combined movement (Full Version)

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argaur -> combined movement (12/13/2007 10:49:58 AM)

How is combined movement between allies done?



bresh -> RE: combined movement (12/13/2007 12:51:15 PM)

You have to lend units to one power, i belive.

Regards
Bresh



Marshall Ellis -> RE: combined movement (12/13/2007 3:51:36 PM)

That is correct. You must use the loaned corps function where you loan one MP's corps to another.



argaur -> RE: combined movement (12/13/2007 4:30:16 PM)

and can you return them whenever you want? there is a time limit on the loan?



Marshall Ellis -> RE: combined movement (12/13/2007 4:39:20 PM)

Monthly. All loaned units should be automatically returned at the beginning of each diplomacy phase.

(Woops, Thank you ++ Richard!)




Frank McNally -> RE: combined movement (12/14/2007 8:39:04 PM)

So does this also allow leaders to be loaned?  Also how are PP awarded for these loaned corps?  Are there any protections against a backstab in their use, e.g. a suicide attack or forced march into bad forage?



fvianello -> RE: combined movement (1/3/2008 5:59:10 PM)

The Political Points ditribution is an open question for me too....If I loan some corps to an ally and he wins a battle, do I get my share of PPs ?



Grognot -> RE: combined movement (1/3/2008 10:50:56 PM)

Tested.  Leaders cannot be loaned.  They will be detached from any loaned corps.  There are no additional restrictions over movement or attacks, although the loaned corps does not get any additional access rights from the borrower.

You should bear in mind, however, that the game can be fairly long, and somebody you backstab can rebuild.



DCWhitworth -> RE: combined movement (1/3/2008 11:32:42 PM)

Not much point in lending leaders anyway. Rules 13.8.6 - "The leader commanding the whole army must be a leader of the phasing Major Power."



zaquex -> RE: combined movement (1/4/2008 12:17:21 AM)

Dont know how it works in the computer game but for the board game the lending of french leaders to for example spain or turkey was a major thing, i would assume that a corp with a leader borrowed to another nation would be concidered part of the borrowers army much as the corp and therefore be a leader of the phasing power. At least thats the implementation i would like to see.

At least until combined movement can be fixed fully to be inline with the original game.

Guess i need to test this.



megalomania2003 -> RE: combined movement (1/4/2008 10:20:31 PM)

And what about Prussia lending corps to Austria, while Austria and not Prussia (enforced peace) is at war with France. Could the corps being lent to Austria fight France?????



Grognot -> RE: combined movement (1/4/2008 10:26:53 PM)

They're not going to fight unless they have a DoW.  Doesn't matter if others in the same province have a DoW.



zaquex -> RE: combined movement (1/5/2008 12:13:46 AM)

In the boardgame, where you not allowed to borrow ONE corp to an ally without being at war who could be used by him as his own? Or was that a house rule of ours??

Also a clarification how the game treats borrowed leaders would be nice

thanks

z



Grognot -> RE: combined movement (1/5/2008 12:45:07 AM)

There was no loaning of anything except money in the board game, other than for a corps on loan as a result of a surrender -- in which case it was treated as one belonging to the victor for the duration of the loan including with movement and wars (well, mostly -- factors aren't exchangeable, et al).

If you wanted a voluntarily multinational force to attack together, they -had- to use combined movement, in the last of the allies' phases.  Regardless of whether or not they were using combined movement, the leader of an allied force was always chosen from the ally with the most corps present.

EiANW does not handle borrowed leaders, since it does not let you lend leaders.  On the attack, IIRC, it requires that the leader be from the phasing side (which would ordinarily be the case, save for naval battles with involving an alliance with a non-phasing Nelson on a British fleet already co-existing with a mutual enemy in the same sea zone, or for assaults with an allied leader already present in one of two sides).  I haven't tested what happens if allies are attacked (and therefore none of them are the phasing player).



zaquex -> RE: combined movement (1/5/2008 1:22:29 AM)

House rule it was then...



dodod -> RE: combined movement (1/5/2008 3:53:25 AM)

does anyone know the effect of political points with loaned corp in victory and defeat??



yammahoper -> RE: combined movement (1/5/2008 8:26:29 PM)

I always prefered that leaders not be lendable.  Nothing worse than finding the games best generals defending rinkydink minors half way across the world.  Second, while normally a nusiance only, there are times when a lent leader has a major impact on the game, like dropping Wellington on the Swedish Corps.  A large (more than one corp) army with normal morale levels and a 5/5 leader?  Russia better come strong, and will still have an equal chance of losing many battles.  That means Russia has to swarm this nation with 40+ factors for a good chance to eliminate the force before it gets eco phases in for additional infantry...point is, this impacts the entire political balance of the game...for a minor (yes, sweden is the best of the minors, but still and minor).

Not to mention leader deaths.  Can't you just see Nappy dieing to defend Naples, and not bringing French Troops?  You want a leader on a minor corp, declare war.  Then the minors corps are your corps, and you can do anything you want with it, including putting a leader on it.

This game aint for the faint hearted, lol.

yamma



Spartan07 -> RE: combined movement (1/6/2008 1:48:58 AM)

I have heard that there is a bug when loaning troops to Prussia. Is this the case and what are the details?



CapnKnuck -> RE: combined movement (1/11/2008 7:54:03 PM)

The mechanics of loaning corps is substantially different than combined movement, which I believe to be fundamentally core to an effective defense against a strong France...or a weak France for that matter.  Loaning corps just doesn't cut it.

Given France either moves before everyone or after everyone, Matrix, has to work towards the true version of combined movement.  I don't realistically see Austria and Prussia fending off a fully mobilised France without combining movement.   Does MatrixGames have any plans to developing combined movement for future patches?

Thanks,
The Cap'n



iamspamus -> RE: combined movement (1/13/2008 3:51:03 AM)

This is aproblem, but having started the game 4 or 5 times since I started, a bigger issue is that Prussia and Austria have gone to war every time...It's hard for them to even get to the point of needing combined movement if they're at war. In one game, Prussia was a war with EVERY COUNTRY except Turkey. Crazy. Oh and they were ahead on VPs. They were going after German minors with dip and conquest, while Austria and Spain continued to fight over two or three.

AI fixed...yep, on the "to do" list!
Jason

quote:

ORIGINAL: CapnKnuck

The mechanics of loaning corps is substantially different than combined movement, which I believe to be fundamentally core to an effective defense against a strong France...or a weak France for that matter.  Loaning corps just doesn't cut it.

Given France either moves before everyone or after everyone, Matrix, has to work towards the true version of combined movement.  I don't realistically see Austria and Prussia fending off a fully mobilised France without combining movement.   Does MatrixGames have any plans to developing combined movement for future patches?

Thanks,
The Cap'n




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