House Rules - Why and What for...? (Full Version)

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treespider -> House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 12:53:02 PM)

What House rules are you using?

In addition to providng your rule please explain why you use that particular rule.

------

Przemek and I really only have 2 house rules and they both relate to the border issue.

1. Korean and Kwantung Army Units cannot leave unless PP are paid. I plan on modding the GC to permanently Restrict a number of the Artillery and support units to help prevent the wholesale evacuation of manchuria of these support units since they do not count much towards the garrison limt. Perhaps someday Garrison Requiements can will be fulfilled by Load Cost.

2. Thai Units stay in Thailand.

-----

So what House Rules are you using and why?



SuluSea -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 2:19:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider
Perhaps someday Garrison Requiements can will be fulfilled by Load Cost.


That would be fantastic!


quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider
So what House Rules are you using and why?


PPs to move restricted units across borders.
No 4E Bombers attacking naval vessels under 12,000 feet
No submarine invasions.
I'll invoke any rule on myself if I feel the force is not working as intended by the designers/ or if I think something is unfair to the other side case in point ; ships being withdrawn from on map bases or Aden/Abadan before the med opens, not saying it's wrong for everybody but I don't feel right withdrawing ships that way.



scott64 -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 3:35:57 PM)

No city bombing until 1944
Realistic Burma withdraw
No sub invasion
No unit fragment to cut off retreat
No naval 4E bombing under 10k
PP cost to move Kwantung Army Units
No Japs around the Allied incoming points from off map. 10 Hexes away.

[sm=00000028.gif][sm=00001746.gif][sm=Crazy-1271.gif]




treespider -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 3:44:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: scott1964

No city bombing until 1944
Realistic Burma withdraw
No sub invasion
No unit fragment to cut off retreat


With new ZoC rules and the fact that you are no longer pinned in a hex by the presence of enemy units...this little nugget isn't that necessary. Dispatch a portion of the defender into the fragments hex and punt it.

quote:



No naval 4E bombing under 10k
PP cost to move Kwantung Army Units
No Japs around the Allied incoming points from off map. 10 Hexes away.


How can you tell which hex is the incoming point from off-map?



jwilkerson -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 3:47:32 PM)

quote:



01 - Restricted command units must pay PP's to change to an unrestricted command cross national boundaries.
02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944
04 - May not use "supply draw" feature to suck supplies to China
05 - No allied non-Chinese LCU may enter China until 1944 and then only USA ENG and HQ.
06 - No city bombing of any kind prior to 7/43
07 - Surprise on, PDU ON, Historic/non-historic depending of Japanese team decsion.
08 - If Non historic Japanese have NO restrictions, Allies can move any already formed TF, change aircraft orders (but not move them), Allies can do anything in China (less HK)
09 -1 Day turns until end Jan then 2 day turns.
10 - Use of many small task forces in a given small area for the express purpose of “borking” the naval combat engine will be frowned upon.
11 - No more than one 4EB Group per airbase until 1944
12 - No more than 1 Additional div (3 RCT) and 1 Arty Regt (or 3 Bn) of combat troops can be sent to CBI until 1944. No restrictions on non cbt forces (Eng, AA, HQ).
13 - No night mission until 1944
14 - No more than one air unit flying a mine laying air mission per turn.
15 - Realistic factories.



Here are the house rules we are using in our 2x2 game with Nik and Joe playing Japan against jrcar and Tony Luke. Our game started on 1080 (latest and greatest version at time we started) and remains on that version currently. The anti-ASW rules may no longer be necessary, especially after patch 02.



treespider -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 3:53:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

quote:



01 - Restricted command units must pay PP's to change to an unrestricted command cross national boundaries.
02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944
04 - May not use "supply draw" feature to suck supplies to China
05 - No allied non-Chinese LCU may enter China until 1944 and then only USA ENG and HQ.
06 - No city bombing of any kind prior to 7/43
07 - Surprise on, PDU ON, Historic/non-historic depending of Japanese team decsion.
08 - If Non historic Japanese have NO restrictions, Allies can move any already formed TF, change aircraft orders (but not move them), Allies can do anything in China (less HK)
09 -1 Day turns until end Jan then 2 day turns.
10 - Use of many small task forces in a given small area for the express purpose of “borking” the naval combat engine will be frowned upon.
11 - No more than one 4EB Group per airbase until 1944
12 - No more than 1 Additional div (3 RCT) and 1 Arty Regt (or 3 Bn) of combat troops can be sent to CBI until 1944. No restrictions on non cbt forces (Eng, AA, HQ).
13 - No night mission until 1944
14 - No more than one air unit flying a mine laying air mission per turn.
15 - Realistic factories.



