Gun value (Full Version)

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Athius -> Gun value (3/16/2010 10:34:24 PM)

I have a question about gun value and attack strenght:

When determining if a plane hits and damages another, does it do so induvidualy for each weapon, or does it juist use the entire gun value?

For example : when I Tojo is firing at an enemy plane,does the game check the individual weapons, determines that only the 7.7's hit and that those are so weak that they don't do any damage OR does the game check if the plane hits and then uses the total gun value to calculate the damage done?





bklooste -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 3:02:30 AM)

Since huricanes are great ( with 8 small MGs) i suspect each weapon gets rolled seperately.



Misconduct -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 3:31:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Athius

I have a question about gun value and attack strenght:

When determining if a plane hits and damages another, does it do so induvidualy for each weapon, or does it juist use the entire gun value?

For example : when I Tojo is firing at an enemy plane,does the game check the individual weapons, determines that only the 7.7's hit and that those are so weak that they don't do any damage OR does the game check if the plane hits and then uses the total gun value to calculate the damage done?



I think it has to do with a calculation of Gun value and or damage strength vs armor, because some how it has to be calculated, because I know 7.7's do absolutely no damage to armored aircraft like P40s, however the hurricane for example as bklooste says - 8x303's on the other hand do pretty good damage to unarmored aircraft. Only problem I have is to determine is aircrafts like the Zero taking advantage of this being it carries only 2x20mm's with 60rpg, how does the calculation determine the amount of ammo? The ammo difference is only thing that ponders me, as I know the zero has 1,000 rounds of 7.7 and 120rounds of 20mm. Or is the ammo allowed not even calculated at all?



Mynok -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 3:41:52 AM)


My suspicion is that gun ammo isn't taken into consideration much if at all.



Athius -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 11:52:19 AM)

Well, If the game only looks at the total weapon value then that would mean that the Tojo becomens significantly better: Although the 12.7mm's are less acurate the 2 7.7's at 4 points to the total value and would thus make the plane much more deadly.


This wouldn't be the case is the game looks at the guns individually



bklooste -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 12:17:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Athius

Well, If the game only looks at the total weapon value then that would mean that the Tojo becomens significantly better: Although the 12.7mm's are less acurate the 2 7.7's at 4 points to the total value and would thus make the plane much more deadly.


This wouldn't be the case is the game looks at the guns individually


I suspct the Huricanes are so good because every gun gets a chance to hit..



treespider -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 1:59:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bklooste


quote:

ORIGINAL: Athius

Well, If the game only looks at the total weapon value then that would mean that the Tojo becomens significantly better: Although the 12.7mm's are less acurate the 2 7.7's at 4 points to the total value and would thus make the plane much more deadly.


This wouldn't be the case is the game looks at the guns individually


I suspct the Huricanes are so good because every gun gets a chance to hit..


At the office but IIRC the Hurricanes have 12 guns so even if aggregated I believe their gun value is a 24. Whereas a Zero with 2x20mm x4 =8 + 2x7.7mm x 2 = 4 = 12.



John Lansford -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 3:22:04 PM)

So a P-39, with the 37mm, two .30 cal and 2 .50 cal MG's, should be even better at dogfighting due to the gun values?  What about a P-61 with the 4 20mm and 4 .50 MG's?



Uamaga -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 4:15:25 PM)


In old WitP (I doubt much changed here in AE) results of shooting were evaluated in groups of all guns of same type type, having same direction. So in this case 2x12.7 will be "shooted" separately from 2x7.7 (even though they have same F(orward)-facing). Gunvalue was just rough approximation. When determining results code compared gun Accuracy against target distance, its (adjusted) Effect to target durability and its Penetration to target armor.
Speaking from memory: guns with Penetration lower then target armor had serious penalty applied to its adjusted effect, on the other hand with Penetration above Armor there was a chance of getting bonus effect (something modelling bullets passing through the target I guess).
So in general 7.7mm were pretty good when shooting to unarmored targets (esp. in bunch of 8 like in Hurricanes) but would be next useless against later well armored allied planes.



treespider -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 6:23:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

So a P-39, with the 37mm, two .30 cal and 2 .50 cal MG's, should be even better at dogfighting due to the gun values?  What about a P-61 with the 4 20mm and 4 .50 MG's?



That would be to suggest that the only thing that mattered was gun values...[8|]

You still have to factor in Pilot EXP & Skill as well as Plane Speed, MVR, & DUR...among other items.



Misconduct -> RE: Gun value (3/17/2010 8:12:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

So a P-39, with the 37mm, two .30 cal and 2 .50 cal MG's, should be even better at dogfighting due to the gun values?  What about a P-61 with the 4 20mm and 4 .50 MG's?


How does the current code value the 37mm? I know its hitting power is great but does it have anyway to calculate the chance for hitting a fighter or bomber? Clearly if the 37mm hits a bomber from a range of 1 then the damage can be extensive, however on a fighter the chances of that same range of 1 hit would be pretty slim.



String -> RE: Gun value (3/18/2010 7:05:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Misconduct


quote:

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

So a P-39, with the 37mm, two .30 cal and 2 .50 cal MG's, should be even better at dogfighting due to the gun values?  What about a P-61 with the 4 20mm and 4 .50 MG's?


How does the current code value the 37mm? I know its hitting power is great but does it have anyway to calculate the chance for hitting a fighter or bomber? Clearly if the 37mm hits a bomber from a range of 1 then the damage can be extensive, however on a fighter the chances of that same range of 1 hit would be pretty slim.



Well, each gun device has accuracy, and the accuracy of the 37mm (atleast the japanese one) is quite low.



Who Cares -> RE: Gun value (3/18/2010 2:13:11 PM)

True, but if it hits, it kills (usually).



John Lansford -> RE: Gun value (3/18/2010 4:52:02 PM)

All I know is that my P-39's are deadly anti-bomber interceptors, especially when the Bettys show up on antishipping missions (flying down where the P-39's are normally).   Against high elevation level bombers, not so much though.



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