RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (Full Version)

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crsutton -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 6:50:08 PM)

Tupalov ANT-6

http://www.aviastar.org/air/russia/ant-6.php

http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Aerospace/Tupulov/Aero59G1.htm




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 6:57:15 PM)

Yes, that's been posted three or four times already...




crsutton -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 7:07:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Yes, that's been posted three or four times already...



Yes, but it would be my choice as we...........Hey, 1001 posts and another star!


I really need to get myself a girlfriend.




BrucePowers -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 7:10:02 PM)

It is one ugly airplane.




Reichenberg -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 7:25:45 PM)

If an ASW bomber counts too, my first choice is the Kyushu Q1W1 Tokai:
[image]http://www.combinedfleet.com/ijna/q1wcol.gif[/image]
Talking of the Do17 being ugly....

Uwe




niceguy2005 -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 8:44:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

If we're going to list the Hampden as an ugly plane, then the Ki-48 and the Baltimore/Maryland must go too. Here's another two:


I may have my wires crossed and no time to look it up, but isn't the Baltimore the same as the Martin? Which I think was listed toward the top of the thread. [;)]




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 10:00:13 PM)

Not quite the same. This is the Baltimore:

[image]local://upfiles/16369/20D69AE6834C4D188B01EB4DE58A83C3.jpg[/image]




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 10:00:44 PM)

And this is the Maryland:



[image]local://upfiles/16369/2736D758DC514F8F821421F6F5C62019.gif[/image]




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 10:05:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Reichenberg

If an ASW bomber counts too, my first choice is the Kyushu Q1W1 Tokai:
Talking of the Do17 being ugly....

Uwe


That link's broken...




niceguy2005 -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 10:11:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

And this is the Maryland:



[image]local://upfiles/16369/2736D758DC514F8F821421F6F5C62019.gif[/image]

Actually I think the Maryland isn't THAT bad, though I think Martin might get the award for most ugly bombers produced.

Here's the one I was thinking of...B-10....that turret on the nose looks like a pimple.



[image]local://upfiles/17264/26C1A28608B54F8B8AAE8143474AD978.jpg[/image]




rtrapasso -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/19/2007 10:21:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: String

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mac67

Tupolev TB-3. It must have been damn cold in those open cockpits.



[image]local://upfiles/20097/D39A582F554F4C7A8BF38C9CB0456851.jpg[/image]


Mary Mother of God that is ugly! I think the factory workers should have refused to build it.


It carried up to 4000kg+ of bombs though, and that was back in 1932.. when the B-17 wasn't even on the drawing boards.



Yep - here is a US contemporary of the TB-3/Ant-6: The Curtiss B-2. The TB-3 comes off looking good compared to this. To be fair, the cockpit of the TB-3 was enclosed by the time WW2 came around.

The Soviets had probably the most advanced planes in the world when the TB-3 was first built... but then Stalin went and shot most of his airplane designers, assuring that the Soviet Airforce was no longer in the lead by 1939.

[image]local://upfiles/7543/A0BC143CAC684F94B57A0F5EED3DF630.jpg[/image]




Sonny II -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 12:10:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Tupalov ANT-6

http://www.aviastar.org/air/russia/ant-6.php

http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Aerospace/Tupulov/Aero59G1.htm


Looks like an apartment complex with wings.




cantona2 -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 12:11:52 AM)

Is the Kyushu Q1W1 Tokai a copy of the Dornier?




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 1:01:36 AM)

No.




m10bob -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 1:11:17 AM)

Terminus...a master of overstatement.[8D]




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 1:17:16 AM)

I can't write big fat posts AND write a lot of them. You think 22986 posts just happen by themselves?[:D]




Mynok -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 1:26:01 AM)


No, they are outsourced to elves........ [:D]




rtrapasso -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 2:56:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sonny II


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Tupalov ANT-6

http://www.aviastar.org/air/russia/ant-6.php

http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Aerospace/Tupulov/Aero59G1.htm


Looks like an apartment complex with wings.



Another design contemporary with the Ant-6/TB-3 - The mighty Keystone B-6!!

[image]local://upfiles/7543/39A372234EF74D148909EFB8466D5778.jpg[/image]




rtrapasso -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 3:00:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sonny II


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Tupalov ANT-6

http://www.aviastar.org/air/russia/ant-6.php

http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Aerospace/Tupulov/Aero59G1.htm


Looks like an apartment complex with wings.



Another design contemporary with the Ant-6/TB-3 - The mighty Keystone B-6!!

[image]local://upfiles/7543/39A372234EF74D148909EFB8466D5778.jpg[/image]


Or how about the Handley-Page Hinaidi? Of course, these weren't used as bombers in WW2, but it goes to show beauty is relative... [:D]

[image]local://upfiles/7543/3AF7FD1B1AD24F1BB2B635FF5F656526.jpg[/image]




Terminus -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 3:49:13 AM)

A VERY distant relative, in this case...[:D]




wdolson -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 3:59:09 AM)

Many of the proposals were for obsolete bombers at the beginning of hostilities which was only used on a limited basis.  If the field were limited to aircraft that had any extensive use as a front line bomber, I believe the field would be down to:
B-17
B-24
B-25
SM.79
Martin Maryland
Do-17
Do-217

The Maryland saw little use outside of the Western Desert.

