ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (Full Version)

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Agrippa -> ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 1:50:58 AM)

Hi,

Just wondered if anyone could help me decide on what game to buy next. I have been lookin at 'Tin Soldiers', Panzer Leader, and Modern Close Combat.

Thanks



Gem35 -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 1:58:23 AM)

War in the pacific, the struggle against Japan. [;)]



V22 Osprey -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 2:11:47 AM)

Panzer Command and Close Combat Modern Tactics.Those were the ones I would recommend.But I see you were looking at those already so you should get them [;)] Remember:Follow your first mind.



Agrippa -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 2:35:11 AM)

Is the new Panzer Command a stand lone, or should I start with the Winter one?  Is it worth it to get both?



ravinhood -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 3:21:01 AM)

Get both Panzer COmmands (you get more maps and it costs less overall buying the bundle and Tin Soldiers:Caesar at least, KOIOS are the best developers Matrixgames has right now (well maybe a close tie with Western Civilization develper ERIC BABE and Gil R. the great PR man ;) as well and their excellent Forge of Freedom Civil War game). haha (ducking from the grogs that are going to fire at me on this). :)



V22 Osprey -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 3:25:31 AM)

What ravin said.Get both.I'm going to wait until a couple of patches come out for PC:K or a newer version so atleast some of bugs will be fixed.But since you have the chance to get them both at a discounted price,I would get them now.



Hertston -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 7:28:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Agrippa
Just wondered if anyone could help me decide on what game to buy next. I have been lookin at 'Tin Soldiers', Panzer Leader, and Modern Close Combat.


To be honest I couldn't really recommend Modern Tactics unless you are already a big Close Combat fan. Get Cross of Iron of the two, if you don't already have it. I'm not normally one to bang on about 'immersion' but to me the generic (and campaign-free) approach of Modern Tactics is its antithesis. You can't go wrong with the Koios stuff, though.

Other than that, it depends on what sort of thing you like. I'd heartily recommend HttR and CotA, TOAW3, Tiller's Campaign Series, WitP, Flashpoint Germany and the CE version of Harpoon in particular but it all depends on what sort of virtual war you fancy fighting, what stye of game you like and how much time you may or may not have to play it.



Gil R. -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 8:06:57 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

Get bot Panzer COmmands (you get more maps and it costs less overall buying the bundle and Tin Soldiers:Caesar at least, KOIOS are the best developers Matrixgames has right now (well maybe a close tie with Western Civilization develper Gil as well and their excellent Forge of Freedom Civil War game). haha (ducking from the grogs that are going to fire at me on this). :)



Ravinhood,
Thanks for your comments, but credit for being the developer belongs to Eric Babe, who does most of the designing and all of the programming. Me, I just edit generals' bios and give often incorrect answers to customers' questions, so I'm more visible...



cdbeck -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 6:17:38 PM)

Advanced Tactics, best game in the Matrix library, bar none. Simple, fun, easily moddable, endless amount of player made scenarios on the horizon. It can be both a TOAW like wargame or an Empire or Command:HQ style wargame with exploration and tech development.

I am hearing great things about PC:Kharkov. Check here and at www.wargamer.com to get impressions on this reasonably priced new release.

SoM



BvB -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/12/2008 11:59:56 PM)

I second the vote for Advance Tactics... a lot of replay value, random map games, historical games, ability for plenty of player designs, multiplayer, reasonable AI, some great historical scenarios being published to do various WWII theaters ground, air, land... particularly the eastern front ones with decent OB.  And easier to play than plotting moves as in WIR or WITP... easy to learn without even reading the rules but hard to master... Baron von Beergut BvB



ravinhood -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 12:51:20 AM)

I 3rd the vote for Advanced Tactics as it is what I would call "Empire Deluxe" on monster steroids even Barry Bonds couldn't handle. ;) It has random battle generator and the AI is pretty good. Everyone should have it in their library (if they can afford it or it's the right price ;) ) along with the ones already mentioned. Once you start playing the Panzer Command series it may be hard for you to break away to anything else. ;)



V22 Osprey -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 12:58:47 AM)

quote:

Once you start playing the Panzer Command series it may be hard for you to break away to anything else. ;)



I have Winter Storm,yes it was a little difficult to break that is until I found SPWAW.[;)]



Grell -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 2:34:21 PM)

I will always suggest John Tiller's Battleground Civil War and J T's Battleground Napoleonic Wars. They both have alot of games within them.

Regards,

Grell



Hertston -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 5:17:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BvB

And easier to play than plotting moves as in WIR or WITP... easy to learn without even reading the rules but hard to master...


Except supply; read zook08's article in the AT forum if nothing else, else you won't have a clue what's going on. It helped me a lot, anyway.




JudgeDredd -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 5:58:01 PM)

Well, I couldn't recommend Tin Soldiers Julius Ceasar for the simply reason that I recently bought it based on one particular posters recommendations and I don't like it.

