RE: War in the East... (Full Version)

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undercovergeek -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 9:02:35 AM)

you mean its not finished yet?



Joshuatree -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 10:19:35 AM)

I doubt it very much. This post here (five up or so): "German allies have factories but as this game is in very early alpha the economical part of the game has not been decided on."  was posted dec. 2008. So, I'm afraid it might take another 2 years or so...




undercovergeek -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 10:51:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joshuatree

I doubt it very much. This post here (five up or so): "German allies have factories but as this game is in very early alpha the economical part of the game has not been decided on."  was posted dec. 2008. So, I'm afraid it might take another 2 years or so...




dammit!! [;)]

im sure Witp: AE will keep me going till then



Joshuatree -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 2:46:29 PM)

And ofcourse World in Flames is scheduled for release ... late April if I'm correct.

Edit: Not April, but 27th of July.

Quote from WiF forum:

"March 1, 2009 Status Report for Matrix Games’ MWIF Forum

Accomplishments of February

Project Management
Firm release date for MWIF product 1 is July 27th, 2009."



Terminus -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 3:50:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joshuatree

I doubt it very much. This post here (five up or so): "German allies have factories but as this game is in very early alpha the economical part of the game has not been decided on."  was posted dec. 2008. So, I'm afraid it might take another 2 years or so...




dammit!! [;)]

im sure Witp: AE will keep me going till then


If it gets released first...



Joel Billings -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 5:41:55 PM)

We are working away on the game. We'll post some screenshots once we get new artwork and the real map (we are using old alpha art now). The game has been playable for months, and we have about 10 testers on it now, but it's a big project and we have many months left. It is coming along though, and we are committed to finishing it as soon as we can (and can be happy with it). WitP AE should be finished first (that's my prediction).



Vorsteher -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 5:49:24 PM)

some screens ? I am entirely strained [:)]



Joshuatree -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 7:15:37 PM)

Thanks for the update Joel. Many months left you say, I take that as 1-2 years from now. But you know how we are.... drooling over some screenshots and alpha maps. [;)] 



Charles2222 -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 7:16:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shupov

The following table for Soviet arms production is extracted from "Thunder in the East" by Evan Mawdsley (2005). Mawdsley was able to gain access Soviet war archives recently made public

.............................Entered Service......Entered Service
...........................6/22/41-12/31/41..........1942

AT................................2500....................20500
AA................................3400....................6800
Artillery.................... ...10100..................30100
Katyushas.....................1000....................3300
Heavy Tanks.................1000....................2600
Medium Tanks...............2200....................13400
Light Tanks...................2400....................11900
Fighters........................6000....................10700
Attack Aircraft ..............1400....................7200
Bombers.......................2500....................4100

These numbers include Soviet production and lend-lease. They appear to be for the most part higher than the War in Russia Soviet production numbers. For example, assuming that "medium tanks" are primarily T-34, the number entering service in 1942 averages 515/per week. This is much higher than the game provides.
Will War in the East reflect higher Soviet armaments production than War in Russia?

I think T26's, and others, would also be regarded as medium tanks, and they vastly outnumbered T34's, until they were captured or destroyed that is. Germans running into T34's was actually pretty rare for quite a while, as there certainly weren't very many at the beginning (around 1000 I think it was).



Peter Fisla -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 8:46:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

We are working away on the game. We'll post some screenshots once we get new artwork and the real map (we are using old alpha art now). The game has been playable for months, and we have about 10 testers on it now, but it's a big project and we have many months left. It is coming along though, and we are committed to finishing it as soon as we can (and can be happy with it). WitP AE should be finished first (that's my prediction).


This is great new Joel, thanks for sharing! Is there an official feature list for the EF game? Yes some screenshots would be cool...thanks



undercovergeek -> RE: War in the East... (3/30/2009 10:05:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus


quote:

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joshuatree

I doubt it very much. This post here (five up or so): "German allies have factories but as this game is in very early alpha the economical part of the game has not been decided on."  was posted dec. 2008. So, I'm afraid it might take another 2 years or so...




dammit!! [;)]

im sure Witp: AE will keep me going till then


If it gets released first...


get back in your hole and test you......

goddamit terminus it better be ready by summer!!! YOU PROMISED [:'(]



Shupov -> RE: War in the East... (4/4/2009 4:38:06 AM)

I've added more columns to the chart - On-Hand 6/22/41 and WiR 6/22/41, plus tank and aircraft types.

..................Entered Service......Entered Service.....On Hand.......WiR
.................6/22/41-12/31/41..........1942 ................6/22/41....6/22/41

AT..........................2500.............20500..................14900........8993
AA..........................3400..............6800...................8600.........778
Artillery.............. ...10100............30100..................33200........8738
Katyushas................1000..............3300...................0...............0
Heavy Tanks............1000..............2600...................500...........468......KV-1E,KV-2,T-35
Medium Tanks..........2200..............13400.................900...........1240....T-34,T-28
Light Tanks.............2400..............11900.................21200.........11641...T-37,T-60,BT-5,BT-7
Fighters..................6000..............10700.................11500.........9073.....I-15,I-16,MiG-1,MiG-3,Yak-1
Attack Aircraft ........1400..............7200..................100.............364........LaGG-3
Bombers.................2500..............4100..................8400............9014......Il-4,TB-3,Il-2,Su-2,SB-2

The T-26 weighed only 10.6 tons and was considered a light infantry tank. The other Soviet medium tank at the time was the T-28. The T-28 is no longer being produced at the beginning of WiR.

