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Menser -> PP's (1/6/2009 2:38:33 AM)
Are there any differences to PP's in AE? Do they work the same as in Witp? Is there more/less of them? Is the Lord of the Admirality still escort hungry?

wdolson -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 10:53:32 AM)
There are differences in the PP system. "Buying out" units from restricted commands can be very expensive. Some early war leaders like Percival are very expensive to replace too. I don't recall what the PP values were in stock, but in AE the Japanese start with 500 and get 50 per turn. The Allies start with 100 and get 50 per turn. The PP expenses are very different from stock, though the overall system is similar. There are now locked down units that can't be transferred outside of their command, which reduces some of the early war temptations for PP expenditures. Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines. Same with many Dutch air units. Some West Coast units are also locked into the US. Though there are units assigned to West Coast at start that can be changed to an unrestricted command. Ship withdrawals are different too. The random withdraw request every month is gone. Instead air, naval, and land units may have withdraw dates. So it might be possible the Allies will have to withdraw 4 DDs on a given day, but no more will be withdrawn for months. I haven't looked at the RN withdraw data in a while, so I have no idea of the specifics (I know there were some tweaks to fix some withdraw errors since the last time I looked). JWE can answer the ship withdraw question better. I believe he set all the ship withdrawals. Bill

witpqs -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 2:09:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: wdolson The PP expenses are very different from stock, though the overall system is similar. There are now locked down units that can't be transferred outside of their command, which reduces some of the early war temptations for PP expenditures. Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines. Same with many Dutch air units. Some West Coast units are also locked into the US. Though there are units assigned to West Coast at start that can be changed to an unrestricted command. What happens in AE when these locked up units are destroyed? Do they come back months later (ala WITP) in another base under another command? Do they go away forever? Etc.?

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 2:23:04 PM)
Are the Japanease Home Island divisions locked down? Chinease divisions? That was one of my biggest frustrations in WitP Stock. You land your troops on Saipan and find two full strength divisions from the Home Island defense there.

Andy Mac -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 2:43:30 PM)
HI Divs are not locked down Japanese if they have the PP's can move units overseas Only Japanese units that are locked down are Puppet Chinese, Mongolian and Thai forces all others can be bought out

witpqs -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 2:51:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: witpqs quote: ORIGINAL: wdolson The PP expenses are very different from stock, though the overall system is similar. There are now locked down units that can't be transferred outside of their command, which reduces some of the early war temptations for PP expenditures. Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines. Same with many Dutch air units. Some West Coast units are also locked into the US. Though there are units assigned to West Coast at start that can be changed to an unrestricted command. What happens in AE when these locked up units are destroyed? Do they come back months later (ala WITP) in another base under another command? Do they go away forever? Etc.? Andy, What about this question? Thanks.

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 3:40:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Andy Mac HI Divs are not locked down Japanese if they have the PP's can move units overseas Only Japanese units that are locked down are Puppet Chinese, Mongolian and Thai forces all others can be bought out This is just me thinking out loud, but it seems odd that West Coast divisions would be locked down, but not Home Island divisions? By no means is this a complaint, it just seems odd.

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 3:42:49 PM)
On a different note, how many PP does it take to reassign ships to a different HQ? For instance, about how many would it take to reassign a xAK, DD or CV? Obviously these values are subject to change as the game is finalized, Im just curious what the order of magnitude for naval reassignments will be. Around 5? Around 25? Around 50? Thanks in advance. Chad

Andy Mac -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 4:09:07 PM)
Different rules apply - Japan we are modeling entire war effort/theatre and requirements - Allies we are not there will always be a double standard in this area

Andy Mac -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 4:09:51 PM)
Restricted units dont re appear if destroyed except Chinese

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 4:16:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Andy Mac Different rules apply - Japan we are modeling entire war effort/theatre and requirements - Allies we are not there will always be a double standard in this area Fair enough. Makes sense.

Don Bowen -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 4:17:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chad Harrison On a different note, how many PP does it take to reassign ships to a different HQ? For instance, about how many would it take to reassign a xAK, DD or CV? Obviously these values are subject to change as the game is finalized, Im just curious what the order of magnitude for naval reassignments will be. Around 5? Around 25? Around 50? Thanks in advance. Chad None. Ship HQ assignments is a convenience to allow the player to organize his ships. There are none of the restrictions of land or air units on ships based on their HQ. Basically, it's a "where are my ships" aid. There was some thought of more features for ship HQ, but it got real complicated real fast and ended up in the ship can.

bradfordkay -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 5:17:54 PM)
"Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines." This is interesting because it it my impression that the USAFFE air units were among the first units to be removed from the Philippines. Can someone elaborate on this (units and reasoning)?

Don Bowen -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 5:54:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bradfordkay "Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines." This is interesting because it it my impression that the USAFFE air units were among the first units to be removed from the Philippines. Can someone elaborate on this (units and reasoning)? Historically, only the heavy bomber units in the Philippines were withdrawn. The fighter and light bomber units were worn to zero and then became infantry. No aircraft (except B-17) were able to withdraw. In fact, attempts were made to get additional ones in (three P-40 made it). Air and some ground crews were evacuated to Australia where they were used in newly formed Provisional Squadrons (along with other personnel). These provisional squadrons are in the OOB (with withdraw dates). Make sense??

