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KGrob -> I Need a Game (3/2/2010 12:34:37 AM)

I want to purchase and play a game and have a couple questions. I was playing a game from another company but it got so buggy that I'd really like to try some other product(s). I like grand strategy and complexity is a plus rather than a minus (grognard=good). But the game must work (be substantially bug free).



QUESTION: Any suggestions on a game?

The two games I've been looking at are War in the Pacific (Admirals Edition) and Battle of Britain/Bombing the Reich although I'd consider others.

Mainly, I want a game that works (substantially bug free), is fun, and is immersive. I'm a geek-dweeb grognard so the difficulty level is not a barrier. I normally play, say, 10 to 15 hours a week and handle all/most details myself (games take me months, sometimes to complete)...but that's just what is fun to me.


QUESTION: Can I even Play the game?

Computer System Concern

I also have a concern about my system since none of the games I'm looking at indicate they will run on Win 7...and since this would be very easy to change on the "stores" website, this concerns me. I certainly don't want to spend $50 to $80 only to find I can't even run the game. Actually, I find this very puzzling since most new computers come with Win 7. Again, if the products run on Win 7, why not just make a simple change to the game specs and let the entire world know??? Very odd.

Here's my system.

Win 7 64 Bit
AMD Phenom II Black Cat x4 955
8 gig of ram
Radeon EAH 4850


Thanks in advance for any suggestions.





KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 12:37:28 AM)

By the way, I played a couple Matrix games in the past (been many years now) but got away from them for various reasons.

Now that I'm on the market for some new entertainment, I notice many new title since I've last played a Matrix game.

Thus the questions.



bairdlander2 -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 1:09:47 AM)

i would suggest Arsenal of Democracy for grand strategy WW2 era.It also has battle scenarios such as Korean War and Arab israeli conflict.Pretty bug free and getting good reviews on forums.Its also very cheap only $20,where WitPAE is $80 and Im not sure but I think I paid $60 for EDtBtR.Also those 2 titles only cover one theatre of the world where AoD is global.



freeboy -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 3:06:53 AM)

AOD is a good non buggy game.. a little lite compared to others..
for HEAVY deap emersive there is no comparision to WITP AE, games are what we make of them.. this game take a great deal of time!!! hors to get going correctly.. on two or three day turns.. although there are some smaller scenarios the meat is the whole war scenarios.. dec 7 to war end



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 4:33:57 PM)

I like the sound of WitP AE so far...sounds like a good experience although it would probably take me a year to finish the game...but that is a good thing for me.

Many years ago I played "Bombing the Reich" and I enjoyed that quite a bit so I was thinking about getting that.

I played the HOI series. I have HOI2 and one of the expansions (Armageddon?...something like that.) Someone told me that AOD was something like that. I bought HOI3 when it came out but it seems pretty buggy to me...almost unplayable in many cases.

I'm continuing to look at the games out there. I'd like to get something within the next week or so but I just don't know what yet. I have some time off around the middle of March and it would be nice to have something in place and be at least a teenie bit familiar with it.

Thanks for your suggestions.

Keep 'em coming.



rickier65 -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 5:46:24 PM)

You might also want to look at Matrix's TOAW 3 and SSGs Battles in Italy, or SSG's Kharkov: Disaster on the Donets.

All three have a good bit of detail. TOAW 3 probably has the most content of the three, and Kharkov:Disaster on the Donets, the least. The two SSG games are more operational, so might not fit with what you're looking for.

Thanks
Rick



Knavery -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 6:09:17 PM)

It sounds like you're into WWII. Any specific theater you enjoy more? Out of all the games I've purchased from Matrix, I think the best bang for my buck is Advanced Tactics. There are a lot of user made scenarios and it's actually fun to play. I know TOAWIII has a lot of stuff. I just haven't fired that up and played yet. WWII:Time of Wrath is an enjoyable game as well, but not very complex.

