WitP Tracker: a new WitP Tool in the works (Full Version)

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floydg -> WitP Tracker: a new WitP Tool in the works (12/15/2007 12:41:18 AM)

Hello there.

Myself and n01487477 (Damian) have been working on a new tool to help playing this game. We felt that the game and other tools available just didn't give us the information the way we wanted to see it. So as a way to experiment with Java programming and for general amusement, we have embarked on this project.

The tool is still being worked on, but we wanted to share what we have so far to get comments and to help direct us further.

The tool is currently called WitPTracker and is being written in Java and directly reads the save game files for all of its information.

In the next few posts, I'll describe some screens and then later on, Damian will describe some plans for production information.

Comments and suggestions are always welcome. We hope to have something released and usable in the coming weeks (depending on our vacation schedules).

Thanks,

Floyd (and Damian)



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Devices (12/15/2007 12:42:47 AM)

The first screen shows the device database. Not so interesting, but it gets better...



[image]local://upfiles/12459/A1C7FD6347894CBFA006B287D5BC3798.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Aircraft (12/15/2007 12:44:57 AM)

Information about the aircraft in the game. We're also planning a screen which will compare aircraft head-to-head (for upgrade decisions, etc).


[image]local://upfiles/12459/6BD7A1F3EF7040A5BFA33FBCAC10E66B.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Bases (12/15/2007 12:48:49 AM)

This is the beginning of the information about bases. More details are planned to be added.


[image]local://upfiles/12459/1AD08EEA4C4B40129F5E0CDDD7A98BCE.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Regions (12/15/2007 12:52:20 AM)

The bases are assigned to a region. The regions can be defined by the user and the bases assigned as they like.


[image]local://upfiles/12459/1CEC3A2B994547E28DE4BFB0FF66E3EF.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Ship Classes (12/15/2007 12:53:44 AM)

This screen shows the ship classes.


[image]local://upfiles/12459/1DE05CB341E34E1E909931032CD435C9.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Ship Upgrades (12/15/2007 12:56:02 AM)

To manage your upgrades, you can see what's coming any time, what's overdue or what's coming in the next month or two months. Selecting an upgrade shows how it's different than the previous class.


[image]local://upfiles/12459/9DB4FDAAD32947BDA0677D9F9F5578BB.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Ship Repairs (1) (12/15/2007 12:59:52 AM)

This is the main reason I started working on this tool - to track the repairs on my ships. I have so many little pieces of paper with this stuff it started to get crazy.
This screen shows a list of all damaged ships and where they are. You can select a ship and it will show the history of its damage and repairs. A red arrow indicates damaged increased and a green arrow indicates repair. This ship shown took a torpedo by Midway... (it later sunk).



[image]local://upfiles/12459/962DF5650CBD4474B416EA856E9E153B.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker: Ship Repairs (2) (12/15/2007 1:02:12 AM)

The same screen, just a different view. This one shows ports and how many ships are in each being repaired (only damaged ships shown). You can "expand" a port and it shows the ships inside. This screen will also have the history information, but I'm still working on it.


[image]local://upfiles/12459/A38B525F5BA5417B849286098086D0DE.jpg[/image]



floydg -> WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 1:07:16 AM)

That's the last screen I prepared. There are some others still in the works.



n01487477 -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 1:51:44 AM)

Floyd is being modest, most of the above work is his, but let me outline some of the groovy ideas we have:- yes we have the data!

Let me say at the outset that the other tools available are all excellent and an inspiration to us both, but they also didn't implement a lot of the data or use the data in a way we wanted ... This tool hopes to fill that gap by providing overviews, better histories,warnings and micro management.

NB* most will work for both Allies and Japan. We don't have a definitive list but these are just off the top of my head ...