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 6:25:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Don Bowen None. Ship HQ assignments is a convenience to allow the player to organize his ships. There are none of the restrictions of land or air units on ships based on their HQ. Basically, it's a "where are my ships" aid. There was some thought of more features for ship HQ, but it got real complicated real fast and ended up in the ship can. Thats great news! Thanks for the reply Don. To follow up on that question, about how many Naval HQ's will the Americans have? Is it similar to WitP stock? Or will we see additional HQ's? Will you be able to attach ships to area HQ's (such as South Pacific and Central Pacific)? Thanks in advance. Chad

Don Bowen -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 6:43:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chad Harrison quote: ORIGINAL: Don Bowen None. Ship HQ assignments is a convenience to allow the player to organize his ships. There are none of the restrictions of land or air units on ships based on their HQ. Basically, it's a "where are my ships" aid. There was some thought of more features for ship HQ, but it got real complicated real fast and ended up in the ship can. Thats great news! Thanks for the reply Don. To follow up on that question, about how many Naval HQ's will the Americans have? Is it similar to WitP stock? Or will we see additional HQ's? Will you be able to attach ships to area HQ's (such as South Pacific and Central Pacific)? Thanks in advance. Chad Can't answer the OOB question. Tain't my area. Ships can be attached to Command HQs (such as South Pacific, etc) and to any Naval HQ.

m10bob -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 6:43:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Don Bowen quote: ORIGINAL: bradfordkay "Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines." This is interesting because it it my impression that the USAFFE air units were among the first units to be removed from the Philippines. Can someone elaborate on this (units and reasoning)? Historically, only the heavy bomber units in the Philippines were withdrawn. The fighter and light bomber units were worn to zero and then became infantry. No aircraft (except B-17) were able to withdraw. In fact, attempts were made to get additional ones in (three P-40 made it). Air and some ground crews were evacuated to Australia where they were used in newly formed Provisional Squadrons (along with other personnel). These provisional squadrons are in the OOB (with withdraw dates). Make sense?? IMHO another wonderful improvement. I have cheated many times by moving those fighters to OZ and then the Japanese did not have the advantage they enjoyed IRL.......

Yamato hugger -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 8:19:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: witpqs What happens in AE when these locked up units are destroyed? Do they come back months later (ala WITP) in another base under another command? Do they go away forever? Etc.? Andy, What about this question? Thanks. They are destroyed of course. Would you really think anything else would happen to them?

Splinterhead -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 8:22:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: m10bob IMHO another wonderful improvement. I have cheated many times by moving those fighters to OZ and then the Japanese did not have the advantage they enjoyed IRL....... I wouldn't call it cheating. IRL orders were issued for some of the fighters to be evacuated only to be almost immediately countermanded. 49 out of 165 fighter pilots were evacuated. Moot point in AE with the provisional squadrons, though.

wdolson -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 8:34:17 PM)
A couple of points... There are more HQs in AE though I haven't paid close attention to the naval HQ situation, so I can't tell anyone specifics. Many units locked down on the West Coast were training units, or were units preparing to go to Europe or the Med and just happened to be working up on the West Coast. These units would never have been sent into the Pacific because of the Germany First decision. If the Japanese had been crazy enough to invade the mainland US or Canada, these units would have been thrown into the fray since that would constitute a dire emergency, but barring that, they did their task at home. Japan, on the other hand, has no off map theaters to contend with. They also had less ability to maintain a deep training pool and threw many unprepared units into harms way in a desperate attempt to stop the errosion of their empire. So it's realistic that they have the ability to buy out HI units. It will cost you, just as it did in real life to make these decisions. The US does have units assigned to West Coast that can be bought out. Just a rough estimate, I would say maybe 1/2 the ground units assigned to West Coast are locked down and 1/2 can be bought out. I haven't counted or anything, that's just my impression. Bill

Chad Harrison -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 9:06:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: wdolson A couple of points... There are more HQs in AE though I haven't paid close attention to the naval HQ situation, so I can't tell anyone specifics. Many units locked down on the West Coast were training units, or were units preparing to go to Europe or the Med and just happened to be working up on the West Coast. These units would never have been sent into the Pacific because of the Germany First decision. If the Japanese had been crazy enough to invade the mainland US or Canada, these units would have been thrown into the fray since that would constitute a dire emergency, but barring that, they did their task at home. Japan, on the other hand, has no off map theaters to contend with. They also had less ability to maintain a deep training pool and threw many unprepared units into harms way in a desperate attempt to stop the errosion of their empire. So it's realistic that they have the ability to buy out HI units. It will cost you, just as it did in real life to make these decisions. The US does have units assigned to West Coast that can be bought out. Just a rough estimate, I would say maybe 1/2 the ground units assigned to West Coast are locked down and 1/2 can be bought out. I haven't counted or anything, that's just my impression. Bill Thanks for the explanation Bill. So the Allied player will have atleast some flexibility in moving those West Coast troops elsewhere. quote: ORIGINAL: Don Bowen Can't answer the OOB question. Tain't my area. Ships can be attached to Command HQs (such as South Pacific, etc) and to any Naval HQ. Thats all I wanted to know really. My thought is that it will be nice to assign to the Command HQ's their own arsenal of ships for small transporting of troops, goods, minesweeping, patrol duties and so on. Then have major fleets (such as the American 3rd, 5th and 7th) house the capital ships and major amphibious formations. As far as I know, this is pretty much how it was done IRL, so it will be nice to be able to keep things organized that way in the game. I know many others have made this comment, but I will again: the more I learn about this game the greater it is becoming. Thanks again Chad

