F6F.
Production capability in the United States has been increased to enable
this.


The F1M2 Pete has been reclassified as a Float Fighter (it appears it's
historical role was more of a point defense and gunnery observation
aircraft than a true recon).
The KI-43 II has had it's protection upgraded to armor level 1 (due to
An armored seat and rudimentary self sealing tanks being introduced in
production), also the aircraft can carry one 500lb bomb.
(both sources - Francillion)

The A5m Claude, KI-27 Nate, I-16(& I-16c), and I-153(& I-53c) have had
Their maneuverability increased.

USA/California:
-----------------
Several bases have been added, Sacramento (from CHS), Muroc Field (now
Edwards AFB), Camp Roberts (major training center Inf/Arty), and Fort
Ord (major training center and home of the 7th Div).

China:
---------
Chinese unit positions At Start – have been readjusted to be accurate.
Wenchow starts in Chinese hands, as well as Pucheng and Kanhsien being
added to the map, in Chinese hands. An appropriate redeployment of
some Chinese units has been made.
China Air Task Force (Air HQ) under Gen C. Chennault in Kunming has
been added to the Chinese OOB, along with an AVG Photo Recon Section
(4 a/c) under Erik Schilling.
This gives China one Air HQ and one Recon unit.

Philippines:
------------
A reorganization of the units and bases of the Philippines has been
extensive, and is partially based on CHS and RHS research, partially
on other (historical) sources - a good source may be found here:
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/PTO/RisingSun/index.html

Dutch East Indies:
-----------------
The OOB for the DEI has been gone over(and it turns out that the original
OOB in stock WitP is pretty darn accurate), and a few of changes have
been made - Wulfhorst's Mobile BN has been separated from the 6th KNIL Rgt,
and relocated to Batavia. The KNIL Marine BN has been added at Soerabaja,
the Bali Defense BN has been added, and the four KNIL 'regular' regiments
start at a higher state of readiness.

India:
---------
Nine Indian Army District Brigades have been added; Pashwar,
Rawalpindi, Lahore, Meerut (Delhi), Lucknow, Assam, Dacca, Madras, and
Bombay. These units correspond to Indian Army Military Districts in
India. These units are “Home Guard” - and should stay IN India.

Japanese Empire:
----------------
The Manchurian National Army, and Indian National Army units have been
added to the Japanese OOB (courtesy of CHS and RHS.)


Motor Torpedo Boat Squadron 3 (Philippine Islands):
------------------------------
The historical commanders of each PT Boat (31,32,33,34,35, & 41) have
been put into their proper boats (for historical interest only).




______________________________________________________________________________





------------------------------------------------------------------------
Design Notes version 1.2

The following changes have been made:

(1) Chinese supply levels have been increased to maintain the stock game
supply ratio between the size of the army and monthly supply:

NEW SUPPLY MODEL

Location Heavy Industry Resources Daily Supply

Yenen 180 180 132
Paotow
Hengchow 50
Pakhoi 120
Changsha 180 600 364
Sian 60 60 332
Homan
Kweichow
Kunming 30 300 544
Wuchow 5 300 307
Tsuyung
Nanning 150
Kweilin 180
Kweiyang 132
Chunking 360 300 1595
Chengtu 10 300 770
Sinning 300
Kunchang
Lanchow 180 180 300
Lungchow
Luichow
Hami
Tuyun
________________________________________________
Total 1005 |Total 2220 | Total 5276
Daily Hvy Ind |Daily Resources | Daily supply


Combined Daily Total=8501
Combined Monthly Total (less Burma Road)= 255,030
Combined Old Monthly Total (less Burma Road)= 134,250

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

(2) Air combat has been revised with particular focus on the aircraft of
1943 - 1945. Maneuverability changes have been based on comparative wing
loading at full load (not max load). Also, durability of most Allied
fighters has been raised slightly. Durability has been based on the
Dry Weight of the aircraft.

The reusluts of this are that Japanese planes are more agile than their
Allied counterparts, while Allied Fighters are faster and tougher (higher
durability). These changes have helped tone down the typical late war
lopsided air combat results.

