Chasseurs Ardennais (Full Version)

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kurtbj -> Chasseurs Ardennais (3/30/2002 12:15:33 AM)

Is the topic of the next mini-campaign... taking control of a Belgian Chasseurs Ardennais unit as they encounter the initial German thrust through the Ardennes in 1940. I wasn't even considering this subject but I found an article and website about the unit and it seems interesting, I've only just started work on it so it'll be a couple of weeks I think, expect it to be quite difficult as the belgians had no AT guns according to what I've read.

:eek:



zaxilon -> Looking forward to it (3/30/2002 7:37:55 AM)

I built a campaign for Talonsofts West Front in 1940 including the Belgians, Netherlands, French and BEF. From my research the Belgians and Netherlanders were not at all prepared for mobile armored formations. Their equipment is very small calibre and they utilized a lot of horse drawn equipment and bicycles. Their OOB reflected heavily on WWI and lacked real mobility of action. They had no anti-tank doctrine and IMHO, their army rather resembled a well armed police force supported by artillery.

Although the German armor of that day were no dryland dreadnoughts I think that a head to head commander of the Allied forces would be really hard pressed to really slow the German advance. I think you would really have to utilize everything right down the the game mechanics to have any level of success. If you keep them to their true national strategy then I think there is not hope for them.

This was the doom of the French. IMHO they had some AFV's that were superior to the Germans but the way they deployed them in piecmeal didnt allow them to really thwart the Germans anywhere. If I were organizing them I would make some serious changes to their OOB. But then that would be a big "What If" campaign or scenario.

At any rate I look forward to checking it out.

Later,
Zaxilon :D



kurtbj -> (3/30/2002 3:08:56 PM)

The units used by the Belgian Chassuers Ardennais will ultimately be up to the player of the campaign as you'll be able to pick your core forces. If you want to experience hell on earth then go for a historical setup with no AT capability or buy yourself a couple of 47mm AT guns (they are in the belgian OOB) for a bit of a chance.



zaxilon -> Dont think it will change much (3/30/2002 3:58:13 PM)

I am familiar with that 47mm AT gun platform. Pretty useless. Mounted on the back of a tractor chasis with a thin shield in front, narrow arc of fire, low muzzle velocity and no punch when it hits. Deadly to trucks and schwimmelwagons though. But not much against armor. I incorporated them in my campaign and I think the only kills I scored with them were recon vehicles and trucks. They didnt last very long either. Just please include demo and satchel charges, flamethrowers and lots and lots of infantry in your TOE to choose from.
:D

Seriously, I think the Belgians and the Netherlanders really dont have a prayer. Unless you modify their experience and morale values along with their command ratings and turn them into supermen. IMHO, no matter how you equip them with their TOE unless you edit them into a calibre of force they really werent there is not much chance. But I like a challenge and when it comes to gaming, I will try anything on.

Later,
Zaxilon :D



El_Peco -> (3/30/2002 4:19:07 PM)

Zaxilon, I would be interested to your campaign, is it avaible to the "public"?

Regards.



kurtbj -> (3/30/2002 5:01:22 PM)

mmmmm, interesting points.

Would there be any public interest in playing a campaign were you know that you're going to be knee deep in sh*t and you have almost no chance of acheiving victories BUT playing for draws to "slow" the german advance would be the main aim?

There are plenty of historical situations were a victory isn't always acheivable but getting a draw would be considered a good result.

Any thoughts?



El_Peco -> (3/31/2002 12:23:52 AM)

To have a campaign in which you have to fight for your life, versus the A.I.?
It would be welcome, I woul like to play it:D .
To obtain a draw in a disperate situation can be very satisfactory!

Regards.



zaxilon -> My campaign is not completed yet.... but (3/31/2002 3:32:44 AM)

I built it around the German perspective. The format is in the Talonsoft West Front with the Operation Sealion add-on. It is the first part of a three campaign series set at the "Army Group" level of play. Only intended for the most serious gamer. The maps are very large to allow a lot of freedom of movement. I am trying to catch the flavor and feel of the action rather than a strict adhearence to history. If you want exacting historical re-creation then you dont want to play my work. I like to play with things and ideas and Talonsoft and SPWAW give me a lot of things to work with.

