Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?!

Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (Full Version)

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sztomcat -> Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 12:46:44 AM)
----Below is the email I sent to support@matrixgames.com yesterday but hadn't got any reponse: "Today I tried to play TOAW3 (haven't played it for a while), only to get this message "There is an error with your serial number as entered. Please contact support@matrixgames.com for assistance. Error Code 0 What's wrong? I just wanted to play the game I paid for & I never shared my serial number with any body. I don't know what kind of anti-piracy system you implement, but you should never ever prevent a customer to play the game he paid & installed into his OWN computer. This is ridiculous and I demand this to be solved ASAP" -----Below is something more I found after I sent the email above, unfortunately, I sent the second email to matrixgames@digitalriver.com "I just reported that my paid TOAW3 game suddenly said "serial number error" and refused to load. Then I also found that my WITP (War in The Pacific) & GGAWD (Gary Grisby's World At War: a World Divided) also had the same "serial number error" issue & all refused to load!! For WITP, it gave my "error 998", for GGAWD, it gave me "error 800". I don't know what is going on, but it must be st. wrong on your side. I know computer very well, I don't think there could be any virus/spyware/computer issue causing this problem. Besides, all 3 games I played well months ago, which means the serial numbers just work fine then. If this issue happened just to one of those 3 games, I would say maybe it's st. wrong in your online authentication database & it's somewhat excusable (though I don't think you have right to suddenly disable my game after I paid & installed it on MY own had drive through your online infringing and manipulating). But now sb. suddenly, secretly disabled 3 of my paid games without even notifying me, this is just too offending and it's the worst I experienced in gaming. I also seriously concern about my computer security now: recently my computer became slower but no antibirus/anti-spyware could find any problem. If sb. could secretly disable all my games on my hard drive like this, they basically could do anything harmful to my computer. Now I not only ask you make all my games working as before, I also need a good explanation: why and how sb. suddenly disable all my paid games?! I didn't share any of those serial numbers with anybody, so there's no chance they used my serials and caught your attention. I paid about $200 for that 3 games ( I paid you >$300 in all) and it's bad enough for me to ... If others realize that being your paid customer could mean being robbed off secretly what is alrelay paid for, probably through intruding user's owncomputer, they would definately think twice about paying you in the future." -----After I sent those 2 emails, I uninstalled GGAWD completely from my computer & reinstall it using the digital downloaded installation file. I didn't install any updates. I even disconnected my computer from internet so there's no chance it would go through a hidden online authentication (I bought legal copy of course, but who knows what happened on Matrix system?)...but still got the exactly same "serial numbe error, please contact support@matrixgames.com for help" message!! This almost is a proof that st. had been done to my own computer to prevent me even install & play the very original copy. I wrote this new information to support@matrixgames.com this morning, still no reponse whatsoever from them. This is WAY TOO RIDICULOUS. I hate to complain this publicaly but I have no other choice if my 3 paid games were all non-playable & my computer security is threatened.

JAMiAM -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 1:55:34 AM)
You'll need to give support some time to verify your story, the offending serial numbers and research as to the cause of the problem. If it is indeed a problem with the serial numbers. I would recommend in the meantime, relaxing, and checking on your end as to possible problems that you might have with your system. Run a full battery of anti-virus, and spyware checks. Completely uninstall the games. If you have no working Matrixgames games installed, then also wipe the Matrix Games directory on the C: drive. Then run a registry cleaner (be sure to back up your registry first!) and delete all references to Matrixgames and the games that are giving you trouble. Then disconnect your computer from the internet, disable your anti-virus program, and reinstall from your disks, or saved copies. Before you patch the games, check and see if you can run them. Before downloading, restart your AV program and reconnect to the internet. Download fresh copies of the most recent patches. If you can, then install the patches. If after installing the patches you find you cannot run the games, or install the patch, because of a serial number problem, you will know that your serial number has made its way onto the blacklist. If it did, it is likely that you might have to do some explaining as to how and why it is there. Since you apparently have three different games that have been blacklisted, the preponderance of evidence is against you.