(3) F6F-3 Hellcat and F6F-5 Hellcat have been added. F6F-3 Hellcat will
arrive in Feb 43 (production began in Oct 42, VF9 became the first F6F
equipped squadron in Jan 43). Production will switch to the F6F-5 in Apr 44.
(Note: as no graphics are required for this mod, both models share the
same stock graphic. Anyone who wishes may easily incorporate separate
graphics by supplying the art themselves, and then pointing either Hellcat at
the new graphic slot, using the editor)


(4) B-17, P-38, and F6F are all now "On Map Production" and each aircraft
will auto-upgrade to the newer model at an increased production rate. Obsolete
models will not stay in production through out the war.


(5) Numerous errors have been caught and fixed from the previous release.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
__________________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________________________________

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Version 1.1
Design Notes on the B Mod; alternate scenarios for stock scenarios #15 and
#16.

The purpose of this mod was to give Non-CHS & RHS players an alternative to
stock scenarios 15 and 16 that also do not require any graphics set changes.
The focus is on adding more (hopefully) historical realism, with emphasis
on the following aspects:


(1) Naval Warships –
All warships have had their armor ratings verified and sometimes
changed to what current publications verify (Conway's, etc.). Also, all
ships from DE's to CV's have had their Durability Ratings standardized.
The method I used was to grant 1 Dur for each 200 tons Standard Displacement
(which is the starting point for stock WitP).

[Note: only Standard Displacement was used, as extra tonnage due to a
full fuel load, stores, and added deck houses, adds no structural strength.
Also, the original standard of a sliding scale of durability between ship
sizes has been maintained by giving all DD's and DE's an additional
point, and all vessels over 20,000 tons no real change. No auxiliaries, AK's,
AP's, TK's, or Patrol Craft have had stock durability touched.]

All AK's, AP's, and TK's have had their capacity reduced by approximately
1/3 (as has been done in several other mods) to help slow down the pace
of operations. However, I have rounded the numbers for ease of calculations
by players.



(2) Air Combat –
Air combat in WitP has long been known to be too generally bloody to be
realistic. I have tackled this in the following manner: All Aircraft
guns have had their Accuracy Ratings re-valued. The original method in
stock WitP was to rate accuracy as the square root of the Rate of Fire of
a weapon, divided by 100. The method I have used was to multiply the
square root of ROF with the square root of Muzzle Velocity, and then divide
by 100. This yields a number around half of what the stock game method
generates, it is also unbiased, and reflects the minute differences in the
weapons themselves. (allowance has been made for all Japanese Fighters that
are armed only with two nose mounted machine guns - such as the Oscar and
the Claude. These planes still have double the accuracy of all other aircraft
weapons - so as to keep them useful and competitive).

The net result of these changes is to significantly lower air combat
losses to more realistic levels, without having a ripple affect on other
aspects of combat involving aircraft and land units or ships.



(3) China –
It has long been recognized that the Chinese Army ‘as represented in
WitP’ is less than half of what China possessed. As China was originally
included in WitP to be an area for ‘on map’ training of the Japanese Air
Forces, the actual size of the Chinese forces was not considered to
be a problem. However, since a decisive land war in Asia is a feature most
players wish to have, a more reflective Chinese OOB was necessary.
Through research I have created a much more representative Chinese OOB (which
essentially doubles the size of the KMT Chinese Army). Also added are
semi-independent CCP Guerilla forces, and Chinese Labor Construction units
(16 to 20 units - depending on the map version, and all of which have no
combat strength), as well as Artillery units, as well as more supply
(CHS Daily supply and stock HI and Res). However, these more numerous
Chinese Army units are much reduced in all heavy weapons - as they were
historically.

The main units in the Chinese Army are now divided into the following:
1) Regional Army Corps and Divisions (based on the standard 4000 - 5000 man
Division, these are the various Warlord's troops and the bulk of the army).
2) Central Army Corps and Divisions (based on information stating that the
Central Army used an 8000 man Division - these are Chiang's politically reliable
KMT troops).
3) Provisional Corps and Divisions.
4) CCP Corps, Divisions, and Guerilla Brigades (these last named CCP Guerilla
Brigades are only the size of raider battalions, meant for harassment only).