Various sources state that T-34 production was 2200-2800 in 1941 and 12500-13400 (about 250/week) in 1942. Average T-34 tank production in WiR doesn't come close to 250/week in 1942 under computer controlled production. It is only possible to reach this number by devoting all Soviet tank production to T-34's, but historically this was certainly not the case.

Will War in the East provide increased T-34 tank production to these levels?




SS Hauptsturmfuhrer -> RE: War in the East... (4/4/2009 5:07:59 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sterckxe

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
Does anyone know if there has been any info regarding a new Eastern Front game?


Last I have is this :

http://www.2by3games.com/devjournal/journal20080331.html

Turn-based - weekly moves, 10 mile hexes

Available : 2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
A good second would be a new turn based game about the fortotten war - the War in Korea.


The Korea scenario in TOAW III is a classic - recommended

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx



I played that Korean war from start to end but only that one using an earlier version of that game platform. I did some big enveloping manoeuvres and bagged a big catch.



Charles2222 -> RE: War in the East... (4/4/2009 10:17:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shupov

I've added more columns to the chart - On-Hand 6/22/41 and WiR 6/22/41, plus tank and aircraft types.

..................Entered Service......Entered Service.....On Hand.......WiR
.................6/22/41-12/31/41..........1942 ................6/22/41....6/22/41

AT..........................2500.............20500..................14900........8993
AA..........................3400..............6800...................8600.........778
Artillery.............. ...10100............30100..................33200........8738
Katyushas................1000..............3300...................0...............0
Heavy Tanks............1000..............2600...................500...........468......KV-1E,KV-2,T-35
Medium Tanks..........2200..............13400.................900...........1240....T-34,T-28
Light Tanks.............2400..............11900.................21200.........11641...T-37,T-60,BT-5,BT-7
Fighters..................6000..............10700.................11500.........9073.....I-15,I-16,MiG-1,MiG-3,Yak-1
Attack Aircraft ........1400..............7200..................100.............364........LaGG-3
Bombers.................2500..............4100..................8400............9014......Il-4,TB-3,Il-2,Su-2,SB-2

The T-26 weighed only 10.6 tons and was considered a light infantry tank. The other Soviet medium tank at the time was the T-28. The T-28 is no longer being produced at the beginning of WiR.

Various sources state that T-34 production was 2200-2800 in 1941 and 12500-13400 (about 250/week) in 1942. Average T-34 tank production in WiR doesn't come close to 250/week in 1942 under computer controlled production. It is only possible to reach this number by devoting all Soviet tank production to T-34's, but historically this was certainly not the case.

Will War in the East provide increased T-34 tank production to these levels?


Okay, the BT and T28 series then. Even if something stopped being produced, it's obvious at the beginning of the war that the T34 series was a minor part of the medium tank arm (in numbers). That of course affect what was stocked in tank formations. Also, to really have any sense of accuracy, this should depend on what factories were captured and when.



Joel Billings -> RE: War in the East... (4/5/2009 8:46:53 PM)

The short answer is yes. I just looked and the production rate for the T-34 is 240/week.



Shupov -> RE: War in the East... (4/7/2009 5:02:02 PM)

Thanks Joel.  It would be very interesting at some point to know the other weapon production numbers in the game.

For example, artillery seems to play a larger role in historical campaign narratives than it does in WiR.  Soviet offensives were usually begun with massive bombardments, especially later in the war.  The artillery numbers in the table above are much more than in WiR, but I think they include mortars.  Since War in the East is a divisional level game perhaps the scale will better support the bombardment combat phase.  Axis air superiority in the early years is devastating - it seems like Soviet artillery superiority later on should have comparable effect.

Another WiR issue is AA.  If the Soviets place multiple AA units to protect cities against strategic attacks, then other units are squeezed out.  It's hard to believe a few hundred AA in a 400 square mile space (or even a 100 square mile space) would displace other units.  Have you considered that AA, Anti-Tank and Artillery units should not count towards stacking limits?  They could have separate stacking limits that allow realistic deployment.



madgamer2 -> RE: War in the East... (4/8/2009 10:39:32 PM)

I got a copy of War in Europe by SPI I will sell ya but ya have to play7 the old fashion way...ya know a large room for the 9 or 10 24'x32" maps....couple of thousand counters...Heck by the time you get it set up SOMEONE will have a new east front game LOL

Madgamer



Mangudai -> RE: War in the East... (4/9/2009 4:23:02 AM)


War in Russia is free, abandon ware.  I just downloaded it and got it running in DOSbox, my system is vista.  Sadly it doesn't run well in DOSbox, and I probably won't get into it. 