sztomcat -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 2:58:44 AM)
1) I am Matrix cutomer, I need support before I did some major uninstall/reinstall ( I tried one game) . Since the error message is clear enogh, I think I already gave enough information to Matrix support 2) I am a computer technician myself, I know my computer is free of thos detectable viruses/spywars/trojans 3) if I need to "run a registry cleaner (be sure to back up your registry first!) and delete all references to Matrixgames and the games that are giving you trouble", it means Matrix installer/uninstaller is not good at all. To normal game players, you are not supposed to ask them to do things like that. 4)"you will know that your serial number has made its way onto the blacklist. If it did, it is likely that you might have to do some explaining as to how and why it is there. " This is way ridiculous: first, if matrix games think they have the right to put my paid serial numbers on "blackliist", it's they who need to give explanation. As a customer, I have no idea why and how and when they did that. Second, even if my serial nubers were put on some blacklist due to some reason (for example, I was hackered and sb. steal my serial number), still I should be able to install & play the original installation file I bought from Matrix. Matrix under no circumstances could go into my computer to change anything already installed on my computer even if they found my serial number was "not nright" (they could refuse the serial number to pass updatesuthentication for sure) "Since you apparently have three different games that have been blacklisted, the preponderance of evidence is against you" This comment is outrageous and extremely offending: I paid hundreds of dollars to buy Matrix hames, after I didn't play thet for a while, I suddenly found that I got the same "serial number error" on 3 different games! It's I who need explanation. How can you use this kind of logic like "since only you have this problem, you must be somewhat guilty"?! I already told you: I am the legal user of all 3 games and I never ever shared these games with anybody. I didn't even install them on any other computers, not even to my Windows Vista dual boot! I don't think being Matrix customer means you can buy your game, and later someday your playing rights were secretly putting on some hidden "blacklist" without notification/explanation and suddenly you lost all you paid for. I've been Matrix's customer for years, paid them many titles, even bought from GGWAW to GGAWD (almost double pay the same game). But right now I got experience like this and you say "evidence is against you" ?? For God's sake! quote: ORIGINAL: JAMiAM You'll need to give support some time to verify your story, the offending serial numbers and research as to the cause of the problem. If it is indeed a problem with the serial numbers. I would recommend in the meantime, relaxing, and checking on your end as to possible problems that you might have with your system. Run a full battery of anti-virus, and spyware checks. Completely uninstall the games. If you have no working Matrixgames games installed, then also wipe the Matrix Games directory on the C: drive. Then run a registry cleaner (be sure to back up your registry first!) and delete all references to Matrixgames and the games that are giving you trouble. Then disconnect your computer from the internet, disable your anti-virus program, and reinstall from your disks, or saved copies. Before you patch the games, check and see if you can run them. Before downloading, restart your AV program and reconnect to the internet. Download fresh copies of the most recent patches. If you can, then install the patches. If after installing the patches you find you cannot run the games, or install the patch, because of a serial number problem, you will know that your serial number has made its way onto the blacklist. If it did, it is likely that you might have to do some explaining as to how and why it is there. Since you apparently have three different games that have been blacklisted, the preponderance of evidence is against you.

JAMiAM -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 3:26:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sztomcat "Since you apparently have three different games that have been blacklisted, the preponderance of evidence is against you" This comment is outrageous and extremely offending: I paid hundreds of dollars to buy Matrix hames, after I didn't play thet for a while, I suddenly found that I got the same "serial number error" on 3 different games! It's I who need explanation. How can you use this kind of logic like "since only you have this problem, you must be somewhat guilty"?! I already told you: I am the legal user of all 3 games and I never ever shared these games with anybody. I didn't even install them on any other computers, not even to my Windows Vista dual boot! I'm sorry that this might sound offensive, but it is a simple fact. If you had three automobiles that were left unsecured, and each of them ended up with a dead body in it, you would have "some explaining to do" to the police. Now, there might very well be a reasonable explanation for the occurrences, but as the number of dead bodies keeps adding up, the presumption of innocence likewise fades. So, my suggestion is NOT that you are guilty, it is that the presumption of your innocence in having 3 different games fail the new security system is already severely tasked. When you add in such facts as the blacklists were compiled some 3-6 months ago, depending on the game, this means that your computer would have had to have been compromised not recently but for an extended length of time in the past. Add to that, the fact that the one and only post you'd previously made on this site was over four years ago. Add to that the game serial numbers that were added to the blacklists were s/n's from people who did purchase the game legally, and then posted them on warez sites, again over the course of the time frame of 12 months ago to no more recently than 4 months ago. Like I said, you may indeed be innocent, but you have to look at the evidence that is readily available to anyone with 5 minutes to research your claim, and realize that you have an uphill battle to persuade the powers that be, that you are guilt-free. With that in mind, I would suggest that instead of ranting that you've been wronged, you carefully examine your claims, and present them in the best possible light, with all supporting documentation. I hope you're innocent and can again be able to enjoy the games that you bought, but that decision will be made by Matrix support staff, who are busy with convention mode at the moment and will likely be slow in getting back to your complaint.