Freeborn's comment about AoD being "lite" may be true in comparison to the other games you mentioned. But I can say that any HoI game is NOT lite by any means. It's pretty complex and has a higher learning curve.



freeboy -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 6:35:24 PM)

I liked battles in Italy andthat game and Yao3 have  a uge user made scenario dataase.. tao3 had what 500 scenarios? soemthing liekthat...
HOI2 is the same engive as AOD, BUT everything is tweeked.. and better... if that is a game you like, again very lite comparedto AE..
Let me give you an example.. I manage over 1000 ships as allies.. down to who is in command of waht sub doing what mission in what area...
I have a rutine.. then I look at action items for an area.. in my pbem game as allies we are playing a slightly moddified historical game, japs get a fewe more of everything..
we are one day turning it from Pearl Harbor on the 7th to end of war.. we are at September of 43. So my focus is on getting fuel and supplies out of the US into the areas I need it, moving troops forward to areas I will attack into.. and coordinating my lba bombing, invasion hexes, russply of same, building of same.. reacting to enemy in saem.. and then there is the cv war..
lots and lots of detail.. too much for me but I love the game inspite of its level of detail....
and did I say lots of detail????
If yo love figuring out the managemtn of what engine goes in what plane from what factory you can play the japs who have an open industry for those so inclined,,,

Bombing the Reich is combined with the war in 41? over England and you get both games for one price... it has been reported as very stable, as most older titles and since you palyed it before you already have an idea what is there..

Strategy only?
one game I found that is turn based small unit tactics with pausable real time battles in 3d environmetn that is truly amazing is Achtung Panzer.. I think still on early $16.95 pricing , should go up any day to 19.95. This is the most emersive game I have come accross in ages... and it will only get better as the dev's add content and add ons...
So.. if you want one game to sink you teath into and do not mind mind numbing details check out AE... but be forwarned it is super detailed....



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:00:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavery

It sounds like you're into WWII. Any specific theater you enjoy more? Out of all the games I've purchased from Matrix, I think the best bang for my buck is Advanced Tactics. There are a lot of user made scenarios and it's actually fun to play. I know TOAWIII has a lot of stuff. I just haven't fired that up and played yet. WWII:Time of Wrath is an enjoyable game as well, but not very complex.

Freeborn's comment about AoD being "lite" may be true in comparison to the other games you mentioned. But I can say that any HoI game is NOT lite by any means. It's pretty complex and has a higher learning curve.


It probably does seem like WWII is a biggie to me but really it could be any conflict. I really like the micromanagement aspect, logistics, all of it...the immersion. I like it when everything seems like it fits together well and I can really get into the spirit of things.

I think it's one part wanting to be king of the world and one part needing some brain stimulation.

I enjoyed HOI2, but so far HOI3 hasn't really done it for me.

I'll look into that Advanced Tactics. Thanks for the tip there.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:02:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rick

You might also want to look at Matrix's TOAW 3 and SSGs Battles in Italy, or SSG's Kharkov: Disaster on the Donets.

All three have a good bit of detail. TOAW 3 probably has the most content of the three, and Kharkov:Disaster on the Donets, the least. The two SSG games are more operational, so might not fit with what you're looking for.

Thanks
Rick



I wasn't even aware that there was an TOAW3. I can remember playing the original TOAW. That was a fun game and I got a lot out of that.

Thanks. I'll look at TOAW3.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:05:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freeboy

I liked battles in Italy andthat game and Yao3 have  a uge user made scenario dataase.. tao3 had what 500 scenarios? soemthing liekthat...
HOI2 is the same engive as AOD, BUT everything is tweeked.. and better... if that is a game you like, again very lite comparedto AE..
Let me give you an example.. I manage over 1000 ships as allies.. down to who is in command of waht sub doing what mission in what area...
I have a rutine.. then I look at action items for an area.. in my pbem game as allies we are playing a slightly moddified historical game, japs get a fewe more of everything..
we are one day turning it from Pearl Harbor on the 7th to end of war.. we are at September of 43. So my focus is on getting fuel and supplies out of the US into the areas I need it, moving troops forward to areas I will attack into.. and coordinating my lba bombing, invasion hexes, russply of same, building of same.. reacting to enemy in saem.. and then there is the cv war..
lots and lots of detail.. too much for me but I love the game inspite of its level of detail....
and did I say lots of detail????
If yo love figuring out the managemtn of what engine goes in what plane from what factory you can play the japs who have an open industry for those so inclined,,,

Bombing the Reich is combined with the war in 41? over England and you get both games for one price... it has been reported as very stable, as most older titles and since you palyed it before you already have an idea what is there..

Strategy only?
one game I found that is turn based small unit tactics with pausable real time battles in 3d environmetn that is truly amazing is Achtung Panzer.. I think still on early $16.95 pricing , should go up any day to 19.95. This is the most emersive game I have come accross in ages... and it will only get better as the dev's add content and add ons...
So.. if you want one game to sink you teath into and do not mind mind numbing details check out AE... but be forwarned it is super detailed....



