Just for fun: Wargaming 10 years from now (Full Version)

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KG Erwin -> Just for fun: Wargaming 10 years from now (8/27/2000 9:35:00 AM)

OK, this is is just an exercise in speculating on future developments. IMHO, there will be a time , and I think it's not that far away, that we will be able to issue verbal commands to units in SPWaW or any other game.I think that will be be the ultimate goal in wargaming...to be able to issue the orders with your own voice, and to hear your subordinates respond. Also, ALL battlefields will be displayed in 3D, but you will be able to see the battlefield from different angles. Flat 2D map displays will be available, if needed. In short, the quality of official training simulators will soon be attainable by commercial wargame developers. Comments? ------------------ "Klotzen, nicht Kleckern (roughly translated, 'Boot em, don't spatter em')"--Heinz Guderian



troopie -> (8/28/2000 10:32:00 AM)

Computers will have curved wrap around screens. Immersed in the action. Realistic fog-of -war will be possible. You will have a general idea of the position of your own units, but not exact. troopie ------------------ Pamwe Chete



JonBullis -> (9/1/2000 5:45:00 AM)

Now, letting my imagination run away to look into the future of wargaming - 3d holographic table-top play. Instead of looking at a computer screen, watch the action on you computer generated, holographic game. A blend of computer technology (when they get that far) and old, hardcore table top minuatures gaming! Of course the ultimate would be our own holodeck capability for play - and ten years seems just too soon for that adventure. ------------------ Jon "Dvious" Bullis A Real Rompin, Stompin, Snake-Eatin, Armchair Warrior!



KG Erwin -> (9/1/2000 6:29:00 AM)

Yeah, Jon, I understand what you're talking about, but I was trying to keep this within the realms of existing or currently under development technology. It really doesn't matter. I would take your idea a step further and foresee a time where you can step into a booth and be actually ON a battlefield of your choosing. You could be a Macedonian Companion or an English longbowman or a hoplite fighting the Trojans or having sex with Helen of Troy. Ummm...no question of choice there!



Grok -> (9/9/2000 3:51:00 AM)

According to the posting dates, I'm a day late and a dollar short...again. But to comment on your "specualtion of future developments", since virtual reality is a "reality" today and computers have gotten progressively more powerful and versitle, I see the melding of several technologies to enhance game play. For those who like tacticle or small unit scale games, I think a virtual reality setup with a force feedback chair and joystick would work well. It would give the gamer the "feel" of being there. Whether it be riding a AFV or piloting an aircraft or even slogging it through the mud as infantry, that setup would be perfect for that. Imagine firing those guns or rolling over rough terrain, or flying tight high g-manuevers, or being the recipient of enemy artillery, that chair would bounce and sway to it all while the virtual reality helmet would keep you totally immeresed within its solitary confines, away from the mundane distractions of everyday life. As for larger scale games, such as grand tacticle or stratagic...thats harder to speculate on...however based on current and readily available technologies, a 3D enviroment would probably be best suited for that. JonBullis already commented on that, but I would like to add and clarify a few things. For one it could be played on a table that is prepared for holographic imaging, using lasers to produce the image and 3D effects. It would appear more or less as a table top game, with a larger playing area, hidden units, fog of war, real time play as well as so many other things that are part of regular computer games, but coupled to a minatures type feel. A virtual realty type glove would be used to move units, attack and issue orders, using a laser for a point and spot interface to designate units and officers. Orders could be given to officers in command of the units or the gamer could issue the orders directly to those units, tho in a real time enviroment trying to control each individual unit would be difficult if not impossible. I know some of this sounds far fetched, but it can be accomplished using existing technology...now cost is another thing altogether. Grok



KG Erwin -> (9/9/2000 4:38:00 AM)

Thanks, Grok, for your comments. This is exactly what I'm hoping to hear more about. The melding of VR technology and realistic combat simulation is, of course, already being used by the US military. Since some of the guys designing this stuff are also "commercial" wargame designers, I can easily see a drift towards consumer games using these concepts. This is a point I've referred to in other postings. How about some opinions from the Matrix staff? Are some of these possibilities talked about in late-night bull sessions? Is much consideration given to long-term developments, or is the focus on "stretching the envelope" given current PC capabilities?



Grok -> (9/9/2000 5:21:00 AM)

Your Welcome KG Erwin... Anytime I can comment on something without being too wrong, I'll jump at the chance! Specualtion of this sort is one of the few passions I have left that is still free, so its fun to do so. And who knows maybe someone with the know how and can do, will read these postings and make something happen. Would be nice to see the computer and the games evolve into something that we can only dream of(or maybe not even imagine) today.



Grumble -> (9/16/2000 5:42:00 AM)

IMHO I think the influence of the "paper-and-carboard" types will decline as they age and interest in the hobby ebbs. This influence I believe has held the computer side of the hobby back. For example, even the SPWAW engine is ASL-based: hex based movement, IGYG. Speaking of which, I recall a discussion I had with Donald Greenwood about the future of wargaming at a convention 1988. My view was that computer-based games were the new platform; his condescending reply was "I didn't really understand the hobby and computers would never replace board games". That mindset is still around, I find. With new innovators, I think you will be seeing more distributed wargaming, not unlike military CP exercises. Inputs from each player on a side will in near-realtime affect the situation you see, either on a screen or VR goggles. Distributed gaming with live teamates better illustrates Clauswitz's idea of friction in battle. At a micro-level, voice instructions to individual units, non-hex-based movement, semi-simultaneous play, and sophisicated AI.



zombie -> (9/22/2000 2:24:00 PM)

I think VR helmets, with the user "sitting" in his chair able to zoom in/out to see various depictions of the battlefield via a keyboard/joystick/mouse/verbal commands. At its most basic level all you would need is the helmet and an input device, more advanced version could have tactile feedback included and if they ever develope full bodysuits like that i bet wargames will be the last thing on peoples minds. [img]http://www.matrixgames.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]



Richard bradley -> (10/6/2000 4:42:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by Grumble: IMHO I think the influence of the "paper-and-carboard" types will decline as they age and interest in the hobby ebbs. This influence I believe has held the computer side of the hobby back. AI.
..AS an old "paper and cardboard" type(35 yrs gaming) I beg leave to agree with you. Early computer games were rubbish frankly and the old style paper games were superior, now I'm not so sure, but the next generation of Military Simulation games (wargames is a bit naff) is going to require some new approaches from the programming side onwards. ...I'm not even sure that a programmer alone will be able to design the next generation. ..Re 3d etc..don't mix up "chrome/special effects" which look good but do nothing for the gameplay, and the Game Engine that drives it all..given the complexity of MilSim games I would suggest that they are a real contender for creating a genuine Artificial Intelligence, if only so we can play a good game/reproduction of Gettysburg/Crécy/Têt Offensive ..Richard 23&DaysPrune



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