Erik Rutins -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 3:33:25 AM)
I've responded to this customer via e-mail. However, to clear the air - we did not disable his serial numbers, nor do we have that capability. Our games do not use online activation, we do not make changes to customers' computers and we don't magically break installed games somehow via remote access. You buy it, you own it, you can always install it, it will always work, period. The assumption that there's some kind of "blacklist" that would cause a customer's legally bought game to suddenly stop working one day is completely false. There's some kind of bizarre local system issue at work here, which we're working with the customer to try to figure out.

JAMiAM -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 5:31:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins I've responded to this customer via e-mail. However, to clear the air - we did not disable his serial numbers, nor do we have that capability. Our games do not use online activation, we do not make changes to customers' computers and we don't magically break installed games somehow via remote access. You buy it, you own it, you can always install it, it will always work, period. The assumption that there's some kind of "blacklist" that would cause a customer's legally bought game to suddenly stop working one day is completely false. There's some kind of bizarre local system issue at work here, which we're working with the customer to try to figure out. Erik, I'm glad that you're getting it sorted out. I'm sorry if my use of the word "blacklist" may have been misleading. However, several months ago when the new serial number protection system was incorporated into all new Matrixgames patches, I asked the question, straight up, as a developer, as to how it was to work. That is, what mechanism would prevent the installation of patches to pirated copies. I was told that the new system would reference known bad numbers and prevent installation of the patch to those installed games. I was told that the only protection would be that old copies of pirated games would no longer be able to play against new, patched legitimate versions. This is all I was referring to when I made the mention of a "blacklist". I suspect that I am not the only Matrix developer left with a minimal understanding of the system in place, and it would be a good idea to make sure that all of your developers know more of the specifics, so that we are not left with only enough information to make fools of ourselves when trying to offer support. My apologies to the original poster, if he thought I was implying his copies were pirated. That was not in anyway my intention. I was merely trying to help him make sense of the protection system as it was explained to me, and to seek an adequate workaround, through local system fixes first. Then, if they failed, to make a detailed and level-headed support request if that failed. I hope that everything gets fixed and he can get back to enjoying his games. Regards, James A Mathews

Erik Rutins -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/3/2007 4:03:14 PM)
James, We do remove pirated serial numbers from _patches_, so as to prevent ongoing support to illegal/pirated copies, but that will not prevent the original installer that the customer bought from working, nor do we have any way (nor would we ever) login to a customer's computer and disable his games. If you have any questions about the serial number system, you can always write to me or Dave. Regards, - Erik