The stock game Chinese OOB is:

69 Chinese Inf Corps
4 Chinese Cav Corps
1 Chinese Tank Rgt
18 Chinese Inf DIVs
-------------------
Equivalent to 164 Chinese Divisions

My revised Chinese OOB is:

80 Regional and Provisional Army Inf Corps
24 Regional and Provisional Army Inf DIVs
35 Central Army Inf Corps
10 Central Army Inf DIVs
6 CCP Inf Corps
4 Regional Army Cav Corps
3 Central Army Cav Corps
1 Central Army Tank Rgt
16 Central Army Arty Rgt
16 CCP Guerilla Bde
--------------------
Equivalent to 290 Chinese Divisions

China created some 550 divisions during the long war with Japan, but never
had that many divisions in the field at one time. Since no definitive and
exactly detailed Chinese OOB is readily available in English, I felt Going
for approximately half that number is appropriate.

Not included in the revised Chinese OOB are the approximately 2 million
Chinese troops in Japanese service (mainly in Manchuko). However, since
these troops were not used in Field Armies, nor were they well armed or
trusted by the Japanese, hey remain as invisible police units - as are the
extra 1.5 million British Indian troops in India.

This vastly increased China has been counter balanced by the fact that
most of it is static and may not move. Only 20 Chinese Divisions and 30
Chinese Corps start the game mobile. The rest are tied down in static
positions that are immobile – Unless attacked and forced to retreat by
the Japanese. Thus, the Japanese player may ignore the Chinese juggernaut –
so long as he does not activate them himself by attacking them. The idea is
to recreate the quagmire that really existed for Japan in China.
Also Chinese territory has been brought in line with CHS as to the 1941
start lines.



(4) The USSR –
Hand in hand with China, the USSR in stock WitP no longer gets
reinforcements if attacked, nor does it stage units for the Aug 1945 attack.
So - I have added a few reinforcements for the second half of 1943 and I
restored the majority of the large corps that took part in the Manchuria
campaign of 1945 – all of which arrive in June 1945 as in the Manchuria scenario.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I have also made the following changes for Historical Accuracy or Game Play:

All BB main guns have had their Rate-Of-Fire slightly increased (in the Data
Base accuracy rating = ROF for naval guns). The stock ROF is from 12 to 20,
this has been raised to 29. This will increase their participation in surface
actions, but still not have as high a ROF as 8* guns.


500 lb and 250kg bombs, devices 203 and 208 respectively - have both have been
slightly enhanced. PBEM experience has amply demonstrated that both devices are
a bit weak in effect on warships (actually my Japanese opponent first suggested
that the 500lbr was just too weak after his CA Myoko was hit a verified 25 times
in one attack by carrier based SBD's using 500 lb'rs and suffered trifling damage
- not much more system damage than is usual from several weeks peaceful steaming).
The solution I used was to raise the pen value of the 500 lbr from 45 to 51,
and to balance this by raising the effect of the 250 kg from 370 to 400. Now both
devices are a bit more to be feared by the enemy - but still in proper
relationship to each other.


Political Points for both sides have been increased from 50 to 100
points daily, to give more freedom of action for each player. (This can
always be easily re-set in the Scenario Editor).


The B-17 monthly replacement rate has been drastically cut from 75 to 20.
(All groups still come in at ½ strength).


F4U-1 Corsairs are No-Longer Carrier Capable.

F6F Hellcat - The first series production Hellcats at Grumman were completed
in Oct 1942, with production continuing throughout the war. The first
Carrier air group operational with Hellcats was the USS Essex in March 1943.
Therefore, Hellcat avaiability has been moved up to March 1943.


Fighter aircraft have been a bit re-evaluated. I have gone in favor of weighting
maneuverability (that slippery mystical rating) based more on wing loading -
resulting in NO Allied fighter having a maneuverability rating over 34, while
the KI-43I and II have had their maneuverability increased to 37 and 36 respectively.
Allied fighters greatest strengths are more of speed, armament, and durability.


The KI-43III has been added for 1944 as a replacement for the KI 43II.


The KI-61 Tony now comes in two variants, one in 1942 (armed with 4x.50 mg's) and
the other in 1944 (with 2x .50s and 2x 20mm's).


F4F4 Wildcat production will not begin until March 1942.


The P-26, P-35, P-36,and P-40C (no longer P-40B) are all effectively Out Of
Production at start.


P-40E-1-CU is the main American P-40 variant, and production has
increased to 60 units per month.


The AVG have their own unique aircraft (which they did) - the Curtis H81-2A.
This aircraft has a history of it's own, but in game terms - it has a bit higher
speed and climb than the standard P-40, and is available in limited numbers only
to the AVG (it's replacement aircraft is the standard P-40E).


