Question on Shields (Full Version)

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Alex Gilbert -> Question on Shields (4/15/2010 11:54:09 PM)

I have been playing and enjoying the game, but while designing ships, I started looking for limitations on shields. I had assumed that they used energy at some rate which made loading up on them prohibitive. However, they have no effect on static energy use, and I have found nothing about how much energy they use on demand in combat. The only limitation on shields seems to be the actual size of the components (and the minimal drops in acceleration, max speed, and turning ability). This hardly seems to be much of a down-side, especially when designing bases (which neither move nor accelerate).

Does anyone know, is there some other limitation?



FerretStyle -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 12:25:37 AM)

Space monsters totally ignore them?



HsojVvad -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 12:43:04 AM)

I never noticed that the static energy didn't go up. I just assumed it. I will have to keep an eye on it. So far I have seen no limit to how much shields you can put on.

FerretStyle reminded me of something. I will have to make shure, for my monster killing ships, not to put on any shields, but just heavily armour them. I am assuming, armour is the first thing destroyed before any other components. I keep forgetting monsters ignore shields. I almost cried when my 300+ shields did nothing when being attacked by a monster.



Alex Gilbert -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 4:32:00 AM)

True, monsters ignore them, but they are very useful in battles against ships, and at the moment, I can't really think of a reason not to load up ships with 30+ shields to make them essentially invulnerable.

I definitely think there needs to be an energy cost to shields.



Fishman -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 4:46:22 AM)

Shields have no energy cost, they are entirely self-contained systems.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Davor

I never noticed that the static energy didn't go up. I just assumed it. I will have to keep an eye on it. So far I have seen no limit to how much shields you can put on.
Well, the limit to how many shields you can put on is defined by how much you want your ship to cost and how big you want it to get. Shields are pretty sizeable pieces of equipment.



Pocus -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 7:09:50 AM)

I have a strange behavior though... When my 720 shield-points cruisers start to fire, they immediatly drop to 420 points, so here I assumed that the energy load from the fire prevented all the shields to be powered up? Or is it a bug of sort?



Cindar -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 7:17:46 AM)

Yeah, until you reach the super shipyards the main problem with shields is that you simply don't have much room to go overboard with them, keeping in mind that you also have to add more thrusters to keep moving at the same speed, which requires more reactors, which requires more fuel, etc.

It does become a bit ridiculous when every ship you build can run around with more shields then a station, though. Unfortunately, the AI doesn't seem to understand how to take full advantage of custom ship designs and make truly powerful ships.



Fishman -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 8:01:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cindar

It does become a bit ridiculous when every ship you build can run around with more shields then a station, though.
Why does every ship you can build run around with more shields than a station? Stations have absolutely no size constraints. If I want to make a station with over 9000 size, half of it shielding, I can. What's more, the station has no engines, and therefore, I will not have to add compensatory components to avoid harming its other attributes: Shields can be added to a station ad-nauseam in a vacuum. If your ships have more shields than a station, this only occurs because you CHOOSE to make stations that are light on shields, perhaps because something that cannot actually move is unlikely to get into a fight.



Bloodly -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 10:02:58 AM)

Stations have absolutely no size constraints.

When at a colony. Stations not at a colony(research base, resort base, defence base, deep space, etc.) do have size restrictions, but their limit is far higher(As an example, at game start, ships are 200, bases are 550.)

The sizes made by default by the game are not the be-all and end-all. You can have a 'small' starbase be better equipped than a 'Medium' or 'Large' starbase. The freedom is nice, but it also screws with the standard thinking.




Astorax -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 10:54:49 AM)

Well, you can also build a max size 200 Escort at game start, make a size 800 Mk2 version and retro fit it on the first day its out of the oven thus neatly bypassing any shipyard size constraints the game throws at you.  In my most recent game I scrapped all my starting ships, made a size 200 cap ship and retrofitted it to about 350-ish while still having the SY-100 component. I'm pretty certain you could do the same for a base if you can retrofit it at all though I'm not sure thats possible except for a space port. 



Fishman -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 11:27:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bloodly

When at a colony. Stations not at a colony(research base, resort base, defence base, deep space, etc.) do have size restrictions, but their limit is far higher(As an example, at game start, ships are 200, bases are 550.)
Okay, 600, but point. The size limit on a noncolonial station is 3x that of a ship of the same tech.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bloodly

The sizes made by default by the game are not the be-all and end-all. You can have a 'small' starbase be better equipped than a 'Medium' or 'Large' starbase. The freedom is nice, but it also screws with the standard thinking.
Well, it screws with the thinking when you compare two separate modes of thinking to each other, as there is no rule enforcing the similarity of such thinking, anyway.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Astorax

Well, you can also build a max size 200 Escort at game start, make a size 800 Mk2 version and retro fit it on the first day its out of the oven thus neatly bypassing any shipyard size constraints the game throws at you.
Yeah, but we're going to classify this as an "exploit" and not count on it as part of legitimate gameplay, because you have to figure this is going to get stabbed in the face at some point.



Erik Rutins -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 1:38:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pocus
I have a strange behavior though... When my 720 shield-points cruisers start to fire, they immediatly drop to 420 points, so here I assumed that the energy load from the fire prevented all the shields to be powered up? Or is it a bug of sort?


I haven't seen this in action - were your shields fully charged up before combat?



Cindar -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 3:38:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fishman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cindar

It does become a bit ridiculous when every ship you build can run around with more shields then a station, though.
Why does every ship you can build run around with more shields than a station? Stations have absolutely no size constraints. If I want to make a station with over 9000 size, half of it shielding, I can. What's more, the station has no engines, and therefore, I will not have to add compensatory components to avoid harming its other attributes: Shields can be added to a station ad-nauseam in a vacuum. If your ships have more shields than a station, this only occurs because you CHOOSE to make stations that are light on shields, perhaps because something that cannot actually move is unlikely to get into a fight.


I should clarify: my ships have more shields then the standard stations that the AI builds.



Fishman -> RE: Question on Shields (4/16/2010 7:19:52 PM)

That is normal. The AI tends to use technologically backwards designs. My garbage barges have more shields than his bases do.



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