sztomcat -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/4/2007 1:09:43 AM)
Below is the 3 emails I wrote to Erik last night, I think they actually pointed to st. on your end, which is explained here (also what I thought) "several months ago when the new serial number protection system was incorporated into all new Matrixgames patches....the new system would reference known bad numbers and prevent installation of the patch to those installed games. " This makes lots of sense and it's your right to protect your own copy rights. HOWEVER, in my case, NONE of my 3 games are "pirated copies", PERIOD. I already wrote to support@matrixgames.com all my purchase information, including my real name, address and telephone. Actually my whole identity is open to Matrix. Their databse should definitely have my information and it's VERY EASY for them to chek if I did purchase those copies from them. I cannot think up better "documentation" they need in this case to prove the fact that I am the legal owner of those 3 copies. As far as "known bad numbers" is concerned, I also proved that all the serial numbers I use are legal serial numbers matrix provided to me, and I NEVER EVER share those serial numbers with anybody, or install the games in different computers (not even in Vista partition). Even if sb. secretly hacked my PC & stole these numbers for use on other copies & Matrix realiized that (not a likely senario though), I still want to know what they actually found in this situation for my own security concern. What's more,all 3 serial numbers were working fine right after I patched my games. It means when the recent updates were out, my serial numbers were NOT "known bad numbers" on any of the list. Then WHY after a while (I didn't touch the games since I've been playing chess a lot recently), all 3 games suddenly "re-discover" that my serial numbers are "known bad numbers" and took actions?! Please remember: I bought Gary Garisby's World at War and had no problem playing that, but suddenly even the original installation file stopped working?! This is quite different than other 2 games, which original installation file still work today. From technical point of view, If my issue was really due to "known bad numbers", then the only explanation is that "known bad numbers" list is expanding even after recent updates are out and already been applied to my copies, and it kept updating a file on my computer! What's really funny is the "If you had three automobiles that were left unsecured, and each of them ended up with a dead body in it, you would have "some explaining to do" to the police" argument. If you secretly,suddenly, remotely confiscated my cars bought from you and I asked why, do you think you can simply say "sorry but you have dead bodies in your car" and ask your customer to prove he is innocent?! If you claim "you have dead bodies in your car", then where and what are the dead bodies you mean, and how you actually find it in recent months while I am not even driving outside? Besides, game companies are not police at all. Even police are not supposed to confiscate prople's car, claim "each of them ended up with a dead body in it", and then ask people to prove their innocent to get their properties back. If you say this is police from a police state, it might make sense. Anyway, "the new system would reference known bad numbers and prevent installation of the patch to those installed games" not only makes sense, but is also legal and reasonable. Personally I support this kind of protection and I don't even think it's a nuisance to legal users. However, "known bad numbers" should be somewhat public (to people who distribute pirated copies, they would know what numbers are unusable anyway), in case if you wronged sb. or sb. was hacked without realization. Also, any protection check should give the same result after the patch is applied. Dear Sir: I just tried to shutdown Avast Protection (I don't use firewall except Windows Firewall), but still got the same thing. But I did start to use Avast Home Edition recently (Norton gave me too much trouble), so it might cause trouble. I would try this myself: intalling one of the 3 games in my Windows Vista, which also uses Avast now. Probably it would work and it would eliminate the possibility that my serial numbers were on a "black list" as one suggested in Matrix forum. Recently my computer got extremely slow (could not find anything though) after running a while, so I did disable some autoload things.Could you tell me if any Windows startup process/driver/service was needed by your game? My UV still works (it's a boxed version), but WITP got error (just error number, no mention about serial number though) right after I click "play xxxxx", the same as TOAW3. For AWD things are somewhat different, I have to wait until the opening movie is over & then game loading bar reached the end to get the same error message (different error number though) as in TOAW3. Anyway, I will try some things myself according to your advice. Thank you for your kind help. Hi Erik Good and bad news: I tried to uninstall TOAW3 completely, clean registry & reinstall it, stopped my Avast protection. And it worked!! However, then I apply the recent patch, still stopped Avast, this time the same error appeared. I am about to try WitP now, I strongly feel it would work after I install the original copy but would fail after I installed the recent update. However, for AWD, even the first installation would not work What would this tell us if that's the case? I would say it's probably an issue related to your recent-changed serial checking system. Since TOAW3 is out about middle last year, but AWD is later than that, so I would guess you changed the serial checking system and use it on TOAW3 updates as well as new games like AWD. If anything is affecting that mechanism, it only affect recet one. Later I would try this on my Vista partition, that would give us more useful information. As I predicted, The original Witp works now after uninstall/reinstall (this time I didn't bother to clean registry) But, right after I applied the dec 2006 update, the issue happened again.

sztomcat -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/4/2007 1:24:40 AM)
More information about my games: I just checked the saved games dates, found my recent saved files (one of them is Korea 50-51 sitrep_log026.txt) are dated around March 2, 2007. This proves that after the last Mar 1st patch, my TOAW3 is still working perfectly. Actually I played the game that day only because the new patch drew me back to this game. I am 100% sure all my 3 games worked fine after recent updating. If anything went wrong, I would discover it long time ago. So JAMiAM, can you explain to me how these recent patches didn't find "dead body" in my games when they first installed?!

sztomcat -> RE: Why 3 of my paid Matrix games all refused me?! (7/4/2007 2:10:11 AM)
To Erik: I suddenly think up a perfect way to find out if my serial number are really on some sort of "known bad numbers" list. I already gave you my serial numbers, so you can simply try to install TOAW3 using my serial number (if you have any legal concern, I can uninstall my game before you install & later ask you to uninstall it), applying recent patch, and try to play it. If this works, we can forget about Jamiam's suggestion and focus on other directions. If even you cannot make it work, it must be serial number issue, not my computer problem. This test makes a lot sense: I myself is also a customer service professional. When sb. complained his username/password is not working, the best way to verify whether or not it's real authentication error is always trying to test login yourself using the same username/password .(of course after get customer's permission). Now noth I and Jamiam think it's serial number check failure, then why not test the same serial number on your side? Of course I can do this test myself on other machines (again after uninstalling from my PC first), however, Jamiam might just not believe "my story". I already sent you enough information to show you that I am the legal user of all 3 games. I can also prove to you what happened on my computer (all 3 games not working) is not fabricated/misobserved by this way.

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