Creating barges (Full Version)

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KTNJR -> Creating barges (9/8/2007 5:49:26 PM)

How do you create barges?
I've looked in the manuel and I cant find anything on it.



Mike Solli -> RE: Creating barges (9/8/2007 6:06:53 PM)

If you have them available - click on the base where you want to produce them.  In the lower right of the screen you'll see a "create barge" button.  When you click on it, it'll build all the available barges.  It consumes supply (20 per barge, I think).  If you don't have enough supply or don't have any barges available, the button is greyed out.



KTNJR -> RE: Creating barges (9/8/2007 7:34:15 PM)

That might be the ticket then " when they are available".
In both of my pbem im Feb. They might not be available then. Im going to have to check when it's my turn.

Thanks[&o]



Mike Solli -> RE: Creating barges (9/8/2007 7:40:21 PM)

You can see how many barges you have available in the screen that shows ship reinforcements.  Lower left corner of that screen.



wdolson -> RE: Creating barges (9/8/2007 11:49:06 PM)

I would expect different versions of the game, stock, CHS, RHS, etc. has different availability times for barges.  I'm most familiar with CHS, so my comments are how they work there.  I think the Japanese get some fairly early on. 

The Allies start with a few in Singapore, or somewhere else in the southern resource area.  They don't get any more until mid to late 1942.  They usually become available around the middle of the month.  Same thing for PT boats.  By 1943, the Allies are getting a few in the middle of most months.

They show up in varying sizes with different designations.  Allies barges have designations like LCM and LCI.  I think the biggest has a capacity of 300.  Some are as low as 50.  All have pretty low endurance, around 500.  In CHS, there are also some ocean going LCIs that show up through the normal ship arrival system that have a capacity of 300 and an endurance of 3000 or something like that. 

Bill



KTNJR -> RE: Creating barges (9/9/2007 12:33:15 AM)

I just did my turn and I looked. I don't have any yet.
Im playing the BigB mod and it's 2/42. As I looked over the map I really don't have any bases that would require them. To far apart right now.
It just seems all of my shipping is used in convoys and shipping men and planes and I could use maybe another 100 AK's.[:D]



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (9/15/2007 11:59:06 AM)

I'm playing stock and right now it is 13th july . Still no barges for Allies in my game .



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (9/29/2007 9:27:44 PM)

25th july still no barges .



JJB647 -> RE: Creating barges (9/30/2007 1:27:07 AM)

What do you use the barge for? I've never found any real use for them.



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (9/30/2007 1:31:28 AM)

They are excelent when enemy have base close to yours . Like in Solomons , DEI ....



wdolson -> RE: Creating barges (9/30/2007 1:51:36 AM)

I just looked in the database.  The Allies get a lot more barges in CHS than in stock.  In stock, you don't get any until mid January 1943.  In CHS, you get a small number starting in May 42, but don't start getting very many until early 43.

I've found large fleets of barges are handy for invasions where the distance is not that far.  A fleet of 100 barges will get an entire combat unit ashore much quicker than with an AP.  They are also handy for supply missions between bases that are a few hexes from one another and the enemy's airpower is potent in the area.

Bill



Joe D. -> RE: Creating barges (10/1/2007 6:24:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JJB647
What do you use the barge for? I've never found any real use for them.


Barges are cheaper than transports and harder to spot; very handy for supplying over short distances in contested waters.



Cavalry Corp -> RE: Creating barges (10/1/2007 6:29:40 PM)

Only Japs have barges VERY useful indeed
Planes do not usually attack them except ( I heard ) FB high exp - low alt .

BUT Subs will deck gun them
In my game My Jap subs have sunk about 10 lcv things and the allies trashed one lot of barges with a surface TF at Baker .

M



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (10/2/2007 8:40:00 AM)

all planes can attack barges if you put alt on 100



Cavalry Corp -> RE: Creating barges (10/2/2007 6:30:37 PM)

But will need high exp to attack at low level 80+

m



Joe D. -> RE: Creating barges (10/2/2007 8:05:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milman
all planes can attack barges if you put alt on 100


Yes, but w/o experience they might not be able to hit them.



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (10/3/2007 1:05:47 PM)

yes , but for example i use those dutch fighter planes for this attacks , they have good range and they can cover a lot hexes . When barge TF is detected they need 8-10 days to enter and leave area in which those dutch planes can attack them and here is my stats based on my experience for those 10 days (i am not talking about game mechanics) :

exp<50 They fly every 3rd day , no bomb hits and only few gun hits

50<exp<65 - They fly 2 days in period of 3 days , few bomb hits , a lot of gun hits

Exp>65 They fly every time tf is detected , high number of gun hits and 3-4 bombs hits/squadron

Of course this is stats if weather is exelent and if there is no enemy CAP .