Here are the house rules we are using in our 2x2 game with Nik and Joe playing Japan against jrcar and Tony Luke. Our game started on 1080 (latest and greatest version at time we started) and remains on that version currently. The anti-ASW rules may no longer be necessary, especially after patch 02.



Can you explain #'s 4 and 12?[:)]



scott64 -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 4:20:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider


quote:

ORIGINAL: scott1964

No city bombing until 1944
Realistic Burma withdraw
No sub invasion
No unit fragment to cut off retreat


With new ZoC rules and the fact that you are no longer pinned in a hex by the presence of enemy units...this little nugget isn't that necessary. Dispatch a portion of the defender into the fragments hex and punt it.

quote:



No naval 4E bombing under 10k
PP cost to move Kwantung Army Units
No Japs around the Allied incoming points from off map. 10 Hexes away.


How can you tell which hex is the incoming point from off-map?

I am thinking the hexes where the units are in limbo...Example a task forces will head straight for Perth when they are ready. [8|]



jwilkerson -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 5:12:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

quote:



01 - Restricted command units must pay PP's to change to an unrestricted command cross national boundaries.
02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944
04 - May not use "supply draw" feature to suck supplies to China
05 - No allied non-Chinese LCU may enter China until 1944 and then only USA ENG and HQ.
06 - No city bombing of any kind prior to 7/43
07 - Surprise on, PDU ON, Historic/non-historic depending of Japanese team decsion.
08 - If Non historic Japanese have NO restrictions, Allies can move any already formed TF, change aircraft orders (but not move them), Allies can do anything in China (less HK)
09 -1 Day turns until end Jan then 2 day turns.
10 - Use of many small task forces in a given small area for the express purpose of “borking” the naval combat engine will be frowned upon.
11 - No more than one 4EB Group per airbase until 1944
12 - No more than 1 Additional div (3 RCT) and 1 Arty Regt (or 3 Bn) of combat troops can be sent to CBI until 1944. No restrictions on non cbt forces (Eng, AA, HQ).
13 - No night mission until 1944
14 - No more than one air unit flying a mine laying air mission per turn.
15 - Realistic factories.



Here are the house rules we are using in our 2x2 game with Nik and Joe playing Japan against jrcar and Tony Luke. Our game started on 1080 (latest and greatest version at time we started) and remains on that version currently. The anti-ASW rules may no longer be necessary, especially after patch 02.



Can you explain #'s 4 and 12?[:)]



04 - It is possible to use supply draw to suck supplies into China (from Assam through Burma) this rule says players should not try to assist such a process via use of the supply draw feature. We are trying to fix this for patch 02, but as of 1080 it was not fixed.

12 - Historically USA only sent one ground combat unit (regimental equivalent) to CBI. Our Allied team wanted to be able to exceed this limit, so we wrote a rule to cover such excess.





treespider -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 5:43:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson


quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

quote:



01 - Restricted command units must pay PP's to change to an unrestricted command cross national boundaries.
02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944
04 - May not use "supply draw" feature to suck supplies to China
05 - No allied non-Chinese LCU may enter China until 1944 and then only USA ENG and HQ.
06 - No city bombing of any kind prior to 7/43
07 - Surprise on, PDU ON, Historic/non-historic depending of Japanese team decsion.
08 - If Non historic Japanese have NO restrictions, Allies can move any already formed TF, change aircraft orders (but not move them), Allies can do anything in China (less HK)
09 -1 Day turns until end Jan then 2 day turns.
10 - Use of many small task forces in a given small area for the express purpose of “borking” the naval combat engine will be frowned upon.
11 - No more than one 4EB Group per airbase until 1944
12 - No more than 1 Additional div (3 RCT) and 1 Arty Regt (or 3 Bn) of combat troops can be sent to CBI until 1944. No restrictions on non cbt forces (Eng, AA, HQ).
13 - No night mission until 1944
14 - No more than one air unit flying a mine laying air mission per turn.
15 - Realistic factories.