witpqs -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 10:20:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger quote: ORIGINAL: witpqs What happens in AE when these locked up units are destroyed? Do they come back months later (ala WITP) in another base under another command? Do they go away forever? Etc.? Andy, What about this question? Thanks. They are destroyed of course. Would you really think anything else would happen to them? [image]local://upfiles/14248/1E2AE3B835BB4BB2B41BE3E71DF88A3D.gif[/image]

m10bob -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 11:06:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Splinterhead quote: ORIGINAL: m10bob IMHO another wonderful improvement. I have cheated many times by moving those fighters to OZ and then the Japanese did not have the advantage they enjoyed IRL....... I wouldn't call it cheating. IRL orders were issued for some of the fighters to be evacuated only to be almost immediately countermanded. 49 out of 165 fighter pilots were evacuated. Moot point in AE with the provisional squadrons, though. Not just talking about the pilots. I was cheating(IMHO) by tranferring the entire unit. Ground crew, planes, admin, all of it..

m10bob -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 11:09:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger quote: ORIGINAL: witpqs What happens in AE when these locked up units are destroyed? Do they come back months later (ala WITP) in another base under another command? Do they go away forever? Etc.? Andy, What about this question? Thanks. They are destroyed of course. Would you really think anything else would happen to them? Yam...once again you open yourself for criticism of knee-jerk responses. In this case, you completely fail to take the "transporter beam bonus" into account, which the allies were constantly using...[8\|]

spence -> RE: PP's (1/6/2009 11:50:11 PM)
quote: This is just me thinking out loud, but it seems odd that West Coast divisions would be locked down, but not Home Island divisions? By no means is this a complaint, it just seems odd. Presumably AE is going to be more accurate than WitP and the Japanese problem will be finding enough shipping to move the HI divisions overseas AND provide them with stuff like bullets and rice AND move enough stuff back to the HI so that they can produce said bullets and rice in the first place.

Menser -> RE: PP's (1/7/2009 2:57:15 AM)
Kewl, I never liked the idea of forcibly withdrawing ships to keep the PP's I needed. Or kicking myself for forgeting to withdraw them and suddenly starved of PP's that I had plans for. Thanks Team :)

wdolson -> RE: PP's (1/7/2009 3:59:11 AM)
The intelligence screen also now has buttons listing all the withdrawals for land, sea and air so you can keep track of which units are going bye bye and when. Bill

bradfordkay -> RE: PP's (1/7/2009 8:39:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Don Bowen quote: ORIGINAL: bradfordkay "Many USAAFE air units are locked down and can't leave the Philippines." This is interesting because it it my impression that the USAFFE air units were among the first units to be removed from the Philippines. Can someone elaborate on this (units and reasoning)? Historically, only the heavy bomber units in the Philippines were withdrawn. The fighter and light bomber units were worn to zero and then became infantry. No aircraft (except B-17) were able to withdraw. In fact, attempts were made to get additional ones in (three P-40 made it). Air and some ground crews were evacuated to Australia where they were used in newly formed Provisional Squadrons (along with other personnel). These provisional squadrons are in the OOB (with withdraw dates). Make sense?? Don, I knew that most of the fighter aircraft had not made it out of the PI, but I have read that a good many of the fighter pilots did make it out and were not used as infantry. Yes, they were used to create the provisional squadrons that you speak of. So now the question is, how does AE handle this factor? The pilots that start in the PI are lost forever? Are they duplicated in the provisional squadrons (same as MacArthur was duplicated in stock WITP)? Are we able to withdraw individual pilots from depleted squadrons?

goodwoodrw -> RE: PP's (1/7/2009 10:19:37 AM)
talking about PP and unit transfers, can u transfer unit of the Australia Command between PNG and Oz i AE?

Don Bowen -> RE: PP's (1/7/2009 2:32:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bradfordkay Don, I knew that most of the fighter aircraft had not made it out of the PI, but I have read that a good many of the fighter pilots did make it out and were not used as infantry. Yes, they were used to create the provisional squadrons that you speak of. So now the question is, how does AE handle this factor? The pilots that start in the PI are lost forever? Are they duplicated in the provisional squadrons (same as MacArthur was duplicated in stock WITP)? Are we able to withdraw individual pilots from depleted squadrons? An air team issue, so I'm guessing. But I'd say no.

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