There are Two P-38F units at start in Los Angeles, these should be left
on the USA West Coast until Oct 1942.


The P-400 has been done away with (as only one unit I found is assigned the
P-400, that unit has been re-equipped with the virtually identical P-39D).
The slot freed up (with the altitude penalty) has been used for a unique P-40E
in the game – this aircraft is used ONLY by USAAFFE units at start, and has
no replacements. The intent is to simulate the lack of Oxygen available to
fighter squadrons in the Philippines, and to keep these units from getting
replacement aircraft – since none were ever shipped to the Philippines
after the war started.


British Royal Navy J-class Destroyers:
Two Missing 0.5" quad AA MG mounts have been added to the J class DDs (RS & LS).
Also, because of the never ending demand for British Destroyer withdrawals for
the entire war - the following four J class DDs will arrive in early 1942
with British CVs: Javelin, Jervis, Kelvin, and Kimberley.


A U.S. Naval Infantry battalion has been added as a reinforcement to
Bataan in early 1942 to recreate the unit that existed and was created from
US Navy personnel on Bataan – and which participated in the 'battle of the
points and pockets' during the siege of Bataan.


A Marine Defense Bn detachment and a small USN Base Force have been added
to Guam at scen start (as historically they were there).


U.S.M.C. Divisions have had the total number of Infantry Squads brought
up to 364 Div /121 Rgt., just as a U.S. Army Div does. This has brought the
strength of the division back up to what it should be (19,000 men without
combat attachments) and accurately reflects the 25% greater manpower in the
organic Rifle Companies of a Marine Div (compared to a U.S. Army Division).


Bombay India (in the Stock Map scenarios) or Aden (in the Andrew Brown Extended
Map Scenarios) - has been given the option to expand its ship repair yard to
a maximum level of 100, this is the only Allied yard in the game that may
expand. The reason for this is that British naval units in India do not
have the option in WitP to sail back to the US East coast or Britain for
repairs, and must instead sail to the US West coast instead - this is
actually farther (and more dangerous) than returning to the Atlantic. Also,
Bombay had major ship repair facilities, greater than reflected in the stock game.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Final Notes:

My Original idea was to incorporate the Nik Mod for aircraft changes,
but after securing Nikademus’s permission to do so, it became apparent that
it would be impractical to implement along side the other changes I was
making, because of the ripple effect on so many other systems that I didn't want
to touch. So I proceeded with a combination of some of his ideas and my own methods,
as well as borrowing from CHS and Andrew Brown.

The Stock Map Scenarios are meant for players who use stock map, or Subchaser's
map - that is - players who have not wished to change to CHS map (AB) and graphic set.
The Andrew Brown Extended Map Scenarios are for those who have already installed
this map package - but it is still intended for stock graphic set (Map Mod Option #3).
Personally, I think the Andrew Brown Extended Map Scenarios are the best, not only
for the map - but they also take advantage of Andrew's great work on his scenarios
#125 and #126 which are rich in detail for the South Pacific, New Guinea, DEI,
Australia New Zealand, CBI, and Canada areas.

I have deliberately NOT gone with an exclusive graphic set of aircraft for this
mod (though one has been made), so as not to require any player change anything
in their stock game.

Well over 200 hours of play testing have gone into this effort....
However - errors are always possible - so any and all feedback from anyone who
tries any scenario will be welcome.

Playtesters - Kadrin, BluesBob, kbad, and Big B

A special thanks to Andrew Brown for his assistance in the conversion work he did
so graciously, to Treespider for his advice on China, and to Kadrin for his time
devoted to playtesting and scenario detail and design work.


Hope anyone who tries it - enjoys it.

Big B




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 6:47:25 PM)

We finally managed to get this PBEM agreed. I'am really forward to it to battle it out with Rob.

Hmmm. This Big B mod seems quite intresting by reading the release notes.




Nemo121 -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 6:50:15 PM)

If Empires Ablaze is a bit too "whoa, out there" for you ;) why not try RHS EOS?

It features an awful lot of chrome etc but when you dig into its guts it is a really, really solid mod. It has been play-tested exhaustively and every time I came across an error and fixed it for my mod I notified them and they had the option of fiing it in their version. It is also very much historically based albeit with the Japanese having the option to diverge from history as the war goes on in order to keep things interesting and to prevent them from becoming too one-sided.