Personally, if this were the field, I could cast my vote for the SM.79, though Italian camo schemes did help to improve the aesthetics to some degree.  Italy was behind the curve in aircraft design for most of the war.  They continued to use open cockpits on their fighhters long past when other powers had gone to fully enclosed cockpits.  The SM.79 was a fabric covered, trimotor design, with external bracing when its contemporaries were mostly all metal (except the Wellington and Mosquito), 2 or 4 engines, and almost all had done away with all external bracing.

The Italians were handicapped with a poor engine industry.  They didn't have any engines with output approaching contemporary levels until they started building Damiler Benz engines under license.  The SM.79 would have been better off with a twin engine arrangement, but the Italians lacked any engines powerful enough to do the job.  They did produce an under powered twin engine version for export.  As far as I know, the only buyer was Iraq.

Most of the Allies badly neglected their militaries during the interwar period.  Civilian aviation in many of these countries was where the money was and both racing and airliner business fueled development.  When war came, these countries had a lot of out of date military equipment still on hand, and/or were stocked with stop gaps they had picked up from other countries.  Because the expertise was there in the civilian sector in the US and Britain, these countries were able to turn their aircraft industry around and build excellent aircraft within a short time of entering the war.  What was on hand at the beginning was a mix of state of the art and a lot of old junk.

The USSR had neglected their aviation industry for a different reason.  Stalin had locked up or shot most of the aircraft designers.  Though the survivors were let out of the gulag and designed some very good aircraft during the war.  Even still, the USSR did have small numbers of some excellent aircraft at the start of the war.  The MiG-3 was one of the best high altitude fighters around at the outbreak of the war.  Though most were lost trying to stem the tide at low altitude where their advantages were negated.  The Sturmovik and Pe-2 were also almost ready or available in small numbers when the war started.

Japan and Germany had a larger number of aesthetically pleasing aircraft at the beginning of the war because both had been building up their air arms with modern aircraft in the couple of years before they got into the conflict.  They had a larger number of newer aircraft on hand, which tended to be more streamlined and used more modern design elements.  Though there were plenty of old aircraft on hand too.  The Hs-123 was a biplane ground attack bomber that served on the Eastern Front until the last of them were grounded due to lack of spares.  Japan was flying the Claude and Nate in many units at the beginning of the war.

Italy went to war long before they were prepared.  Their industry was not up to the demands of a major war and they failed to build enough out of date equipment for their military.  They struggled to bring anything more modern ot the battlefield.

This thread is showing that aesthetics is, at least to some degree, in the eye of the beholder.  I would not consider some of the bombers proposed ugly.  To my eye, the Do-17 and B-25 have a certain grace to them.  The B-17 and B-24 both have their ugly sides, but I wouldn't call them ugly.  But then that's just my opinion.

Bill




MineSweeper -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 4:27:42 AM)

Here is another winner (plain ugly)....they should have been shot down on sight (most likely they were[:D])

French Brequet Bre 413



[image]local://upfiles/22347/7B7A823DC7F94679B7068117280F571C.jpg[/image]




BrucePowers -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 5:23:19 AM)

How a bout the B-18 Bolo. That thing was pretty ugly too.




Reichenberg -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 8:10:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus


quote:

ORIGINAL: Reichenberg

If an ASW bomber counts too, my first choice is the Kyushu Q1W1 Tokai:
Talking of the Do17 being ugly....

Uwe


That link's broken...

Sorry, hopefully this will do:
[image]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Q1W.jpg[/image]
or
[image]http://www.modellbau-universe.de/uploadfiles/preview/pav_l72003.jpg[/image]

Uwe




stevemk1a -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 8:29:33 AM)

From a purely aesthetic point of view I think this is a rather pretty aircraft.



[image]local://upfiles/6080/102E067D45ED4A5087CD05837D0DF0AF.jpg[/image]




cantona2 -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 9:54:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I can't write big fat posts AND write a lot of them. You think 22986 posts just happen by themselves?[:D]

[:D]




castor troy -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 11:47:16 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MineSweeper

Here is another winner (plain ugly)....they should have been shot down on sight (most likely they were[:D])

French Brequet Bre 413



[image]local://upfiles/22347/7B7A823DC7F94679B7068117280F571C.jpg[/image]



is this thing able to fly??? [X(]




Apollo11 -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 12:30:33 PM)

Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: MineSweeper

Here is another winner (plain ugly)....they should have been shot down on sight (most likely they were[:D])

French Brequet Bre 413

[image]local://upfiles/22347/7B7A823DC7F94679B7068117280F571C.jpg[/image]


This one is really plain ugly - YUCK! [:D]


Leo "Apollo11"




Mynok -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 5:18:11 PM)


It looks like a spatula with wings. [X(] [:D]




Ian R -> RE: Ugliest Bomber of WWII (11/20/2007 5:37:36 PM)

Compared to that the Tokai is a lean speed machine[:'(]




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