Fall Weiss (Full Version)

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RtG -> Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 3:58:17 AM)

Hi guys, I've started working on my first scenario, the 1939 invasion of Poland (Fall Weiss). It uses some of Nick69's excellent art work combined with new units with historical names that I'm fine tuning for the scale of the map.

Here's a sneak pic...

[image]http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/2946/fallweisswm3.jpg[/image]



Erik Rutins -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 4:08:17 AM)

Looks very nice! I like what you've done in terms of creating new "battalion units".



Stridor -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 4:40:25 AM)

Yes very nice, looking forward to this one.



leastonh1 -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 12:21:08 PM)

I'm looking forward to playing this one with the new gfx, it looks great so far. Thank RtG! [:)]

Regards,
Jim



MrMox -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 12:34:05 PM)

Yeah, I'd wish a patch would make the new gfx the default graphics for AT. [:)]




PDiFolco -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 1:06:50 PM)

MrMox
You can use Nick69 mod as master when creating randomgames. You can also use it  in scenarios by just changing the masterfile to "real" and saving with another  name. It doesn't work only in scenarios that have scripted weather effects (Russia, Ardennes..).

RtG
I like very much your more realistic OoB (and think that's the real big lack of current scens). Yet I think that in game terms the basic Infantry should be a company - your PzDiv are severely weak in infantry, with "company" size inf they will have 16 or so instead of 4.
About the map, I see you didn't use Nick's towns and swamps, that imho would better fit a realistic map. And was E.Prussia that rural ?




RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 2:56:59 PM)

PDiFolco
I've been scanning through lots of sources trying to pitch it at the right level, I'm not doing a simple rename of rifle to infantry Battalion 

Infantry Division
  - 9 x Infantry Battalion (represents 3 x Infantry Regiments)
  - 3 x Infantry Gun Company
  - 3 x Anti Tank Company
  - 1 x Pioneer Battalion
  - 1 x Recon' Battalion
  - 1 x Artillery Battalion


My thinking on artillery is that their range should be limited to 1 for artillery barrages but that they should provide a high initiative attack to standard land battles if that makes sense. 

Motorised Division
  - 6 x Motor Infantry Battalion (represents 3 x Regiments)
  - 2 x Infantry Gun Company
  - 2 x Anti Tank Company
  - 1 x Artillery Battalion


I think I'll do away with listing trucks seperately and just combine their stats with an infantry btln to make a motor btln. 

Panzer Division
  - 4 x Panzer Battalion
  - 4 x Motor Infantry Battalion
  - 2 x Infantry Gun Company
  - 3 x Anti Tank Company
  - 1 x Pioneer Battalion
  - 1 x Recon' Battalion
  - 1 x Anti-Aircraft Battlion


Do you think it would be better to split the battalions out into companies?



PDiFolco -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 3:19:30 PM)

RtG
Yes, split the inf battn in companies. Sorry for the confusion, your OOBs are correct, my point was that 1xInfantry in the game is really something weak, so I suggest that it would represent a company only.

Else I think you should tweak the figures to have more powerful infantry SF.



EricSilver_MatrixForum -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 3:47:03 PM)

Excellent job, RtG, tell us please when you finish it.

;)



RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 7:33:10 PM)

Ok, I'm changing to company sized units as follows...

[image]http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/6811/germandivisionsug8.jpg[/image]



Banquet -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 8:55:22 PM)

Looks really good RtG! :)



rickier65 -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 9:38:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrMox

Yeah, I'd wish a patch would make the new gfx the default graphics for AT. [:)]




While i like the map mods, I'm actually starting to think the terrain that comes with the basic game works really wel. I"d prefer to keep it as the "standard", particulalry since we can have these ehnanced mods as well.

Rick



Erik Rutins -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 11:16:13 PM)

Hey RtG, are you changing the combat values as well or just renaming (for example) a Rifle to an Infantry Company and a Medium Tank to a Panzer Company? If you are just renaming, you should probably do a few combat balance checks before doing all your TO&Es.



RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 11:21:13 PM)

I'm changing combat values Erik so I'm going to need to do quite a few tests.