Cavalry Corp -> RE: Creating barges (10/3/2007 6:26:01 PM)

In fact I have just used this info in my game
i am suprised missions for low exp pilots are flown BUT I have just changed some units over as well and see what happens

Michael



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 5:56:51 PM)

For stock , scenario 15.

First barges available from 15. november 1942.



Grotius -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 6:11:26 PM)

15 Nov 1942? Hmm. I recall using IJN barges in Uncommon Valor in the summer of 1942. But I'm no expert on this history of Japanese barge use, so maybe WITP has it right.



Joe D. -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 6:29:37 PM)

I'm no expert on IJN barges either, but re the History Channel, they were armed w/heavy machine guns; they also had a flat bottom so that a torpedo should never be able to touch them, which sometimes happended anyway in UV.



Panther Bait -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 9:45:28 PM)

I believe that I am KTN's Japanese opponent in one of those games (BigB 1.4). I have a few barges on-map on turn 1, and I have a few available to create (~10 or so) in Feb '42. I think those barges were available on the first turn, but I have not created any yet. I don't think the number has increased any either.




String -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 9:47:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

I'm no expert on IJN barges either, but re the History Channel, they were armed w/heavy machine guns; they also had a flat bottom so that a torpedo should never be able to touch them, which sometimes happended anyway in UV.


Well, torpedoes do occasionally surface..



crsutton -> RE: Creating barges (11/12/2007 11:50:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson

I just looked in the database.  The Allies get a lot more barges in CHS than in stock.  In stock, you don't get any until mid January 1943.  In CHS, you get a small number starting in May 42, but don't start getting very many until early 43.

I've found large fleets of barges are handy for invasions where the distance is not that far.  A fleet of 100 barges will get an entire combat unit ashore much quicker than with an AP.  They are also handy for supply missions between bases that are a few hexes from one another and the enemy's airpower is potent in the area.

Bill



Um.... in my stock game, I started to get barges in late 1942. October or November. Not many but some.



Milman -> RE: Creating barges (11/14/2007 4:13:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Milman

For stock , scenario 15.

First barges available from 15. november 1942.


This info is for allies . Japan have 40-50 barges from the start but i don't know when new japanese barges are available for "producing" them .



John Lansford -> RE: Creating barges (2/18/2008 6:35:32 PM)

I've played UV for a long time, but just recently purchased and started playing WITP (about a month or so).  I've gotten frustrated with the Allied initial complement of barges (LCM's and LVMP's) after I foolishly clicked "create barges" at Lunga for an invasion at Munda further up the Solomons.

ISTM that these small landing craft should not be modeled in the game as individual ships; they were never intended to be ocean going and were carried by other, larger ships for use at the invasion site itself.  I've finally gotten them to Munda but the AP's and APA's are the ones with the men, not them.  Is there any way I can get them to do something useful, or am I stuck with them using fuel now that they've been created?



Q-Ball -> RE: Creating barges (2/18/2008 7:23:57 PM)

I have a follow-up question on Barge Availability.

If a barge is destroyed, does the available number in the pool increase by one?

Or, is it lost forever?


Also, I suspect barges will be less useful in AE, because of how ships out of fuel will be handled. Apparently, if a barge is out of fuel, it will still paddle to the destination, but now will start taking significant damage and risk foundering on those types of trips.



ctangus -> RE: Creating barges (2/19/2008 1:05:56 AM)

Barges, both allied & IJ, will respawn. There is a delay before they show back in the pool - I believe it's 30 days but don't hold me to that.

In addition to any plane strafing at 100', fighter-bombers set to any altitude will attack barges. Beaufighters seem to excel in the barge-busting role. I've yet to see how the Ki-45 does against them. I suspect they'd do similarly well unopposed, but I doubt they'd get that many chances.



Q-Ball -> RE: Creating barges (2/19/2008 1:24:03 AM)

Speaking of losses, I learned this recently: Barges don't cost VP points, unless you SCUTTLE them. So don't scuttle them. I have sailed damaged ones closer to the Allies just so they finish them off and get them back in the pool.



Gem35 -> RE: Creating barges (2/19/2008 3:22:35 AM)

As has been mentioned, barges available to the Good Guys are in late November 42 in the grand stock campaign. They are not like AKs or Aps where their endurance is sufficent for vast ocean voyages. Consider them as a stop gap for short base jaunts.



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