Thanks so much for taking the time to go over all that. You make WitP/AE sound good but Achtung Panzer even seems interesting.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:08:58 PM)


Thanks guys. Wow. Great responses. And I thought reading a few responses here would make things easy for me. But instead of narrowing things down, you guys are going to make me do some research (that's actually a good thing that more possibilities exist than I realized).

I continue to welcome other thoughts. It'll be a few days before I decide. Probably Thursday or Friday.

Again, thanks.



Hertston -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:20:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob
Mainly, I want a game that works (substantially bug free), is fun, and is immersive. I'm a geek-dweeb grognard so the difficulty level is not a barrier. I normally play, say, 10 to 15 hours a week and handle all/most details myself (games take me months, sometimes to complete)...but that's just what is fun to me.


According to that description of yourself, WitP:AE is the obvious choice. Pricey, but like most things you get what you pay for.




Skeleton -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:22:30 PM)

I will second Rick's advice to take a look at SSG's titles. I think they have the depth you are looking for, but nowhere near WiTP AE, and at least for Battles in Italy, there are numerous user made scenarios that are excellent as well as immersive. Until Kharkov has some added content, I can't recommand that as $60 for a 16 turn game is steep imho. Good luck on your purchase and let us know what you end up getting!



Knavery -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:23:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob


Thanks guys. Wow. Great responses. And I thought reading a few responses here would make things easy for me. But instead of narrowing things down, you guys are going to make me do some research (that's actually a good thing that more possibilities exist than I realized).

I continue to welcome other thoughts. It'll be a few days before I decide. Probably Thursday or Friday.

Again, thanks.


Or you could buy them all like some of us do. Of course that's not wise. It's better to buy one game and immerse yourself than to buy a bunch and never play them.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:41:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob
Mainly, I want a game that works (substantially bug free), is fun, and is immersive. I'm a geek-dweeb grognard so the difficulty level is not a barrier. I normally play, say, 10 to 15 hours a week and handle all/most details myself (games take me months, sometimes to complete)...but that's just what is fun to me.


According to that description of yourself, WitP:AE is the obvious choice. Pricey, but like most things you get what you pay for.




My selection need not be the absolute most grognard-like experience. My main point, that I made rather poorly, was that complexity is in no way a barrier. I don't need it to be complex just for the sake of being complex. But my experience has been that (in general) the more complex games are normally more entertaining to me.

I'm still reading about some of the titles that were suggested above.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 10:44:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

I will second Rick's advice to take a look at SSG's titles. I think they have the depth you are looking for, but nowhere near WiTP AE, and at least for Battles in Italy, there are numerous user made scenarios that are excellent as well as immersive. Until Kharkov has some added content, I can't recommand that as $60 for a 16 turn game is steep imho. Good luck on your purchase and let us know what you end up getting!


I'm going to look up some of these. Thanks.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/2/2010 11:28:42 PM)

Question?

I remember playing a game (turn based, hexes) where I got to take a core group of my own units from scenario to scenario through a grandish sort of campaign.

I wish I could remember what game that was. It was fun though.

(Not the Panzer General series...I remember playing the original Panzer General...wow, that took up a lot of my time...years and years ago.)



martok -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 1:41:29 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob

I really like the micromanagement aspect, logistics, all of it...the immersion. I like it when everything seems like it fits together well and I can really get into the spirit of things.


If you wouldn't mind trying a setting other than WW2, you'd probably really enjoy Aurora, a free space 4x strategy game. It's a very deep game with plenty of micromanagement (especially in terms of combat and ship design), along with a robust logistics system. Definitely worth checking out if that's your "thing".




emcgman -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 3:07:31 AM)

Be sure to take a look at Advanced Tactics. The game design is brilliant, including production, research, etc. There are many additional scenarios available as well.

I also own TOAOW III, as well as SSG titles.

It's all good, but didnt want you to overlook AT, since it's huge, and includes production and research, but scenarion design is flexible and doesnt automatically have to include them.

ie; Scenarios can be designed to play much like SSG titles, without production and research, but with reinforcements, for example.



freeboy -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 3:24:39 AM)

ditto on advance tactics, great game.. BUT there will be a new version we think



E -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 5:30:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

I will second Rick's advice to take a look at SSG's titles. Until Kharkov has some added content, I can't recommand that as $60 for a 16 turn game is steep imho.