If you don't like that have a look at one of the other RHS scenarios which stick really rigidly to history but may be less than balanced as a result. The A2A model is excellent and there are a lot of interesting units to play around with.




Rob Brennan UK -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 8:26:27 PM)

Thanks for all the replies chaps .. Looks like we both like Big B's fantastic mod. RHS is interesting, but too far off historical for me thanks nemo.

Downloaded and will have a browse round the map etc .. since its new to both of us I'll not load up an allied game so japan has very very limited intel for a 1st turn swamp move .. something for all those
japanese recon a/c to do at game start [;)] OR i'm a massochist and like getting clobbered ..

Both Aztez an I sem to think alike and i am looking forward (with trepidation) to playing him. He is a very experienced allied player and I'm a nippon newbie [:'(]




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 9:03:02 PM)

I have just looked Big B's mod for allied side.

Marvelous job and I can only Imagine how many hours has been put into it. I haven't and will not look how the IJA/N is setup in order to have total FOW from the beginning.

As said I'am really looking forward to this since this clash has been on the works proparbly well over a year by now.

Thanks for castor troy and Sardukar for comments from my behalf.





castor troy -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 9:09:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: aztez


Thanks for castor troy and Sardukar for comments from my behalf.





You´re welcome!




seydlitz_slith -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 10:14:51 PM)

Big B's mod is very good, and is my mod of choice.  Not only is the A2A model better, but he fixed the ships to pretty much match the Conways reference set, which I much appreciate.

Now, words of wisdom for you if you are used to playing stock scenarios:
I am using the AB extended map in my games. The same comment applies to the AB regular map.  
1. You can't fly zeroes from Saigon to Singapore on escort like you can in stock. The range is too far.
2. Guadalcanal is of much reduced size and importance when compared to stock. Tulagi is more important.

These comments are B-mod specific:
1. China is a mess for Japan.  In stock, you start with most of the area between Haiphong and Hong Kong under control of Japan. In B-mod, this area is under Chinese control with significant forces.
2. The new layout for the Chinese means that they can harrass your supply and disrupt your movement on the mainland in China.  With the large Chinese forces that are tied to cities, it can be very tough to root the Chinese out of the chities.  To do so wil take an army force level committment equal to the conquest of the PI or Malaya, and will take months.  You will not be ale to wind the game by steamrollering China.

Again, I really like this mod, and feel like it offers the  best balance out of all the mods I have tried.




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 10:19:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: seydlitz

Big B's mod is very good, and is my mod of choice.  Not only is the A2A model better, but he fixed the ships to pretty much match the Conways reference set, which I much appreciate.

Now, words of wisdom for you if you are used to playing stock scenarios:
I am using the AB extended map in my games. The same comment applies to the AB regular map.  
1. You can't fly zeroes from Saigon to Singapore on escort like you can in stock. The range is too far.
2. Guadalcanal is of much reduced size and importance when compared to stock. Tulagi is more important.

These comments are B-mod specific:
1. China is a mess for Japan.  In stock, you start with most of the area between Haiphong and Hong Kong under control of Japan. In B-mod, this area is under Chinese control with significant forces.
2. The new layout for the Chinese means that they can harrass your supply and disrupt your movement on the mainland in China.  With the large Chinese forces that are tied to cities, it can be very tough to root the Chinese out of the chities.  To do so wil take an army force level committment equal to the conquest of the PI or Malaya, and will take months.  You will not be ale to wind the game by steamrollering China.

Again, I really like this mod, and feel like it offers the  best balance out of all the mods I have tried.



Intresting and we have agreed to clash using this mod. By reading the release notes and by judging forum comments it seems very good.

We will not look each others troops/strenghts so it will be "ultimate" FOW from the start.

I think both of us will start AAR's once we got this thing setup and ongoing.

Appreciate the comments.




Cathartes -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/17/2007 10:59:18 PM)

Look forward to your AAR, as I'm hoping to fire up a PBEM with BigB mod in the near future.




Rob Brennan UK -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 12:01:58 AM)

Yup japanese AAR will be coming , it'll take me quite some time to digest the japanese position and give orders for turn one. the pacific looks normal so far , but i havnt started looking at china and the PI and malayan invasions at all yet.

Very very good i must say so far .. Big B if you read this .. many many thanks for what looks to be a real labour of love ..

One thought though .. dec 7th attack on american industry ? [:D]
clobber the F6 factories early so i never have to face them [;)]




Miller -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 1:52:48 AM)

Just started a game using Big-B mod and its looking good up to now.