Here are the house rules we are using in our 2x2 game with Nik and Joe playing Japan against jrcar and Tony Luke. Our game started on 1080 (latest and greatest version at time we started) and remains on that version currently. The anti-ASW rules may no longer be necessary, especially after patch 02.



Can you explain #'s 4 and 12?[:)]



04 - It is possible to use supply draw to suck supplies into China (from Assam through Burma) this rule says players should not try to assist such a process via use of the supply draw feature. We are trying to fix this for patch 02, but as of 1080 it was not fixed.

12 - Historically USA only sent one ground combat unit (regimental equivalent) to CBI. Our Allied team wanted to be able to exceed this limit, so we wrote a rule to cover such excess.






So 12 applies to US units ...and not Commonwealth correct?

Are the Japanese restricted by Rule 4 as well...for drawing supply out of Manchuria into China?



scott64 -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 6:05:05 PM)

How does one go about doing no4.[sm=innocent0009.gif]



Q-Ball -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 6:12:58 PM)

I hadn't thought about restrictions on US ground unit transfers. This makes sense though. I may add this both my PBEMs. The only house rules we have presently in both relate to restricted units crossing national borders.

Why no city bombing until 43/44?




pad152 -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 8:42:38 PM)

02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944

Huh, these two suprise me, why?





eMonticello -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/25/2009 10:09:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152
02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944

Huh, these two surprise me, why?

I can understand 03 since dedicated ASW surface groups didn't really exist in the Atlantic until 1944, but 02 might be problematic if the Japanese players decide to discard the Submarine Naval Doctrine. I think the only reason ASW patrols were not prevalent in the Pacific was the lack of available targets in the convoy routes, since there were plenty of ASW air patrols in the Atlantic in 1942.

http://www.combinedfleet.com/ss.htm

http://paul.rutgers.edu/~mcgrew/wwii/usaf/html/Apr.42.html



Sonny II -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 9:05:13 AM)

quote:

No sub invasion


With the limited amount of troops that can be loaded on subs is this really a problem anymore?



LeeChard -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 4:50:10 PM)

jwilkerson,I'm Curious about the ASW restrictions in your house rules. Does it apply to single ships or are you trying to prevent formation of multi ship hunter killer TF's?
Is the aircraft restriction based on history or is it for play balance?



Nikademus -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 5:28:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Ranger5355

jwilkerson,I'm Curious about the ASW restrictions in your house rules. Does it apply to single ships or are you trying to prevent formation of multi ship hunter killer TF's?
Is the aircraft restriction based on history or is it for play balance?


Pre-patch 2 ASW was overly powerful, particularily the air asw component. Joe was able to sink 35+ of my USN subs with it our last game.



Panther Bait -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 6:49:50 PM)

09 -1 Day turns until end Jan then 2 day turns

I didn't think you could change this during a PBEM game. If this is an AI game, why would you need house rules?



Nikademus -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 7:11:42 PM)

Joe's a Project manager and has special powers. [:D]

Its not an AI game. Its our game vs. those dasterdly whiskey swigin beer soaked Aussies.



treespider -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/26/2009 7:25:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

Its our game vs. those dasterdly whiskey swigin beer soaked Aussies.



[image]local://upfiles/15342/A4B04E9FFC6C47D68B34AD88B01758EC.gif[/image]



Jonathan Pollard -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 2:25:44 PM)

A major bone of contention in a multi-player PBEM game that never got off the ground was a proposed house rule prohibiting sailing past Singapore to invade the west coast of Malaya while Singapore was British-controlled.



treespider -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 2:54:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jonathan Pollard

A major bone of contention in a multi-player PBEM game that never got off the ground was a proposed house rule prohibiting sailing past Singapore to invade the west coast of Malaya while Singapore was British-controlled.