1. Pilot tracking - experience etc
2. Leaders a)Leader search for all military forces.
3. Plane Groups - (see next post)
a) history & summary - all + tracking experience !!
b) also plane groups on ships, like CV's plus SS's etc.
c) Search for subs/ ships with search capability.
d) pilots history also included here
4. Overview of plane production -
a)with warnings and general details( still in the works see below)
b)plane micro view showing production by base .
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=1591068
c) by plane http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=1579085
d) see also http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=1579084
e) engines - linked into TBO and air groups, to determine production size requirement.
5. Production - many views :-
a)History of res, supply, etc overview and by area and by base
b)logistics requirements - so a quick summary of each area and what is needed each day / month. inc. transports going to ...
c)expansion of factory/building/repairing - whether they are on/off and history of expansion
d)by area and base production and need.
e) calculator to determine how much you can or should build ...
e) supplies/res/oil en route by transports and days till arrival
6.LCU tracking :-
a) reinforcement - manpower and equip (hist)
b) devices supply and use / need
c) reinforcement on/off
d) supply warnings etc
7. Ships sunk, totals
8. Ship production calculator, using points to determine how much and what you should build, or accelerate.
9. Not yet determined, but I'd like to show intel/combat reports data.
10. General warnings and quick summary pages, to show what you need to do each turn, sort of a to do list ...
11. The idea is to be macro and micro, dive deeper and you have the info, or just have a quick look and see what is happening
Some of our ideas are already shown in my AAR, others are just a matter of coding ... or in Floyd and my mind ready for expression ... any other ideas are welcome ...

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=1579074
screen below is in the works, but shows a summary of planes and their production, arrivals, losses, group reinforcement need, next grp arriving and then there will be a quick warning of any probs
[image]local://upfiles/19798/2C39184D2CE54E28B27F0EBC5AF6DB95.jpg[/image]



n01487477 -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 2:16:57 AM)

Another screen of air groups, showing a summary of how many, what they are doing, and those understrength etc ...

[image]local://upfiles/19798/2168111E68B5493592652D951CCB26DE.jpg[/image]



Honda -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 2:25:59 AM)

I never was a fan of those "steroid" tools in WitP but I sure could use some kind of a tracker for my airgroups and, most of all, aces. Something to spice up the AAR with :)



FeurerKrieg -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 3:27:22 AM)

Nice work guys.

I'm a big user of Woos utility, but you have some nice ideas. The only problem for me is that given that I use Bodhi's utility for the intel/ops/battle tracking, Woos for naval search, upgrades and production - I don't know if I will have time for another thing to load and save each turn.

Would be nice if y'all could get together and build one program with the best elements of each.

Or better yet - if the AE team folded in some of these types of reports/screens into the main game interface.



USSAmerica -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 6:03:59 AM)

You guys have some really good ideas.  I love the Port view of the Ship Repairs data. 

Keep up the good work, and keep having fun with it!  [8D]



Roger Neilson II -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 9:40:05 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Feurer Krieg

Nice work guys.

I'm a big user of Woos utility, but you have some nice ideas. The only problem for me is that given that I use Bodhi's utility for the intel/ops/battle tracking, Woos for naval search, upgrades and production - I don't know if I will have time for another thing to load and save each turn.

Would be nice if y'all could get together and build one program with the best elements of each.

Or better yet - if the AE team folded in some of these types of reports/screens into the main game interface.

These all do look very good, but I feel now is the time to have all the 'trackers' converging into AE as well. The work you guys do, and Woos and Bodhi is very much appreciated.

Roger



n01487477 -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 10:09:25 AM)

I appreciate the postings, and I know that all people want, are better info charts/tables within WITP. Yesterday when they revealed on the live chat that there would be more additions made in this area, I was happy ... but also concerned that it would be a half measure...

We know this tracker maybe going the way of the Dodo, but we wanted our ideas to be heard and seen. We are going to continue with this project, refine it, and have version 1 available in Jan (we hope) for a few months of game time before AE ...

This is not about the project anymore, but more about what should be made available within WITP, ALL the info is there ... available, let's implement it in a really positive and helpful way ...

Not just as sheets of info, but as something that can give the user help in making decisions and uncovering the fog of the industrial / logistics war.

If ideas are worth fighting for ... then this is my fight.



kafka -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 10:57:41 AM)

great work, thank you!



VSWG -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 1:46:45 PM)

In the ship classes screen, can you add the number of all ships of this class present on the map, and how many will still arrive (and when)?

This looks awesome, I'm looking forward to its release! 



ny59giants -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/15/2007 8:39:48 PM)

Damian,
I know you use and/or know about woos utility, I don't. But as an Allied player with one game of RHS underway, I need something to manage the Allied economy broken down into areas - USA/Canada, Australia, New Zealand, India/Burma, China, and Russia. It's hard to get a handle on them when it is combined as one when they are not depended on each other.
If you haven't done so, download it onto your shiny new laptop and take a look at level 7. [:D]



n01487477 -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 6:57:15 AM)

I haven't tried RHS, but believe that this can work within that framework / mod.
Bit daunted by all the different scenarios, but will download and play with it to see if this is a possibility...
Got to get to programming now, so hopefully, I can get the plane production screen completed ... and screen shots later today.



viberpol -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 12:24:49 PM)

Some really nice idaes...
Great stuff.

