3.10 Feature: Auto-Defense Optional and Rules of Engagement (Full Version)

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rsharp@advancedgamin -> 3.10 Feature: Auto-Defense Optional and Rules of Engagement (7/14/2009 11:42:42 PM)

In a non-editor game engine (i.e. Harpoon3.exe), look under the Settings menu for the Rules Of Engagement menu item. You will have two checkboxes that enable or disable auto-defense for the Weapons Free and Weapons Tight ROE. When you have your settings as you wish click 'Save'. This will create a file, RulesOfEngagement.hps, in your Doctrine folder. Plotted Mission and NoMission craft will then use these user settings to determine whether to auto-defend. Only after the RulesofEngagement.hps file is created will any behavior change from the current default, auto-defend enabled.

These settings only affect unassigned craft or assigned to the plotted mission on a human controlled side. As the editors have all sides as computer controlled, it would be misleading to offer the dialog.

I've set up the ROE settings to be easily expandable but do not yet have any options to add. Any suggestions on what options might be added are more than welcome.

Thanks,




hermanhum -> some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 12:04:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hermanhum

Okay, I've tinkered a bit with this and cannot seem to get control of my Plotted missions. The mission profiles page says that:
you may select a profile from for any mission except for the plotted mission.
Well, I want manual control of my plotted missions and I want them to obey my fire control (RoE) commands. I have tried various combinations and permutations for the
MissionAutoDefenseWeaponsFree

MissionAutoDefenseWeaponsTight
parameters, but nothing seems to work. My manual (Plotted) missions still do whatever they like and ignore player input. So, how do I get the AI to stop taking control of my Plotted mission and returning it to me?

Discussion carried over from thread:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=2164876

1) I loaded up a game in H3 Beta 3.10
2) Ensured that I was Weapons Tight under Game Preferences menu
3) Selected the Rules of Engagement menu under Game Preferences
4) Enabled Weapons Tight check box (as shown in image)
5) Saved and closed dialogue
6) Checked the RulesOfEngagement.hps file in the Doctrine folder. It reads:
[PropertySet]
Name=RulesOfEngagement

PropertyName1=MissionAutoDefenseWeaponsFree
PropertyType1=Integer
PropertyValue1=0

PropertyName2=MissionAutoDefenseWeaponsTight
PropertyType2=Integer
PropertyValue2=1

7) Started the game and my aircraft on Plotted mission kept blasting away without any prompting from me. No change in behaviour.

p.s. both boxes are selectable at the same time in the RoE menu. I think that this is contradictory.

[image]local://upfiles/18146/938AC6B65C73458286805E592EF908EE.gif[/image]



rsharp@advancedgamin -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 12:36:10 AM)

Okay, so as described it is working properly. Your craft under weapons tight ROE have auto-defense enabled. Unchecking the option and saving should disable the auto-defense for weapons tight.

To double check, are you playing a non-editor build? The settings only affect human players and editors run all sides as non-human.

Also, both boxes are selectable because they are separate options for each ROE and will only be effective for the indicated ROE.

-edit I think the issue here is a vague dialog as it stands. The two checkboxes are not mutually exclusive settings but options for each ROE. Other options would be listed below the self-defense column and also have a setting for each ROE.



hermanhum -> some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 1:09:04 AM)

Just tried it as suggested and unchecked both boxes in the RoE menu while running the GE (as before). Same result. Planes on Plotted mission just fire away. No change in previous behaviour.

As a side note, this RoE menu/command is redundant and confusing. While I can understand that you may wish to use it for additional features in the future, at this stage, it is redundant and unnecessary.

When a player starts up the GE, his side is already set for either Tight or Free under the Game Preferences menu. He should not need to go into another menu (RoE) and set it, again. IMO, when the GE starts, it should already know the Tight/Free setting. If you want the GE to auto-save this setting into the *.hps file, that is one thing. To require a player to enter it manually should not be necessary.

Also, the player might select Tight/Free and this may be inconsistent with the current RoE file setting. I suspect that this would cause confusion and problems.

Lastly, there is a hotkey to allow a player to go Weapons Free (~ symbol). This button is used so that when the action gets too complicated for a player to handle, he can quickly and easily turn auto-defense over to the AI with the hotkey. Now, under the current regime, he has to depress the Weapons Free hotkey and then still has to go into the RoE menu to turn it off. That pretty much defeats the purpose of a hotkey. When he depresses the Weapons Free hotkey, the game should automatically change everything (including save the new settings to the *.hps file, if necessary.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rsharp@advancedgamin

Also, both boxes are selectable because they are separate options for each ROE and will only be effective for the indicated ROE.