Little known fact - the Japanese can create barges at Georgetown after it is occupied.[;)]



herwin -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 2:58:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jonathan Pollard

A major bone of contention in a multi-player PBEM game that never got off the ground was a proposed house rule prohibiting sailing past Singapore to invade the west coast of Malaya while Singapore was British-controlled.


The Malacca Straits narrow to 1.5 nm at the Philips Channel, under the guns of the Naval Base. See this map at the appropriate scale.



Jonathan Pollard -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 3:25:49 PM)

Herwin, thanks for the map but it does not show ocean depth levels which leaves open the question as to whether the batteries could have been avoided by hugging the coast of Sumatra.



jwilkerson -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 3:54:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152

02 - No ASW air missions prior to 1944
03 - No ASW TF prior to 1944

Huh, these two suprise me, why?



In the 1079/1080 release ASW air missions and TF missions were too powerful, hencec we restricted their use. Actually, this is a long standing problem. I would use both of these house rules in stock games as well. The situation is a bit improved in 1085 and hopefully will be further improved for patch 02.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Ranger5355

jwilkerson,I'm Curious about the ASW restrictions in your house rules. Does it apply to single ships or are you trying to prevent formation of multi ship hunter killer TF's?
Is the aircraft restriction based on history or is it for play balance?


The restrictions are based on reduced the ASW capability of air units and surface TFs to a level closer to their historical capability, which has been inflated in the system since day one of WITP.



Q-Ball -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 4:24:53 PM)

Hey Joe, just curious....why no CITY ATTACKS early in the game? How does this unbalance play, I'm curious? [&:]

To prevent Japs from nuking China?



stldiver -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 4:33:56 PM)

Here is a House rule I believe is also mandatory, I had just tried it previous but appears deadly.

Dear opponents,

I am suggesting following HR: Patrol planes (Catalina, Emily, etc.) can attack only at night. The problem is as follows:

1. The probability of hit is enourmous - exceeding KB Kates!!! It gives about 80% hit rate when torpedo i sreleased.
2. The plane has two torpedoes, but game consider them as one - you have alwas double hit (sometimes dud, but anyway).
3. As patrol, they fly only against non-defended targets provide no escort is available. It means there is no way to defend ships afainst them. The sweep or airfield destruction is useless - they use water for taking off.
4. In IRL, they were never used in this role. They attacked only at night with radar - I remeber just one hit (Midway).
5. The most important - the planes are so effective, that they cause extremely unbalanced game (normal TB are useless compared to them).

One of you plays as Japan (and make serious loss to my shipping), one is enjoying the same from my side (I hit CVL I guess). Thus, as you see, I am in favor of the game - I will loose less in one game and destroy less in the other one. I would like to see your comments.

Best regardsTomik


I obviously believe in this rule, as my PBY's that turn sank two transports,



Nikademus -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (10/27/2009 4:57:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Hey Joe, just curious....why no CITY ATTACKS early in the game? How does this unbalance play, I'm curious? [&:]

To prevent Japs from nuking China?


City attacks are so ridiculously easy in WitP (since day one) that it would make a BTR/ED veteran cry tears of frustration.





Knavey -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (12/11/2009 3:11:22 AM)

JW,

How are these house rules working out now that we are in Patch 2 and you have a month or so under your belt of game time?



jwilkerson -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (12/11/2009 3:17:03 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

JW,

How are these house rules working out now that we are in Patch 2 and you have a month or so under your belt of game time?


Well - YOU might be in patch 2 - but our game is still in 1080 !!!

We are discussing "upgrade" to patch 2 - but probably won't happen for a week or so. I'm a software guy - and we aren't big on USING "upgrades" ... DOING them sure - USING them no !!! [:D]



Knavey -> RE: House Rules - Why and What for...? (12/11/2009 3:28:03 AM)

LOL! I guess its like the guy at the sausage factory who won't eat the product!



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