If you're into ancients and into boardgames on computers and into linear play on small maps with relatively few tactical movement opportunities, then it could be up your street.

I also noticed some very strange AI behaviour....sure mounted AI units moving were moving to my rear down the flanks...but they were going after the initial objective, which I had already taken.

Personally, I like my computer games to be just that. If I wanted to play a boardgame, I would buy one. I also like my games to fford me the opportunity to manouvre tactically.

Of course, these things may well be up your street in which case I'm sure it will be a sound buy.

Of the 3 you've choosen, if you are looking for one of those, then I'd have to recommend Panzer Command:Kharkov (which is a stand alone game, btw)...although I haven't played it much past the tutorial. I was never a big fan of the Close Combat series after the second one.

Advanced Tactics....I keep hearing that. I am certainly in the minority when I say I just can't get into that game. I've fired it up and played it several times, only to shelve it again.

Just can't get on with it.



Agrippa -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 6:24:50 PM)

I'm thinking the Panzer Leader sounds interesting, and will probably go in that direction.  CC has been a favorite of mine for years, but I think it's time for something different.  I like the scale and the real time play of CC.  Most real time games try to race at an unrealistic pace, but CC has a very realistic feel.  The AI is not so great, but playing H-to-H is great!  Is Panzer Leader better playing the AI or H-to-H?

Thanks to all!



JudgeDredd -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 6:32:09 PM)

Do you mean Panzer Command? If so, I don't know...this is the first one I picked up...I didn't have Operation Winter Storm (the first one) and I'm not a big head to head player anyway, so someone else more qualified to answer will have to step in m8.



cdbeck -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/13/2008 8:46:00 PM)

From the PC:Winter Storm demo, I can tell you that the AI is rather good. I was doing really well, killed tons of soviet tanks and men, until at the very end a hidden Anti-Tank gun wiped out my entire armored force. I ended the demo with a marginal loss. Blast! I hear people are even having trouble beating the AI in the PC:Kharkov TUTORIAL, so there is some quality AI there.

If you like Close Combat, I would say that Panzer Command is right up your alley. To me (and I don't own either PC yet, going from WS demo) it looks like Combat Mission but plays with some of the simplicity of Close Combat. I did not care for Combat Mission, I found it slow paced, tons of micromanagement, and unwieldy. The WS demo is not like that at all. With the addition of smoke in Kharkov, the tactical movements and options are now going to be rather similar to CC. The only major difference is that your artillery and mortars are off-the-map assests (at least in WS demo) that you have to use on-map troops to sight. Another nice CC-like element is the campaigns, where your forces survive from one to the next.

JD may be in the minority regarding Advanced Tactics, but his objection is relatively valid. With the random maps of AT, you will find that there is very little direction other than self-set goals. If you want a clear order of battle, a pre-defined force, and realistic, scenario set objectives, AT is NOT the game for you (so, as a CC fan, this may be the case). It plays more like Civ (or Empire from the old days), where you get to set research goals, war goals, decide the composition and manufacture of EVERY force on your side, and have to deal with supply and command logistics.

SoM



BvB -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/14/2008 2:47:48 AM)

JD may be in the minority regarding Advanced Tactics, but his objection is relatively valid. With the random maps of AT, you will find that there is very little direction other than self-set goals. If you want a clear order of battle, a pre-defined force, and realistic, scenario set objectives, AT is NOT the game for you (so, as a CC fan, this may be the case). It plays more like Civ (or Empire from the old days), where you get to set research goals, war goals, decide the composition and manufacture of EVERY force on your side, and have to deal with supply and command logistics.

SoM

If you are talking the games of random maps yes, but how can you say AT is no good with the historical scenarios? Look at the one Cpt Cruft put out with a very detailed WWII OB of the Russian Front at division level with exact tank and aircraft types instead of the normal game generic ones? (Ostfront) The game has such flexibility for scenario design without getting as complicated as TOAW.



Zap -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/14/2008 2:55:38 AM)

I was looking at AT, the lack of historic based scenarios put me off. AN increase in those would change my mind



BvB -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/14/2008 3:04:40 AM)

http://www.advancedtactics.org/scenariobank.php

Go to their website for various scenario downloads or some at the matrix forum.    Many East Front, a WWI, some westfront, Med, north africa, Italy, pacific, etc scenarios available there



Hertston -> RE: ADVICE ON WHAT TO BUY (4/14/2008 3:19:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Son_of_Montfort

I hear people are even having trouble beating the AI in the PC:Kharkov TUTORIAL, so there is some quality AI there.


Not really. The AI is decent enough, don't get me wrong, but it's the set-up in 'boot camp' scenario that was mentioned that makes it difficult, not the AI. It's no problem once you actually realize its sole purpose is to teach you how and when to use smoke properly.



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