F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (Full Version)

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el cid again -> F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/16/2007 1:40:12 AM)

Max Speed 272 mph

Cruise Speed 220 mph

Maneuverability 21

Durability 10

Endurance 148 minutes (x 220 mph = 9 hexes transfer 3 hexes extended 2 hexes normal)

6 x .50 cal Forward Guns

2 x 100 pound bombs

ROC 1875 ft/min

Operational Ceiling 21784 feet (= 24,204 Service Ceiling)


This aircraft will ONLY be found in RHSBBO series scenarios (including RPO and PPO) - which are less carrier focused and which feature more flying boat Patrol units vice fixed wing Navy bombers. The BBO scenarios set are probably more "historical" than the CVO set is - because it represents thinking before the war and during the first six months of the war. Changing naval planning is very difficult and not very likely to happen effectively in time to matter.



showboat1 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 1:50:51 AM)

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The super secret Allied weapon is finally going to get its day in the sun! (getting shot down in droves by Zeroes but who cares?)



CobraAus -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 2:23:00 AM)

Cant find profile side and top art if anyone can find please post

Cobra aus



treespider -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 2:40:01 AM)

http://www.daveswarbirds.com/usplanes/aircraft/catfish.htm



CobraAus -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 2:55:27 AM)

thanks a good start

Cobra



JeffroK -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 3:15:03 AM)

Ah, You could add a Float Spitfire and a Float C-47, did the get a B-17 on floats ??



showboat1 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 4:23:47 AM)

Nope, but there may have been a version on skies, you'd have to ask the players from the frozen tundra that one.



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 8:20:24 AM)

Sorry it took so long.[;)]

[image]local://upfiles/7909/874374671C1D4F8C93D5B724368CE71F.jpg[/image]



el cid again -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 1:19:42 PM)

Those who think the US / Allies always had better planes should look hard at this one. It was Johnny come lately - inspired indirectly by the N1K1 (the original Japanese concept) and directly by the A6M2-N (which, like this one, was an improvisation when the N1K1 was protracted in development). But while it came very late - it was not very competative with even the A6M2-N - it was not an original concept - it was not part of a family of float fighters (that could upgrade) - and it was a most marginal aircraft - in spite of considerable excitement surrounding its development.



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 7:41:28 PM)

Look at this nice scratch-built model!

[image]local://upfiles/7909/03B36E2ECB83406F9CE93188C2A73F1D.jpg[/image]



showboat1 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 8:12:26 PM)

Very nice.  Did you build it yourself? 



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 8:14:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: showboat1

Very nice.  Did you build it yourself? 



Uhhh...no...but I FOUND it myself[:D][sm=00000280.gif]



showboat1 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/16/2007 11:03:35 PM)

I'm still very impressed that you "found" a Wild Catfish model.



CobraAus -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/17/2007 12:08:57 AM)

result of what you guys sent and 2 hours to put together
a WildCatFish Side

Cobra Aus

[image]local://upfiles/13770/298256AC466C4C65BD26C071F0EE0C74.jpg[/image]



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" (6/17/2007 2:39:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: CobraAus

result of what you guys sent and 2 hours to put together
a WildCatFish Side

Cobra Aus

[image]local://upfiles/13770/298256AC466C4C65BD26C071F0EE0C74.jpg[/image]



That is massively awesome Cobra!![sm=00000436.gif]



el cid again -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 2:58:34 PM)

The problem with the entire USMC concept of AVs as "seaplane carriers" circa 1940 is time to execute:

by the time the Catfish can be ready for service it will be pretty obsolescent - mid 1943. Only 7 AVs of appropriate design will remain to complete by then: these I have given a VMF squadron each. They also are supposed to have a squadron of some sort of dive bombers - but I have not worked that out. Nor have I figured out what to do with the seven other seaplane carriers that appear sooners - 4 start the war. We could put a seaplane unit on them that upgrades to the Catfish - giving them fighter cover eventually.

The big tenders apparently were all able to hoist a flying boat on board. Like the Akitsushima - only they are not so famous for it.

Remember - the Catfish is only in the BBO scenario set - and the seaplane carrier versions of the AVs also are only in BBO type scenarios (BBO/RPO/PPO). The Japanese also build extra more ships of this sort. And the thinking of the day was that it would take a long time to build airfields - so planning did not include Seabee's on the scale eventually done.
In these scenarios I have removed 26 regiments of USN engineers - which may make the domination by land planes take a bit longer to occur.



el cid again -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 3:02:05 PM)

Since the Marines wanted convertable dive bombers - planes that could operate on floats or wheels - we might just abstract it out - and let the dive bombers be SBDs assigned to the "seaplane carriers." They could actually launch without floats - since they had (or were planned to have) a catapult.



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 4:03:31 PM)

Had those Wildcatfish been deployed, one might ponder the purpose. I suspect they would have been good for convoy escort.
If so, perhaps any small cargo ship might have been able to carry one?
One further, maybe a special class of ship to carry them in convoy?
Surely this was the intent with those few catapult one shot Hurricanes..



saj42 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 7:07:17 PM)

Ooohhh the CAM ships - a hastily improvised solution to the Fw200 Condors, shadowing North Atlantic convoys, relaying info to the wolfpacks


[image]local://upfiles/16324/7872BF5956AC4F2A9FEAC3A55AC52575.jpg[/image]



m10bob -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 7:22:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tallyho!

Ooohhh the CAM ships - a hastily improvised solution to the Fw200 Condors, shadowing North Atlantic convoys, relaying info to the wolfpacks


[image]local://upfiles/16324/7872BF5956AC4F2A9FEAC3A55AC52575.jpg[/image]


Exactly!!!!..(Another fine "what if" idea which had limited real life use..)



showboat1 -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 7:31:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tallyho!

Ooohhh the CAM ships - a hastily improvised solution to the Fw200 Condors, shadowing North Atlantic convoys, relaying info to the wolfpacks


[image]local://upfiles/16324/7872BF5956AC4F2A9FEAC3A55AC52575.jpg[/image]


I have a hard time imagining that this was a job that guys lined up around the block for. Ditching in the North Atlantic? Not my cup of tea.



el cid again -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/18/2007 11:36:20 PM)

Any armed plane is a problem for a submarine. But the Marines envisaged island based warfare - with "seaplane" carriers to transport the planes - then support them until a base could be built. They were not really intended to fight at sea so much as from anchor.



el cid again -> RE: F4F-3S "Wild Catfish" Seaplane Carriers (6/19/2007 12:58:59 PM)

We have given 5 of the 7 early AVs air groups - the other two only could carry a single patrol plane.
These are a flight of USN observation aircraft and a squadron of Marine utility planes able to drop 250 pound bombs. These latter upgrade to the float dive bomber in 1943.

We gave the 7 late ships air groups including a navy observation flight, a seaplane fighter squadron, and 5 of the 7 (all but the last two in 1945) get a dive bomber squadron to begin with. We have not at this time created a special unit for the float dive bomber - but we may have to do that bye and bye.

We also removed many regiments of navy engineers in the same set - so the seaplanes may stay relevant longer for that reason. The BBO set - based on pre war and early war planning and thinking - is continuing to diverge from the CVO set - based on what actually happened - including some pretty unlikely shifts in purchases and strategy.



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