16 Turns? WOW! I didn't get it because it was a single battle. But only 16 turns as well? Whew! Glad I didn't impulse buy that one (and I've come close very many times)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob

Question?

I remember playing a game (turn based, hexes) where I got to take a core group of my own units from scenario to scenario through a grandish sort of campaign.

I wish I could remember what game that was. It was fun though.

(Not the Panzer General series...I remember playing the original Panzer General...wow, that took up a lot of my time...years and years ago.)


Steel Panthers? ...if so and your eyesight is still good, you can find the free version here. But if your eyes need some help, there's a version with higher resolution that isn't free, elsewhere (via Shrapnel Games' site. Shrapnel also has a free version (sans the higher resolution). MAtrix Free version and Shrapnel's free version are both based on different iterations of the original series, so they play differently. Try 'em both! (can't go too far wrong for free!)



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 6:15:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: emcgman

Be sure to take a look at Advanced Tactics. .....


How does AT compare to the game of Empire Deluxe (the latter versions). I have EDIE and it sounds similar although Empire Deluxe Internet Edition was fairly simple.



therockyfroggy -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 6:27:43 AM)

JUST GET WITP....seriously.....immersive, deep, long, detailed, grognardish. I have played it on both of my systems which are older than yours and it plays fine. I have WIN7 on both of my computers.

Seriously, if you havent played WITP, get it.....period.



Skeleton -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 12:10:02 PM)

Yes, though 16 turns is a bit deceptive in making it seem small. The map is absolutely huge as is the number of counters and with variants on the AO's, you actually get much more than 16 turns. I've played the game for a year before exhausting my enthusiasm. At the end of the day, it is still 16 turns with only a few, very small user made scenarios out there to date. My ability to gush and recommend will change once Across the Dneiper 2 (along with Husky and a couple of nice user made scenarios) is released as an expansion to Kharkov.



JudgeDredd -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 1:14:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: E

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

I will second Rick's advice to take a look at SSG's titles. Until Kharkov has some added content, I can't recommand that as $60 for a 16 turn game is steep imho.


16 Turns? WOW! I didn't get it because it was a single battle. But only 16 turns as well? Whew! Glad I didn't impulse buy that one (and I've come close very many times)


It is a great game. I was well pleased with the purchase.



TAIL GUNNER -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 1:26:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob

Question?

I remember playing a game (turn based, hexes) where I got to take a core group of my own units from scenario to scenario through a grandish sort of campaign.

I wish I could remember what game that was. It was fun though.

(Not the Panzer General series...I remember playing the original Panzer General...wow, that took up a lot of my time...years and years ago.)


East Front or West Front by Talonsoft, maybe?

Check it out:
John Tiller's Campaign Series



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 3:10:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper



Steel Panthers? ...if so and your eyesight is still good, you can find the free version here. But if your eyes need some help, there's a version with higher resolution that isn't free, elsewhere (via Shrapnel Games' site. Shrapnel also has a free version (sans the higher resolution). MAtrix Free version and Shrapnel's free version are both based on different iterations of the original series, so they play differently. Try 'em both! (can't go too far wrong for free!)


That might of been what I was thinking about in that post. I didn't even remember that game existed until you mentioned the name.

I'm actually an "older" grognard. I date back to the time of the original Avalon Hill boardgames. The only computers we saw back then were on television shows.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 3:13:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Juggalo

quote:

ORIGINAL: KGrob

Question?

I remember playing a game (turn based, hexes) where I got to take a core group of my own units from scenario to scenario through a grandish sort of campaign.

I wish I could remember what game that was. It was fun though.

(Not the Panzer General series...I remember playing the original Panzer General...wow, that took up a lot of my time...years and years ago.)


East Front or West Front by Talonsoft, maybe?

Check it out:
John Tiller's Campaign Series


I played those too. Wow. Lots of memories here. I played mostly board games until the original Panzer General came out. That was the game that made me realize there just might be a future in computer gaming. I wore out some brain cells (on me and my computer) playing that game.



KGrob -> RE: I Need a Game (3/3/2010 3:16:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: therockyfroggy

JUST GET WITP....seriously.....immersive, deep, long, detailed, grognardish. I have played it on both of my systems which are older than yours and it plays fine. I have WIN7 on both of my computers.

Seriously, if you havent played WITP, get it.....period.



I'll get something (or two) by Thursday or so. But, I need to tell you guys, reading through this thread is bringing back some great memories for me.

I'm going to hate to end it by buying a game.



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