Especially like the way he has sorted out the Allied a/c production to historical numbers. No more 30 TBD's a month (only 129 were made). Did Matrix just make up most of the monthly production rates???




JWE -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 2:38:49 AM)

With all due respect to Nik, who after all pushed this whole issue, IMHO, the BigB mod is the best one going. It has good a2a, good ships, good just about everything. Best of all, BigB doesn't violate any databases.

The USMC team at Pendleton plays with the BigB mod, and the AB extended map available at Andrew Brown's website. This boy knows his sh_t!!

JWE




bradfordkay -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 5:28:57 AM)

" 2. Guadalcanal is of much reduced size and importance when compared to stock. Tulagi is more important. "


Guadalcanal's airfield is still a very large one, and is thus of prime import. The naval base at Lunga was, shall we say, minimal at best and so should not rival that of Tulagi - which has no real value as an airbase.




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 12:12:05 PM)

Yes. The allied ac production really seem to have been altered quite nicely as you said Miller.

As for other views on this... diffrent and much improved. Don't want give too much info away to Rob though! [;)]

We are going to use stock map. (I actually would love to use Subchasers map but I guess it is not totally identical to latest stock)




John 3rd -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 12:32:13 PM)

I'm playing Castor Troy in our BigB Mod Campaign.

Notes:
1.  I agree on the strength and merits of the a-t-a model.
2.  We found an error with invading Guam.  The small Marine detachment packs a strong punch for CD purposes.  I believe that Brian intended on doing something about that.  If it isn't fixed, then hit Guam with a REAL invasion force.
3.  China SUCKS from the Japanese point-of-view.
4.  I really like the low experience given to most of the Allied units.  Provides a few weeks for the Japanese to cause chaos before Allied air develops any real skill.  I think was very true to reality in 1941-1942.

My thoughts...
John




castor troy -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 4:02:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

I'm playing Castor Troy in our BigB Mod Campaign.

Notes:
1.  I agree on the strength and merits of the a-t-a model.
2.  We found an error with invading Guam.  The small Marine detachment packs a strong punch for CD purposes.  I believe that Brian intended on doing something about that.  If it isn't fixed, then hit Guam with a REAL invasion force.
3.  China SUCKS from the Japanese point-of-view.
4.  I really like the low experience given to most of the Allied units.  Provides a few weeks for the Japanese to cause chaos before Allied air develops any real skill.  I think was very true to reality in 1941-1942.

My thoughts...
John



John is right - partially! [:D]

1. totally agree

2. You can´t take Guam like in stock, though you don´t need a division sized invasion. 2 construction bn are not enough but a naval guard unit is easily enough to take it. Pack a CA in your TF and everything is good. John had the problem of coming in like in stock, the first invasion was clobbered by the CD guns and he had to reinforce when another couple of ships got hit badly by CD fire. The assault value on guam is minimal but there are 6" CD guns and it´s mountaineous terrain.

3. agree too, but the Allied player should now not steamroll to Shanghai. Some defensive operations but no major offensive IMO.

4. The pilot experience of Allied squadron is around 50 - everywhere. It won´t get any better until the end of the war as the replacement exp is 55. The Japanese get replacements exp. 70 (IJN) and 65 (IJAAF). This means they get "untrained" pilots exp. around 35 when the pools are dry. Now the problem I´m thinking of: the Japanese player trains his pilots bombing a LCU, base, ... and gets his pilots within 25-30 missions to the same level as the US pilots are. USN are 60!! [8|] While this training method never was a problem for me, it could be a problem if it only takes 5 weeks for the Japanese to have unlimited numbers of equal trained pilots as the Allied. Low skilled pilots are very quick at a level around 50 but in comparison it takes loooong from 60 - 70 not to talk about from 70-80. With stock values it takes me at least 5-6 months to get 75 - 80 exp pilots (I know that´s too fast also but the game is at least also two or three times as bloody as RL). So while in stock it takes nearly half a year to have "competitive" pilots in Brian´s mod it takes 1 or max 2 months. Couple this with the ability to produce 500 - 800 IJA and IJN first line fighters (that are nearly as good as the Allied versions, only 20-30 mph slower but more agile and enough firepower to take down a fighter) then you´re running into problems...


lastly, but not related to the mod:

John, you´re posting here but my inbox doesn´t have a turn from you! [:-][8D]





Rob Brennan UK -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 7:30:01 PM)

thanks for the guam imfo ! .. kind of crucial [;)]




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 7:34:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob Brennan UK

thanks for the guam imfo ! .. kind of crucial [;)]



Knah ...don't believe that Rob... that information is misleading [:D]

Guam will not be captured at all... [:-]







castor troy -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/18/2007 7:49:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: aztez

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob Brennan UK

thanks for the guam imfo ! .. kind of crucial [;)]



Knah ...don't believe that Rob... that information is misleading [:D]

Guam will not be captured at all... [:-]







oooops, I´m sorry. I thought you had already started and were already some days ahead of the Guam invasion. [8|]




John 3rd -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 11:28:37 AM)

Always tipping the hand to the enemy....




aztez -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 1:07:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Always tipping the hand to the enemy....



[:D][:D][:D][:D]







Nikademus -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 4:08:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob Brennan UK

Nik , i did try version 5 but hated the flak to be honest. whats the lowdown on version 9 ?
( i know about the industry stuff, its the flak and a2a that interests me).


Ver 9 :

1.) Fighter separate durability scale removed due to issue of increased DUR values exacerbating a pre-existing condition in the game that impacts serviceability ratios for certain fighter air group sizes and/or types when placed on CAP patrol status. Fighter DUR values have been restored to pre-7.0 values.

2.) Aircraft weapon values have been adjusted to compensate for the removal of item #1. For the most part this reproduces the 8.0 positive changes on a2a bloodiness, even improves on them in certain cases. This change has been tested but more is better. A beta of 9.0 solved uber-cap completely but alas…made the bombers perhaps a tad bit too resistant in smaller doses. This version is a compromise between fighter vs. fighter lethality and bomber vs. bomber lethality without twisting the DUR relationship between the two types. Light armed fighters may still need a tweak but I’d rather have some feedback before implementing it.

OOB erratum fixes

1) Ki-44IIb – armor value changed to 0

2) Ki-27/A5M4 Mvr increased to 47. These planes are considered ultra-nimble and the change should slightly increase their survivability and ability to inflict harm.
3) Ki-43Ib version replaced with Ki-43Ic version with two 12.7mm guns. Besides the historical precedent, the plane needs the increased firepower to be able to approach its historical lethality in the game-engine.
4) Centerline value devices introduced for Allied twin engine day fighters that carried them.
5) Allied fighter production tweaked upward slightly.
6.) Corrected RNZAF squadrons in 43/44 scenarios equipped with F4U’s having blank for plane type (Due to F4U slot having been moved to make it non-carrier capable)
7.) Reduced content of reinforcement B-17 BG’s to curb the early uber bomber. (41/42 scns)
8) Corrected PV-1 Ventura stats.


in regards to version 5x, I did discover a couple device errors that grossly exagerated flak losses and corrected them. Sea based flak for Allies is stock equivilent now while Japanese sea based flak has been reduced to 75% equiv Allied, combined with tactical bomber evasiveness increases for Allied and Japanese land tacticals.




Icedawg -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 4:45:52 PM)

I'm also looking for some advice on mods, so if someone could help, please do.

I like to play as the Japanese vs the AI, but most mods I've seen are created for either PBEM or for Allied players vs the Japanese AI.

Are there any mods out there for human Japanese players vs the AI?

Could anyone make a recommendation here?




KTNJR -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 6:44:49 PM)

Hello guys,
Im am new to this fourm and to this game. I mainly play Combat Missions over at The Blitz wargaming club.
My ? is when you download one of the mods what file do you put it in?




Nikademus -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/19/2007 6:48:06 PM)

Most mods come in the form of scenerio files. All you need to do is download them to your WitP/SCEN file. A couple mods like Andrew's map mod require running an installation routine. Most if not all mods have FAQ's that explain what to do.




Sardaukar -> RE: Mods ? which to choose ? (3/20/2007 10:26:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Icedawg

I'm also looking for some advice on mods, so if someone could help, please do.

I like to play as the Japanese vs the AI, but most mods I've seen are created for either PBEM or for Allied players vs the Japanese AI.

Are there any mods out there for human Japanese players vs the AI?

Could anyone make a recommendation here?


I'd say that basicly WitP AI is not up to play Allied side. It just cannot handle it well.




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