RE: Build Ahead... (Full Version)

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Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Build Ahead... (11/30/2007 1:11:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: alex_van_d

Building ahead? Let's see....fighters, fighters, and did I mention fighters?

Seriously though in our group once we had the minimum land and naval units to accomplish your goals, with maybe a little extra, you built nothing but fighters. In fact we rarely built any Tac, or Nav. A few Str would get built but not many. If you didn't have air superiority then there was no point bulding anything but fighters. Plus lots of those fighters have Tac factors to use once the enemy planes are gone. And you can't argue with getting the Black Widow a year ahead, or the Me-262s. Those planes can change the course of the war if used in the right spot and time.

Now mind you, I wonder if our perspective was influenced by the fact that we were playing Wif 5 when PiF first came out. We all wanted to play with the new toys and our playing style was influences by our early experiences. Like this one:

Having survived the German onslaught I was slowly building up to go on the offensive. Building fighters like mad in order to gain air superiority. Finally win a few key air battles shooting down some front-line german planes and the Russion Juggernaut starts to roll, taking hexes left and right thanks to air superiority. At this point I make a crucial mistake and the German makes some good decisions. I decide that it's high time to build my first Tac of the game and actually stop building fighters. In the meantime the German has been building so many fighters that he is an entire year ahead, then he rebases every single plane from the west front to the east front and the Russian steamroller slams to a halt. Took almost a year to recover from that fiasco, and the lesson I learned is to always build fighters.

In fact in our games You will see the German and British building out their entire fighter pools and building one year ahead. Typically you'll see all the '43 planes on the map by J/A of '42. Italy and Russia follow suit if they can. The US will do so as well, but usually later since they have to build a navy first. Japan typicaly just doesn't have the BP to keep up with this arms race.

That's may experience. Your Mileage May Vary.

Alex

Building so many fighters only works if the other side does likewise. If the USSR built all those fighters, then as Germany I'll build armor, HQs and offensive chits. I simply won't fight in the air, preserving my inferior air force, while slaughtering the USSR land units. Sure, I'll give up some shifts for not disrupting units, and the USSR can add their 2 points of tactical air/air unit to combats, but attrition of land units will melt the USSR amry while the German army has steady reinforcements coming. Soon those fighters will be looking for a place to rebase as the tanks come rolling in.

And exactly how are the British going to keep their convoy pipelines functioning against a massive Axis submarine force, without naval air? Can those fighters defend well against Sea Lion? The assumption by the CW player (if he builds so many fighters) is that his navy can stand steady attrition without many BPs spent on refurbishing it.




Dave3L -> RE: Build Ahead... (11/30/2007 3:35:13 AM)

Good point. As the Soviet generals met in paris after WW III, one asked the other, "So who won the air war?"

Spending that many points on one thing is never good. Balance is the key.




brian brian -> RE: Build Ahead... (11/30/2007 5:23:54 AM)

My question would be ... was that with 2d10 land combat? When each flipped corps in a defending hex is a +2, basically an odds shift? Also, I get a sense you weren't playing with fractional odds, so a 1 or 2 point fighter-bomber can change odds levels. (I find the game incredibly slower without fractional odds). I've heard about games with such levels of fighter builds but haven't participated in any. But I've never heard of not building many bombers. What good is air superiority without bombers to exploit it? I think you must be playing without fractional odds the more I think about it.




composer99 -> RE: Build Ahead... (11/30/2007 5:29:32 PM)

Our German player was building ahead fighters like mad this RL game I'm playing now. We as the Allies have not. We still had an edge in the air from early 43 on and dominating air superiority from late 43. I can't see the point of the Allies building ahead fighters like that when they need so many other bits and pieces to make the war go.

Besides, if the Western Allies were doing their job in 41-42 and strat bombing Germany, the Germans should not be able to afford all these fighters.

And as Germany I would only build ahead fighters like that if I wasn't on the offensive in 42.




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