PDiFolco -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 11:26:27 PM)

RtG
Well, I've suggested Company size but for Infantry only, now I fear you'll have way too much tanks, and overall too many units...Remember than Lt Tank is power 20 vs Inf 1, and Medium Tk is 40 !
Also, Arty is really rather meant to be independent, else you won't be able to bombard from away, plus as you can see due to their power all of your units show up as "artillery". Lastly about move mode you'll have everyone using "wheeled" that is worse than Tracked if not on roads - unless you give halftracks.

I'd settle for stg like this
Panzer Div :
15 x Inf Coys (3 more to account for higher level platoons)
1x MG and 1xMortar or IG to represent the HW platoons
2 x Halftrack or Truck to move them
4 x Lt Tank (Panzer) Battalions, or maybe 6 to take into account bigger German tank Coys (each bn had up to 60 tanks, with 4 coys per bn where other nations had 3)
1 x AC (recce) Bn
4 x Scouts Coys (Motorcycle Bn)
3 x Pioneer Coys
1 x Flak Coy - but I'm not sure PzDiv had much AA assets at that time

Then 2 x Art Bn + 1x Truck as a separate unit.

This would IMHO better stay with AT "standard rates" for units. But that's your mod... (in fact I'm wanting to make a "more historical" formation database, but didn't find the time and will, so I'm hijacking RtG... sorry ! [&o])







Westheim -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 11:48:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrMox

Yeah, I'd wish a patch would make the new gfx the default graphics for AT. [:)]


Oh, please, dear god, no! [X(] I really don't like these graphics mods that grow everywhere. The basic graphics are so nice and simple.

By the way, I think this could be a very interesting scenario, although fictional.



RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/19/2007 11:49:22 PM)

How dare you! ;) that's fine PDi, I welcome the input. Personally I want it to be as historically accurate as possible and so I'm going to rebalance the units so you don't need to worry about overpowered tanks.

Here's an example of the Polish unit pics...

[image]http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/84/polishexampleos3.jpg[/image]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_10th_Motorized_Cavalry_Brigade



PDiFolco -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/20/2007 12:28:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Westheim

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrMox

Yeah, I'd wish a patch would make the new gfx the default graphics for AT. [:)]


Oh, please, dear god, no! [X(] I really don't like these graphics mods that grow everywhere. The basic graphics are so nice and simple.

By the way, I think this could be a very interesting scenario, although fictional.


There's only 1 terrain mod done and it's just gorgeous...
And Germany DID indeed invade Poland (t'was 1939, Sept 1), it's not fictional ! [X(]



Erik Rutins -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/20/2007 1:51:18 AM)

RtG,

That's looking fantastic - if you come up with a good system there for rebalanced units and formations, I'm sure a lot of other designers will follow your lead.

Regards,

- Erik



Captain Cruft -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/20/2007 3:02:31 AM)

Great stuff!

I think it's important for people to realise that they can create realistic OOBs, but in order to do that the combat parameters may have to change. That's the beauty of the system, it's completely flexible, but there may be a lot of work involved to get things right for each scenario or set of scenarios.



Westheim -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/20/2007 7:51:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PDiFolco


quote:

ORIGINAL: Westheim

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrMox

Yeah, I'd wish a patch would make the new gfx the default graphics for AT. [:)]


Oh, please, dear god, no! [X(] I really don't like these graphics mods that grow everywhere. The basic graphics are so nice and simple.

By the way, I think this could be a very interesting scenario, although fictional.


There's only 1 terrain mod done and it's just gorgeous...
And Germany DID indeed invade Poland (t'was 1939, Sept 1), it's not fictional ! [X(]



[sm=00000007.gif] In my mind, I was still at the Czechoslovakian scenario, which's thread I read before. Sorry.[X(]
But my opinions about graphic mods are still standing. And there's more than one. There's this basically white thing, too. I wish I would memorize user names, but ... [8D]



RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/25/2007 12:25:02 PM)

Map...

[image]http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6753/mapav6.jpg[/image]



rickier65 -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/25/2007 1:29:55 PM)

Very nice, I'm looking forward to this.

Rick



Erik Rutins -> RE: Fall Weiss (11/25/2007 3:04:03 PM)

Excellent, bring it on! [8D]



RtG -> RE: Fall Weiss (12/2/2007 12:28:28 PM)

Haven't had much time to work on this in the past week but it's in the unit balance phase and here's another screenshot...

[image]http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/450/samplebattlexx5.jpg[/image]



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