-edit I think the issue here is a vague dialog as it stands. The two checkboxes are not mutually exclusive settings but options for each ROE. Other options would be listed below the self-defense column and also have a setting for each ROE.

If both boxes are selected, what behaviours are supposed to occur?

[image]local://upfiles/18146/718DA9FD223240D2BC46B6CC7358AC48.gif[/image]



th3flyboy -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 1:15:56 AM)

May I suggest setting it as a radio button Russell?



rsharp@advancedgamin -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 1:16:57 AM)

The dialog certainly needs improvement.

However, the player is only required to set the auto-defense settings once. Thereafter, the settings will be effective without any further effort (with that installation). As long as the RulesOfEngagement.hps file exists, its settings will be in effect.

Changing the file or settings when the user switches ROE makes no sense. One checkbox is for enabling of auto-defense behavior under Weapons Tight ROE and the other checkbox for enabling auto-defense behavior under the Weapons Free ROE. Selecting both would enable auto-defense under both ROEs.

-edit Let me try to state it another way. This purpose of this dialog is to tweak the existing ROE behaviors and not switch ROEs. The only option available currently is to enable self-defense for either ROE. Other options intended are group defense (craft in the same group possibly defend each other) and mission defense (craft on the mission possibly defend each other).



hermanhum -> some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 1:36:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: th3flyboy

May I suggest setting it as a radio button Russell?

Of course, that's how the current Weapons Tight/Free is already set. [:)]

quote:

ORIGINAL: rsharp@advancedgamin

Changing the file or settings when the user switches ROE makes no sense. One checkbox is for enabling of auto-defense behavior under Weapons Tight ROE and the other checkbox for enabling auto-defense behavior under the Weapons Free ROE. Selecting both would enable auto-defense under both ROEs.

-edit Let me try to state it another way. This purpose of this dialog is to tweak the existing ROE behaviors and not switch ROEs. The only option available currently is to enable self-defense for either ROE. Other options intended are group defense (craft in the same group possibly defend each other) and mission defense (craft on the mission possibly defend each other).

This is confusing as hell and doesn't seem to work. I've tried all the combinations and my planes on plotted still fire at whatever they like. So, go ahead and tell me what to set in order for my plotted aircraft to not fire until I give the order. I can't figure it out.



rsharp@advancedgamin -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 1:48:41 AM)

Are the planes firing at incoming weapons? Disabling auto self defense is intended to prevent craft from automatically defending themselves against incoming weapons.

-edit
Perhaps the line should be relabled as to automatically engage incoming weapons. That may be more clear.
Another possibility is a separate setting ( a new line ) for the enabling/disabling of engaging targets of opportunity. I'm not considering this for immediate implementation but what do the micromanagers think?



hermanhum -> some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/15/2009 2:05:40 AM)

The planes on Plotted mission are happily blasting away at other planes.  I have no control.  Just to be clear, I need control over my planes to prevent them from firing at both planes and weapons.

quote:

ORIGINAL: rsharp@advancedgamin

Changing the file or settings when the user switches ROE makes no sense. One checkbox is for enabling of auto-defense behavior under Weapons Tight ROE and the other checkbox for enabling auto-defense behavior under the Weapons Free ROE. Selecting both would enable auto-defense under both ROEs.

I can vaguely see what you are getting at with this, but I believe that you are still being redundant.  If my side setting is Free, I expect everything to fire and the AI to have total control.  Therefore, a Free setting and no auto-defense just seems oxymoronic to me.

The same would be for the Tight setting and auto-defense enabled.   If I set the Weapons Tight for my side, I don't expect anything to fire (not even auto-defense).  I can understand how you might want to try and add nuance, but these kinds of things just confuse the AI, IMO, and the convolutions are bound to interfere with AI logic.



rsharp@advancedgamin -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (7/16/2009 12:53:06 AM)

So the feature was broke. Some changes to make it work with MP broke it for SP. However, it did not work for MP either. The new build (24) will have both fixed.

Your expectations are not unanimously held and so the auto-defense behavior is optional.



rsharp@advancedgamin -> RE: some questions about Beta 3.10 (8/4/2009 8:06:33 PM)

In chat Herman brought up the Weapons Tight not being so tight against hostile air targets so I took a second look. I confirmed the behavior and have a fix to tighten up Weapons Tight via the autodefend switch. There is still a possibility that hostile missiles will be engaged. Testing this further and will report on another thread.



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