What's Happening With Retirements? (Full Version)

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DreamTeams -> What's Happening With Retirements? (5/11/2008 10:55:11 AM)

I'm noticing rash of retirements for players who are not playing into their 30's. Here's an example of one team. The Makos lost the following players after last season...

Peppercorn RB (age 30) played 3 seasons
Kennedy QB (age 28) played 3 seasons
Clay WR (age 28) played 3 seasons
Flethcer RB (age 26) played 1 season

Basically the team was gutted of it's best offensive players. As you can see most retired before hitting age 30.

Is this normal (NFL wise) for players to retire in their late 20's. I'm not sure why MF is not more tollerant to keep good players around well into their 30's. But, from what I've heard retirement is random. I thought this was improved in the latest version.



David Winter -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/11/2008 11:06:50 AM)

Retirement is not random. The chance of a player ending his career in his first season was reduced but the basic process has always stayed the same.

Players leave leagues for many reasons. Many players are one-hit-wonders. Many other players go to other leagues, some are suspended, and heck some end up in jail (extreme example I know, but it happens). The game simply says 'retirement' but the end result is the same. The player is no longer available to play in the league.

thanks



DreamTeams -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/11/2008 6:16:24 PM)

Hmmm. Glad to hear that it's not random. However, my main concern is that it seems that players are not playing into their 30's. It strikes me as odd that all four of these players (all solid players) would retire at the same time; at or before hitting age 30. This is just a single example. I have other teams that are experiencing the same thing. Solid players hanging it up before age 30. I understand that the average NFL career lasts four seasons, I think. But, I'm hoping that MF will also produce some Joe Montana or Brett Farve situations where some players play into their 30's.

Well, I'm only into my fourth season and will see how it develops over time.



dreamtheatervt -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/11/2008 8:00:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamTeams

Peppercorn RB (age 30) played 3 seasons
Kennedy QB (age 28) played 3 seasons
Clay WR (age 28) played 3 seasons
Flethcer RB (age 26) played 1 season


I want to preface this by saying I have no idea how the retirement system in the game works.

I just realized that the players age and seasons accrewed are really off. Most players start pro careers around 22 years old, assuming 4 years of college ball. Peppercorn was a 27 year old rookie...that might explain the short career. I don't know if age is tied into retirement at all, but if it is that might be the culprit. I'll quote my own thread (saw the other one first):

quote:

Career lengths in the NFL are usually determined by the teams rather than the player. Most players who "retire" that early retire uncerimoniously after being cut in camp, which really skews the "4 year career" average the NFL always talks about. Players 48-53 on the roster are usually "interchangable parts"; a 5th receiver, 4th TB, or a 3rd string LB who plays special teams, someone which can be replaced by someone cheaper and of equal ability next year by a street FA.

In general starters retire due to age (Farve), a serious injury (David Pollack), or a series of nagging injuries; most other people are forced out of the league because they can't find a team willing to take them.


I guess the system still needs tweeked.



Tullius -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/11/2008 11:06:53 PM)

quote:

Many other players go to other leagues, some are suspended, and heck some end up in jail (extreme example I know, but it happens).


The first is a reality in the CFL because most player want to play in the NFL and gain a higher pay check. The other reasons are well published but should have not really a statistical relevance.



DONMVP -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/12/2008 12:06:45 AM)

Gee i might go and reset all my players to 20 or 21 yrs old so i can get some use out of them , if i ever get a league past the first season , lol .



garysorrell -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/12/2008 12:47:42 AM)

I know DreamTeams is prepping for season 4, but has anyone gone beyond that? Im going to sim a league thru 10 seasons and see what the retirements look like.



mbsports -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (5/31/2008 5:08:09 PM)

One thing that you might want to do is to go into the DB using Access or OpenDB and simply resurrect those retirements once in awhile.  I've found they do tend to happen with a regularity that is a little more then what should be called for.  While the NFL Average is 4 years as has been pointed out the washouts usually last 1 year which skews it greatly.  That isn't being taken into account I don't think.



micvik -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (6/1/2008 4:14:20 AM)

I have simmed up to 11 seasons numerous times and have found this is an annoying issue. The career paths vary in such weird ways. You have star players retiring (for a reason other than a career ending injury) in their prime too often (it happens in real life but this seems entirely too much). The other big issue is the age of generated rookies most rookies are well into their mid twenties. This is also an issue at the college level where many freshmen are 21 of 22 years of age.



hack153 -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (6/1/2008 6:01:54 AM)

doesn't JDs Database editor allow you to adjust retirements?



BigSmooth -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (6/1/2008 8:20:09 PM)

The NFLPA did a 10 year study on the career length of players.

RBs- 2.57 years
WRs-2.81 years
CBs- 2.94 years
QBs- 4.44 years
K/P- 4.87 years
 
I don't know how the database figures retirement, but it should figure an average lenth of a players career unique to their position, then a probability (which gets smaller every successive year) that the player wants to extend his career by another year. Sooner or later the players skills will diminish to the point that even if they want to play another year, they will get cut in training camp.



David Winter -> RE: What's Happening With Retirements? (6/1/2008 8:37:41 PM)

For those that are interested there is a table in the database called Player_PotentialSA. In that table is a field called MaximumSeasons. When a player is generated, a value(pretty much just a weighted random number) is stored in that table. When the end season process takes place a couple of different things kick a player into retirement. Injuries are one, age is another, and MaximumSeasons is another.

A short term, less than perfectly user friendly solution, for those that can, modify the values in that field so they're higher.

Longer term, player MaximumSeasons values can be something I look at.

thanks
David



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