Although not complete now when it is yes it is for the public if anybody would want it. Anybody can build a campaign in the Talonsoft games very easily. Campaigns are pretty simple to throw together unless you get to the Division level and above. The only real tough part is setting the victory condition point values.

I like SPWAW for the smaller actions since the scale of play is really limited. Being a fan of Squad Leader I really like the up close aspect it brings. The Talonsoft games really lend themselves to the larger campaigns but you lose a lot of customizing you have here in the trade off.

For me the perfect game would be a composite of the two game formats and capabilities.

Later,
Zaxilon :D



Fallschirmjager -> (3/31/2002 10:30:37 AM)

No one thought the Belgiums would have a chance in August 1914.

A few German blunders and 30,000 dead later things changed.

I have an Idea.

Can you make it where you get more points the longer it takes the Germans to beat you?



zaxilon -> Yes Fallschirmjager I can. (3/31/2002 4:48:54 PM)

In the Talonsoft campaign series campaigns can be built that way. You have to set the victory conditions point spread to cover the various levels of possible victory. In that format you can get replacement strength points to replace destroyed units in your formations. The campaign designer inputs what ever number of replacement points he selects for each category of victory. The idea is not to lose units. You can do that much easier in the campaign series. You can create several exit hexes and if you can get your units to them you can exit them from the map and save their strength points. Victory levels are organized by strength points remaining and lost. But if you play the Talonsoft campaign series games you give up a lot of realism and customizing you get here. The campaign series is at the platoon level as the basic unit type. Where here you can organize it as fire teams or platoons depending on the number of troops you place in the unit. Just an example.

I dont spend a lot of time on the campaign series games because SPWAW has spoiled me. Like I said in my previous posts it is a trade off. Here you get great realism, great battlefield effects, a lot of editing potential for customizing. There you get larger capacity of game size, a lot more flexability with the map creation and the campaigns are really easy to build. I guess a good comparison would be something like, SPWAW is more tactical and Talonsoft Campaign series is more strategic. I prefer SPWAW. That is why I am here and not on the Talonsoft board. But I do play them both.

Later,
Zaxilon :D



scimitar -> (3/31/2002 8:40:04 PM)

A campaign where you have the defensive role can be very interrestive. And as a Belgian, a campaign concerning the Chasseurs Ardennais is a must. I'm really interrested.
During the 18 days campaign of 1940, the Belgian army was not prepared to the German Blitzkrieg (military theory was based on old WWI concepts like the fortresses of Eben-Emael, Namur, ...) Armament was obsolete (the most modern aircrafts we had was approximatively 20 Hawker Hurricane MKI; there were ground destroyed on 10th and 11th may by German bombers...) but Belgian soldiers fought with a maximum of courage, as during WWI. But with that concept of Blitzkrieg, it was impossible to the Belgians to repeat their WWI resistance...



ClaudeJ -> RE: (7/16/2006 11:22:31 PM)

Sorry to push up a such old thread but is this campaign been done and published?
regards,
jan



Korpraali V -> RE: Dont think it will change much (7/17/2006 1:16:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: zaxilon

Seriously, I think the Belgians and the Netherlanders really dont have a prayer. Unless you modify their experience and morale values along with their command ratings and turn them into supermen. IMHO, no matter how you equip them with their TOE unless you edit them into a calibre of force they really werent there is not much chance. But I like a challenge and when it comes to gaming, I will try anything on.


Which version you are planning to use? With SPWAW Enhanced Low countries are not anymore useless. [:)]

Very interesting idea!



junk2drive -> RE: Dont think it will change much (7/17/2006 1:17:27 AM)

How the H... did you find this thread?

I can never get search to work.



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