Where we can get it for testing? [;)]



floydg -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 3:42:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477

I haven't tried RHS, but believe that this can work within that framework / mod.
Bit daunted by all the different scenarios, but will download and play with it to see if this is a possibility...
Got to get to programming now, so hopefully, I can get the plane production screen completed ... and screen shots later today.


Since this program reads everything from the save game file, I see no reason why it wouldn't work for all scenarios and all mods. My testing has been with a stock scenario and Damian is using BigB. We're also using both Allies and Japan, so it should work for both sides.
Also, the bits that show the ship and plane sides come from the ART folder, so whatever art you have installed should be shown.

Floyd



castor troy -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 4:27:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: floydg

quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477

I haven't tried RHS, but believe that this can work within that framework / mod.
Bit daunted by all the different scenarios, but will download and play with it to see if this is a possibility...
Got to get to programming now, so hopefully, I can get the plane production screen completed ... and screen shots later today.


Since this program reads everything from the save game file, I see no reason why it wouldn't work for all scenarios and all mods. My testing has been with a stock scenario and Damian is using BigB. We're also using both Allies and Japan, so it should work for both sides.
Also, the bits that show the ship and plane sides come from the ART folder, so whatever art you have installed should be shown.

Floyd



please make the installation of the programm as easy as possible for dumb users like me...



jwilkerson -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 6:23:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Feurer Krieg

Nice work guys.

I'm a big user of Woos utility, but you have some nice ideas. The only problem for me is that given that I use Bodhi's utility for the intel/ops/battle tracking, Woos for naval search, upgrades and production - I don't know if I will have time for another thing to load and save each turn.

Would be nice if y'all could get together and build one program with the best elements of each.

Or better yet - if the AE team folded in some of these types of reports/screens into the main game interface.


Adding lots of stuff like is in WOOS tool to the game interface, is not hard, but it would be very time consuming. So much so, that simplistically speaking, we could either have this, or have the enhancements we got, but not both. And we said, hey this already exists, and people like it, and it is far less work to intergrate it in, than to build it again, so it seemed like a no brainer to go the way we are going.

The issue will be that the new save file will not be as open to all as it is now, so it will be problematic to switch over all of the existing utilities.



Roger Neilson II -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 7:04:42 PM)

I'm not quite sure I'm reading this correctly, can you please confirm.....

1. AE will not allow any of the Bodhi, Woos, or this interface to interface with it?
2. AE will have something based upon stuff (Bodhi/Woos) that already exists?
3. AE would allow people to create interfaces like this, but by being allowed into the 'black box'?

Or is it that really you aren't sure yourselves yet given where you are in the project?

I did catch a posting from WOOS shortly after news broke on the AE edition that suggested he was in fact working within the development or alongside it..... but he's not listed as part of the team.

I'm just seeking clarification for people and especially for the guys doing all this work outside of the AE team.

Roger



VSWG -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 7:06:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Roger Neilson II

I'm not quite sure I'm reading this correctly, can you please confirm.....

1. AE will not allow any of the Bodhi, Woos, or this interface to interface with it?

Bodhi's tool is based on the txt-files, not the save game, so it will work with AE, too.



VSWG -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 7:08:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Roger Neilson II

I did catch a posting from WOOS shortly after news broke on the AE edition that suggested he was in fact working within the development or alongside it..... but he's not listed as part of the team.

He's in the list.



Nomad -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 7:08:35 PM)

A modified Bodhi's should work with no problem, his uses the text files that are generated when the turn is run. No need to get into the program for that. Woos does get into the savegame file, good to know he is on the inside this time. I'm sure his current utility would not work with AE.

Darn, I need to learn to type faster. [:(][;)]



Roger Neilson II -> RE: WitP Tracker... (12/16/2007 7:09:03 PM)

Ok, that's useful to know, but I foresee a situation where running a game I'll have Bodhi's tool running, Woos tool running plus this new one...... all this begs for one comprehensive pulling together - I know, I know, time, resources, ability to programme. I look at the guys doing this in amazement - I last did some programming in the 1980s using machine code.

Roger



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