Does anybody know of other games that have Operation Barbarrosa on the strategic level?  Like old simple games...



Chijohnaok2 -> RE: War in the East... (4/9/2009 11:14:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mangudai


War in Russia is free, abandon ware.  I just downloaded it and got it running in DOSbox, my system is vista.  Sadly it doesn't run well in DOSbox, and I probably won't get into it. 

Does anybody know of other games that have Operation Barbarrosa on the strategic level?  Like old simple games...



You might try this.....Eastern Front (1941)


gave me hundreds of hours of gameplay when it first came out.....

[;)] [:D]





madgamer2 -> RE: War in the East... (4/10/2009 1:50:42 AM)

i could be wrong here and if so please so,sone up there in Matrix God land give the real truth. The Russian invasion game they give away here was purchased as they have done in the past. In moast cases the games were updated to run on XP and very little was changed.
For some reason it appears that they planned a complete re design of the original game. I say this because the free version game only resembles the original in a few minor way.
The free version looks to me like a first draft of a redesign that was for whatever reason canceled and the game out out for free. Its to bad they did not just update the orignal to run on XP because it was a great game. I am sure they had there reasons for not going through with the redesign but ZI miss that original game a lot.

Madgamer



Shupov -> RE: War in the East... (4/13/2009 5:16:21 PM)

Please fix the Crimea in the new game.  In WiR it's impossible for the Soviets to defend due to supply restrictions.  As soon as the peninsula is cut off the Supply Level goes to 0 except for Sevastopol and the far east end of the Kerch peninsula.

In the real war there were important battles involving amphibious landings, naval action and immense siege guns.  Manstein's victories at Perekop and Kerch never happen as the Soviets usually abandon the field of battle. 



PzB74 -> RE: War in the East... (6/28/2009 8:25:50 PM)

Found this on the main page under "coming soon"! [X(][8D]
http://www.matrixgames.com/products/372/details/Gary.Grigsby%E2%80%99s.War.in.the.East:.The.German-Soviet.War.1941-1945

Still no forum? Are you going to make this one "without us"? [&:][;)]



Erik Rutins -> RE: War in the East... (6/28/2009 9:12:34 PM)

That page should have gone live later tonight, it's still being edited.

Forum will show up once the announcement goes out, so this should have a forum sometime tomorrow. Yes, we will finally make it official. [8D]



PzB74 -> War in the East...is coming soon! (6/28/2009 9:25:05 PM)

[&o][:D]

Oh! You better watch out,
You better not cry,
You better not pout,
I'm telling you why:

Santa Claus is coming to town!

He's making a list,
He's checking it twice,
He's gonna find out
who's naughty or nice.

Santa Claus is coming to town!

[sm=00000436.gif]


quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

That page should have gone live later tonight, it's still being edited.

Forum will show up once the announcement goes out, so this should have a forum sometime tomorrow. Yes, we will finally make it official. [8D]


[:D]



JRodda -> RE: War in the East... (6/28/2009 9:41:15 PM)

I'd be very interested in this if it had campaign scenarios you could play in a few weeks (or so) like Operation Typhoon, Case Blue, Citadel, etc.  From the sound of it though, not sure I would ever try to tackle the grand campaign. 

Anyone remember the old SPI boardgame (the name escapes me at the moment) about the Eastern Front that was corps/army level?  That was a great game.  It was sort of a more realistic version (at least in terms of scope/scale) of Avalon Hill's 'Stalingrad'. 



Jonathan Pollard -> RE: War in the East... (6/29/2009 1:18:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JRodda
Anyone remember the old SPI boardgame (the name escapes me at the moment) about the Eastern Front that was corps/army level?  That was a great game.  It was sort of a more realistic version (at least in terms of scope/scale) of Avalon Hill's 'Stalingrad'. 

They had one called 'Barbarossa' which I enjoyed very much. Gary Grigsby also released a corps/army Eastern Front game in 1984 called 'War in Russia' which I liked because it had a simultaneous order entry phase and execution phase and a scale appropriate for that kind of system (infantry moves 1 hex per turn, armor 2). Also unlike its successor 'Gary Grigsby's War in Russia,' it allowed stacking of 2 units per hex.



Jeffrey H. -> RE: War in the East... (6/29/2009 4:18:25 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

That page should have gone live later tonight, it's still being edited.

Forum will show up once the announcement goes out, so this should have a forum sometime tomorrow. Yes, we will finally make it official. [8D]



The link is live.



JudgeDredd -> RE: War in the East... (6/29/2009 7:28:16 AM)

Good gawd - how long is a single turn going to take?



Terminus -> RE: War in the East... (6/29/2009 9:02:54 AM)

Not as long as WitP: AE...[:'(]



Hard Sarge -> RE: War in the East... (6/29/2009 12:41:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Good gawd - how long is a single turn going to take?


depends on which turn it is :)

a couple times we have started a turn and before it was over, Gary has released another update, so back to the beginning again

but overall, once you know what you want to do, it is not too bad :)




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